Ottawa's bid for Amazon HQ2

[YOWetal]

Originally Posted by bikegypsy

Just curious about this... Isn't Montreal the cheapest big city in Canada?... I lived in both and in several neighborhoods and I can't see where Mtl is more expensive... Definitely not in terms of housing at the very least.

Yeah I tend to agree. Taxes maybe?

[1overcosc]

Originally Posted by kwoldtimer

Dumb question perhaps, but does the Ottawa bid have the blessing/support of the NCC?

Its Amazon. If we did actually win, the feds sure as hell wouldn't let them stand in the way.

[kwoldtimer]

Originally Posted by 1overcosc

Its Amazon. If we did actually win, the feds sure as hell wouldn't let them stand in the way.

Exactly. When I saw the Ottawa proposal, I had a mental image of the NCC (and its plans for the Flats) on bended knee before Amazon's development plans. I confess that it made me smile.

[acottawa]

Originally Posted by bikegypsy

Just curious about this... Isn't Montreal the cheapest big city in Canada?... I lived in both and in several neighborhoods and I can't see where Mtl is more expensive... Definitely not in terms of housing at the very least.

The mercer index ranks ottawa cheaper than Montreal.

https://www.mercer.ca/en/newsroom/cost-of-living-2017.html

The grain of salt with the mercer index is they measure an "expat" lifestyle.

[YOWetal]

Originally Posted by acottawa

The mercer index ranks ottawa cheaper than Montreal.

https://www.mercer.ca/en/newsroom/cost-of-living-2017.html

The grain of salt with the mercer index is they measure an "expat" lifestyle.

Hotels are probably more expensive in Montreal and parking costs. Sales tax is higher so clothes and the like will be a bit more expensive.

Also if you pick the 10 best restaurants in both cities Montreal will probably be more expensive. However, if you compare like quality Montreal comes out much cheaper.

[bikegypsy]

Originally Posted by acottawa

The mercer index ranks ottawa cheaper than Montreal.

https://www.mercer.ca/en/newsroom/cost-of-living-2017.html

The grain of salt with the mercer index is they measure an "expat" lifestyle.

Thanks. This list only makes sense if we factor in the salaries, which the article doesn't mention. How are Mumbai, Dhaka, Manila and Bangkok more expensive than Vancouver and Toronto or even Luxembourg and Brussels? Incomes in these cities -- even for expats -- are relatively low, which makes one's buying power weaker thus making life more expensive, especially when one is trying to maintain a western type lifestyle. In Mumbai or Manila, $1000 rent will get you a 3 bedroom furnished luxury condo with a pool, gym and 24h security.... You get a hole in a wall for that price here. I took a friend out for dinner recently at a great Indian restaurant in Bangkok.... $30 for 2 including a bottle of wine. Let's note that the average restaurant meal in those cities is less than $2. This list and the way it's presented is extraordinarily misleading.

[YOWetal]

Originally Posted by bikegypsy

Thanks. This list only makes sense if we factor in the salaries, which the article doesn't mention. How are Mumbai, Dhaka, Manila and Bangkok more expensive than Vancouver and Toronto or even Luxembourg and Brussels? Incomes in these cities -- even for expats -- are relatively low, which makes one's buying power weaker thus making life more expensive, especially when one is trying to maintain a western type lifestyle. In Mumbai or Manila, $1000 rent will get you a 3 bedroom furnished luxury condo with a pool, gym and 24h security.... You get a hole in a wall for that price here. I took a friend out for dinner recently at a great Indian restaurant in Bangkok.... $30 for 2 including a bottle of wine. Let's note that the average restaurant meal in those cities is less than $2. This list and the way it's presented is extraordinarily misleading.

No it doesn't factor in salaries but considers an expat lifestyle as they define it. This means living, eating and schooling are up to "European Standards". For example try to go for a steak dinner in any of these Asian cities and it will cost much more than Toronto. The meat will be imported from the US, Australia. Same story with rent for high quality housing which is generally very expensive in developing countries.

Gasoline is a big percentage of the cost of living indexes and is substantially more expensive in Montreal that might be the difference on its own.

Accurate or not it is taken serious by companies during relocation, though in North America they may do their own assessment as life is easily comparable.

[acottawa]

Originally Posted by bikegypsy

Thanks. This list only makes sense if we factor in the salaries, which the article doesn't mention. How are Mumbai, Dhaka, Manila and Bangkok more expensive than Vancouver and Toronto or even Luxembourg and Brussels? Incomes in these cities -- even for expats -- are relatively low, which makes one's buying power weaker thus making life more expensive, especially when one is trying to maintain a western type lifestyle. In Mumbai or Manila, $1000 rent will get you a 3 bedroom furnished luxury condo with a pool, gym and 24h security.... You get a hole in a wall for that price here. I took a friend out for dinner recently at a great Indian restaurant in Bangkok.... $30 for 2 including a bottle of wine. Let's note that the average restaurant meal in those cities is less than $2. This list and the way it's presented is extraordinarily misleading.

Security is a big cost, as is cost of schooling and medical care. In general cities where expat living is similar to local living the costs will be lower even if those cities have higher costs for specific items.

But, also this type of index leads to some silliness. Prices are compared against a standard basket of goods, so if the Mercer person goes into an Italian supermarket looking for yellow mustard, peanut butter, basmati rice or soy sauce they are going to walk away with a higher cost then if they bought goods popular locally.

[rocketphish]

Amazon receives 238 proposals for second headquarters

By Jonathan O'Connell, The Washington Post
October 23 at 11:40 AM

The tally is in: Amazon received 238 proposals from cities, states, districts and territories interested in becoming home to the company’s second headquarters.

The online retail giant published a map Monday showing that bids came from D.C. and all but seven states — Arkansas, Hawaii, Montana, North Dakota, South Dakota, Vermont and Wyoming — as well as from most of southern Canada, three regions of Mexico and Puerto Rico.

Last month, Amazon announced that it wanted to open a second North American headquarters, setting off a scramble among economic development officials from the United States, Canada and Mexico eager for as many as 50,000 jobs and $5 billion in investment the company says it plans to make in another city.

Seattle-based Amazon and its founder, Jeffrey P. Bezos, who owns The Washington Post, began the search for “HQ2? by publishing its criteria online. Bezos issued a statement saying he expected the new location “to be a full equal to our Seattle headquarters. Amazon HQ2 will bring billions of dollars in upfront and ongoing investments, and tens of thousands of high-paying jobs. We’re excited to find a second home.”

If Amazon fulfills its plan to add 50,000 jobs and 8 million square feet of office space in another city, it will amount to the largest corporate move in decades, although the company plans to maintain its current Seattle headquarters. Some governors and mayors have already begun floating subsidies of as much as $7 billion while others have filmed online videos or launched marketing campaigns aligned with their bids. On the day bids were due, Oct. 19, buildings around New York City were lit orange to match the company’s logo.

The next step is for Amazon’s real estate team to sort through the bids and decide which proposals to consider more closely. It plans to make a decision early next year.

However, urban policy analysts have warned that jurisdictions ought to tread lightly when offering single corporations large subsidies, arguing that investing in workforce, education and transportation tends to be a better bet for economic growth. To accommodate the company’s growth in Seattle, taxpayers funded hundreds of millions of dollars in improvements, although Amazon directly contributed $30 billion to the local economy.

Affordable-housing advocates point to spikes in rents in Seattle as evidence that bidding cities ought to prepare for rising housing costs if Amazon decides to locate thousands of highly paid employees there.

Follow Jonathan O’Connell on Twitter: @oconnellpostbiz

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/busi...s-238-proposals-for-second-headquarters/

[DubberDom]

Ottawa proposal - Lebreton Flats!
http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/ottawa/lebreton-flats-ottawa-amazon-bid-video-1.4366701

I think video is well done, it really sums up why I like living in this city and how Lebreton is a transformational project that will help us grow into the 21st century. Video is very Millennial-focused, which is bang on... pretty much sums up why I choose to live here and wish to stay here even though I have a job that I can move anywhere in North America to do.

I think they are missing 2 important things (probably more... but that's what caught my eye)
1) Ottawa is home to one of the World's best Cyber Security organization - CSE. great talent pool to partner with
2) Ottawa is bilingual (and getting more multicultural) - I would focus more on that as well

[J.OT13]

Originally Posted by 1overcosc

Huh. That makes it very clear Ottawa's bid is intent on putting Amazon in the Lebreton-Bayview-Zibi area. I'm glad we didn't try to sell them some ridiculous parcel out in Barrhaven or something.

That was my biggest fear. I'm really happy they went with the most logical choice of location instead of trying to "buy" votes (hey Orleans, look who we're trying to attract in your area!) or spread the jobs around.

I think the team gave us the best possible chance, which admittedly is still a long shot.

[Vixx]

Yeah pretty good video. I liked how they emphasized Lebreton as an ideal location for HQ2, but as was said in the article, the city pitched several other parcels of land, some of which are in the suburbs.

No doubt we are a long shot, but honestly I could see Ottawa be on the shortlist, which would be a great accomplishment.

[mykl]

I am very impressed with that video! It makes me feel like we have an underdog chance, and I will have hope until a decision is made.

[Buggys]

I don't understand what patch of Lebreton Flats might be available to Amazon. Didn't NCC already enter into negotiations to transfer the last piece of Lebreton Flats to the Senators' consortium ?

[Harley613]

Originally Posted by Buggys

I don't understand what patch of Lebreton Flats might be available to Amazon. Didn't NCC already enter into negotiations to transfer the last piece of Lebreton Flats to the Senators' consortium ?

Wouldn't the Senators consortium welcome Amazon with open arms? That would finance everything else they want to build and instantly sell out all of the planned condominiums, no? I imagine the development would be built out with extreme multi-use and at a far higher density, but still compatible with their vision.

[Buggys]

Thanks Harley613. That makes a lot of sense.

Pimping out Lebreton Flats seems like a good move for Ottawa to compete. Our closest competitors are probably Toronto & Montreal. We might not be as populous as them now, but the Lebreton development would give Amazon space to grow in a way that Seattle probably never had & TO/MTL cannot. Our workforce is just as educated & techy, and is somewhat bilingual while there isn't a restrictive language law. Also, there'll be plenty of opportunities for them to hobnob with government folks to help get big contracts.

[acottawa]

I'm a little concerned the video didn't really identify many business reasons for coming to Ottawa-Gatineau. The drone footage and aspirational renders are nice but dozens of the 238 candidate cities will also have impressive drone footage.

[1overcosc]

The Lebreton plans the Sens presented don't have nearly enough office space to meet Amazon's needs (only 2.4 million square feet, whereas they want 8 million). However, the Sens could adjust their density upwards if they knew they could get that space rented; the reason why they presented 2.4 million in the first place instead of 4 million was because they likely calculated 2.4 million is the most that could be absorbed into the market over their proposed development timeframe. Trinity could also change their planned massive tower complex at Bayview from residential rentals to office (which they would be more than happy to do as it's more profitable for them), up the heights back to their original plan, and that's another 1.5 million or so right there. If you add in Zibi (possibly with a bit of a density boost there too), and gave Amazon the greenlight to redevelop the City Centre Complex and Tom Brown Arena (the latter would be a hard sell to the public, but with a new community arena being built by the Sens in Lebreton it should be alright), that should be enough to hit 8 million.

The influx of workers, many of them millennials from outside the city who would seek to be able to walk to work once they moved here, would in turn allow nearly all the condo projects to sell out. The extra boost in population and workers would also attract enough retailers to lease out all the retail spaces too. With such intense demand and a tenant as deep-pocketed as Amazon, the Sens, Trinity, and Windmill would be more than happy to play along. HQ2 is the perfect chance to get this whole area "finished" very quickly. If we won it could all be done by 2025 (IIRC, that's about the timeframe Amazon is looking for to have its HQ2 at full build out). Whereas without it, filling up the whole area will likely not be complete until around 2040-2050.

[Truenorth00]

Originally Posted by acottawa

I'm a little concerned the video didn't really identify many business reasons for coming to Ottawa-Gatineau. The drone footage and aspirational renders are nice but dozens of the 238 candidate cities will also have impressive drone footage.

The videos mean squat. What matters are what was in the detailed proposal submitted.

And given that Canada and Ontario didn't offer much in terms of tax incentives (which Amazon specifically stated was required), we don't stand a chance. And that's above and beyond the fact that creating 50 000 jobs outside the US would be an absolutely massive PR challenge for them as opposed to how they would be hailed as heroes for creating 50k jobs in the US. Oh, there's also that little tidbit of how CCRA enforces a $20 de minimis which really hurts Amazon's business model in Canada.

We face extremely long odds. And it's a pity. I have been to many of the top "contender" cities. And I think Ottawa with LeBreton Flats is actually better than most of the rest. Arguably the only area Ottawa is weak on are top name universities and international air connections. But the latter can be fixed with a high speed rail connection to Dorval. And arguably staying in Canada, could help retain Waterloo and Toronto grads, and make it easier to bring in foreign talent.

Most business analysts say corporate relocations are best indicated by personal ties. And that means, it's going to Austin. Bezos has lots of ties to Texas.

Will be interesting to see if any Canadian city makes the shortlist. But if that happens, Ottawa would really have a shot.

[rocketphish]

In wooing Amazon, Ottawa makes one list – 'most desperate stunts'

Megan Gillis, Ottawa Citizen
Published on: October 24, 2017 | Last Updated: October 24, 2017 11:29 AM EDT


https://twitter.com/Jyrki21/status/920451152621244417/photo/1

Ottawa has made at least one list in its bid to land the new Amazon headquarters.

Too bad it’s Vanity Fair’s roundup of the dozen most “desperate stunts” that cities have pulled to catch the online retail giant’s eye.

The Manhattan-based mag picked up a tweet from an alert Ottawan reporting that Sens fans were invited to “make noise for Amazon” at a recent home game against the Vancouver Canucks.

By all accounts, the response was “tepid.”

Vanity Fair notes that since Amazon announced it was on the hunt for a city to host its second headquarters in a move that could be worth 50,000 jobs and $5 billion in investment, the company reportedly got more than 200 proposals from more than 54 would-be hosts across the continent.

GeekWire got in on the action, too, reporting that “by the 13:47 mark of the second period, they were being asked to cheer against not only Vancouver, but Calgary, Edmonton and Toronto, too” as the video screen flashed the message.

Take heart – we could be more embarrassing.

The Dallas News made CEO Jeff Bezos a Spotify playlist, like some lovestruck teenager.

“Wanna go on a date?” Birmingham, Alabama tweeted.

Tucson-area business leaders tried to send Bezos a 21-foot tall cactus. He declined.

http://ottawacitizen.com/news/local-news...awa-makes-one-list-most-desperate-stunts