National Holocaust Monument | Completed

[Radster]

Originally Posted by rocketphish

National Holocaust Monument unveiled in downtown Ottawa

Andrew Duffy, Ottawa Citizen
Published on: September 27, 2017 | Last Updated: September 27, 2017 6:53 PM EDT

[The Holocaust involved the systematic, state-sponsored murder of six million Jews by the Nazis, who believed Jews were inferior to Germans and represented a threat to Aryan racial purity. Other victims of the Holocaust included Roma, homosexuals and the physically and mentally disabled.


http://ottawacitizen.com/news/local-news/national-holocaust-monument-unveiled-in-downtown-ottawa

When will the media learn to include Soviet POWs and Ethnic Poles as other significant victims killed during the Holocaust? The combined death toll of those 2 groups is over 4 million! Which brings me to my next question, does the Holocaust monument also mention those two groups?

[acottawa]

Originally Posted by Radster

When will the media learn to include Soviet POWs and Ethnic Poles as other significant victims killed during the Holocaust? The combined death toll of those 2 groups is over 4 million! Which brings me to my next question, does the Holocaust monument also mention those two groups?

The term "holocaust" is usually applied specifically to the attempt by Nazi Germany to murder the entire Jewish population of Europe.

Yes there were lots of victims of the Third Reich, including Roma, other civilians in occupied countries, POWs, members of the LGBT community, political prisoners, Jehovah's Witnesses, the disabled, the mentally ill, etc. And there were other victims of other things. That doesn't mean that every monument has to include every victim.

Wikipedia has a good quote on the issue.
Thus although the Nazi 'Final Solution' was one genocide among many, it had features that made it stand out from all the rest as well. Unlike all the others it was bounded neither by space nor by time. It was launched not against a local or regional obstacle, but at a world-enemy seen as operating on a global scale. It was bound to an even larger plan of racial reordering and reconstruction involving further genocidal killing on an almost unimaginable scale, aimed, however, at clearing the way in a particular region – Eastern Europe – for a further struggle against the Jews and those the Nazis regarded as their puppets. It was set in motion by ideologues who saw world history in racial terms. It was, in part, carried out by industrial methods. These things all make it unique.

— Richard Evans, The Third Reich in History and Memory

[mykl]

Originally Posted by Admiral Nelson

something can be solemn and respectful without being massive and ugly.

You thinking its ugly doesn't mean its ugly. But you're welcome to your opinion.

[Admiral Nelson]

Originally Posted by mykl

You thinking its ugly doesn't mean its ugly. But you're welcome to your opinion.

Sure, but you seemed to imply that being bleak and cold was an important feature. When I think bleak, I think ugly.

Originally Posted by mykl

I'm really confused why big and bleak and cold and bland are BAD things when wanting people to consider the sheer monstrosity and bleakness of what the monument represents.

Anyway, I'll revisit my opinion when I tour inside the site myself, I've so far only seen the outside.

[Harley613]

I visited today. I am not impressed at all. I tried very hard to 'feel something' but the structure is too simple, too barren, and too boring to make an impression. The art on the concrete was very cool though. I have been to the Holocaust Museum in Berlin and I FELT SOMETHING the entire time I was there, it was very very powerful.

[IMG]IMG_5748-Edit by harley613, on Flickr[/IMG]
[IMG]IMG_5766-Edit by harley613, on Flickr[/IMG]

[Kitchissippi]

I went to see the site as well and my impression, as with most of Daniel Libeskind's work, is that it's first and foremost an architectural exercise and whatever it's supposed to be second, kind of like the ROM. Without the labels and content the spaces didn't really leave me with an emotion. The place could be anything — an outdoor gallery, an LRT entrance, a restaurant patio — if it weren't for the solemn purpose it would be a chic spot for a party. The images that took up entire walls are good, the others look randomly applied like the space wasn't specifically designed for them. The utilitarian elements (call boxes, shut off valve for the flame, etc.) I found distracting, they are bandaids for a stubborn design vision. The elevator in particular seems like an extravagant detail just to compensate for getting up to a forced viewpoint of the Peace Tower — even the trees were obviously notched to achieve it. In fact a ramp instead of a stairway could have allowed viewers to remain focused on the distant tower instead of having to watch the oddly spaced steps during the procession up.

Too much "starchitecture", not enough words from the survivors themselves.

[rocketphish]

Originally Posted by Harley613

[IMG]IMG_5766-Edit by harley613, on Flickr[/IMG]

This second shot demonstrates very well how this new bleak concrete structure, with a remarkably similar prow shape to the museum behind it, will be assumed by some as just being an extension of the museum itself.

[1overcosc]

We should have gone with something more intimately scaled and ideally, in a location more connected to the city's Jewish history, like uptown Rideau.

[passwordisnt123]

This whole thing is a monstrosity. It should have been something elegant and human scaled near the Human Rights Museum in Winnipeg or, failing that, in another location like uptown Rideau, as 1overcosc mentions.

There are many reasons to be unimpressed with this thing, but the thing that's really awful about it is that we built this monument in the middle of what three different are trying desperately to make into the new entertainment district of the city. Between the Confederation Line, Lebreton Flats and Zibi, those three developments represent a $6.8 billion investment in making that part of the city lively and exciting and fun. What do the tories and liberals decide to do there? Plop this brutalist monstrosity right in the middle like a giant pimple right in the middle of an otherwise unblemished face on prom night.

[TMA-1]

In a city where *everything* looks good from the air the monument would have been better left as a construction site. Maybe it's not finished? RedCloudAerials has a nice shot from directly above and admittedly it is pretty from directly overhead.



D823031 lebreton flats by Chuck Clark, on Flickr

[acottawa]

Originally Posted by passwordisnt123

This whole thing is a monstrosity. It should have been something elegant and human scaled near the Human Rights Museum in Winnipeg or, failing that, in another location like uptown Rideau, as 1overcosc mentions.

There are many reasons to be unimpressed with this thing, but the thing that's really awful about it is that we built this monument in the middle of what three different are trying desperately to make into the new entertainment district of the city. Between the Confederation Line, Lebreton Flats and Zibi, those three developments represent a $6.8 billion investment in making that part of the city lively and exciting and fun. What do the tories and liberals decide to do there? Plop this brutalist monstrosity right in the middle like a giant pimple right in the middle of an otherwise unblemished face on prom night.

It isn't anywhere near any planned entertainment district. Its immediate neighbours are a somber war museum, a somber firefighter memorial, some boring planned office buildings in the Senators proposal' and some butt-ugly claridge condos.

[Harley613]

I'm just surprised that Daniel Libeskind, who designed the utterly brilliant Jewish Museum in Berlin, designed this thing. As I said, I'm not impressed by this monument, but it's not a terrible design. It's the execution that bothers me. There should be texture in materials, not acres of blank concrete walls. The art on the concrete is amazing but the structure as a whole is underwhelming and frankly a boring place to be. A monument needs to engage the visitor and inspire thought.

[AndyMEng]

Originally Posted by Harley613

I'm just surprised that Daniel Libeskind, who designed the utterly brilliant Jewish Museum in Berlin, designed this thing. As I said, I'm not impressed by this monument, but it's not a terrible design. It's the execution that bothers me. There should be texture in materials, not acres of blank concrete walls. The art on the concrete is amazing but the structure as a whole is underwhelming and frankly a boring place to be. A monument needs to engage the visitor and inspire thought.

Its actually quite interesting that people are talking about museums and monuments. I think Libeskind has blurred those lines, creating a monument that reads like a museum. One is directed to the 'Main Entrance' when approaching from all sides. You descend into the 'Monument' from the north-west 'main entrance', and travel across the site, viewing several cheap information boards, the wall-art, and then a space for reflection, before you head up the stairs and then down the stairs through the 'exit' to the street again. Unless you're in a wheelchair, then you head down the main entrance, up the elevator, then back down the elevator and back out the main entrance.

Its a neat piece of architecture, and I welcome public architecture in our city, however I'm not sure it can be called a 'monument'. Its a roofless museum building, with amazing lighting at night.

[kwoldtimer]

Originally Posted by AndyMEng

Its actually quite interesting that people are talking about museums and monuments. I think Libeskind has blurred those lines, creating a monument that reads like a museum. One is directed to the 'Main Entrance' when approaching from all sides. You descend into the 'Monument' from the north-west 'main entrance', and travel across the site, viewing several cheap information boards, the wall-art, and then a space for reflection, before you head up the stairs and then down the stairs through the 'exit' to the street again. Unless you're in a wheelchair, then you head down the main entrance, up the elevator, then back down the elevator and back out the main entrance.

Its a neat piece of architecture, and I welcome public architecture in our city, however I'm not sure it can be called a 'monument'. Its a roofless museum building, with amazing lighting at night.

Good observation. I visited it on Sunday and was struck by the feeling of "outdoor rooms". The information panels also take it in the direction of a museum rather than something purely monumental, istm. I found it very impressive as a structure, although perhaps better from within than when viewed from the outside. I'll look forward to visiting again at night.

[AndyMEng]

Originally Posted by kwoldtimer

Good observation. I visited it on Sunday and was struck by the feeling of "outdoor rooms". The information panels also take it in the direction of a museum rather than something purely monumental, istm. I found it very impressive as a structure, although perhaps better from within than when viewed from the outside. I'll look forward to visiting again at night.

In a distopian future when there isn't a mall security guard, the 'outdoor rooms' should prove handy for living al fresco. I noted one section in particular you could just hang a sheet and urban camp in the nook.

[rocketphish]

Holocaust Monument meant to provide space for reflection
Landscape designer said monument needed space for reflection.

By: Ryan Tumilty, Metro
Published on Sun Oct 01 2017



With the traffic of both Booth and Wellington Streets nearby, Canada’s National Holocaust Memorial needed shelter for reflection and Claude Cormier aimed to provide it.

Cormier was the landscape architect on the National Holocaust Memorial that opened last week at the corner of those two busy streets.

Cormier was part of a team that included architect Daniel Libeskind and several other players to create the right space for reflection. He said that’s why monument is below street level.

“When you descend into a space somehow the context around you disappears and you become emerged in the Holocaust reality,” he said. “You descended into the monument and the landscaping is actually ascending towards the sky.”

Cormier said the landscaping around the monument is meant to be minimalist, with no large trees or flowers just small shrubs so the monument itself is the star.

“It’s not making it beautiful, but it’s creating a context for where the monument sits.”

Canada was among the last major Western countries to get a Holocaust monument. The plan to build it began in 2011 with a private member’s bill that passed just before the election.

Cormier said he hopes people appreciate the monument, and hopes it adds to the character of Ottawa.

“It will certainly be an added element to the City of Ottawa, as an element people will want to visit and reflect.”

http://www.metronews.ca/news/ottawa/2017...ant-to-provide-space-for-reflection.html

[Harley613]

Originally Posted by AndyMEng

In a distopian future when there isn't a mall security guard, the 'outdoor rooms' should prove handy for living al fresco. I noted one section in particular you could just hang a sheet and urban camp in the nook.

I had the same thoughts. I also thought this would make a great homeless camp if not for the security.

[rocketphish]

Originally Posted by Harley613

I had the same thoughts. I also thought this would make a great homeless camp if not for the security.

Interesting idea... and this could give the monument a more authentic look to it too, in terms of what it's commemorating.

[flar]

It looks unfinished

[passwordisnt123]

Originally Posted by acottawa

It isn't anywhere near any planned entertainment district. Its immediate neighbours are a somber war museum, a somber firefighter memorial, some boring planned office buildings in the Senators proposal' and some butt-ugly claridge condos.

Not at the moment but once completed, the Lebreton Flats development will effectively be an entertainment district for the city with restaurants and one of the main entertainment attractions in the city (Sens).