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  #861  
Old Posted Aug 8, 2022, 10:04 PM
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Originally Posted by Changing City View Post
Bosa Bluesky's Granville Street rental building from 13 years ago has 106 apartments and 18 parking spaces. So providing relatively few spaces for rental buildings has been around for a while.

No doubt there will be Modo, Zerocar and/or Evo spaces in Senakw.
And this development has even fewer spots per unit than Bluesky!
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  #862  
Old Posted Aug 8, 2022, 10:11 PM
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As of 2018, I can confirm the existence of entitled Asian NIMBYs. Don't ask.

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I heard it as 'sen-ock' which is not how I was saying it in my head.
Technically, it's "sen-ock-(phlegm)."

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Originally Posted by whatnext View Post
Yes, as I stated using dogwalking space as an excuse is bogus. That area of the park is the least used of a (literally) shitty park. And if you accept that any area in the city is subject to have a road built through it then Kits Point should not be immune. However, they would have a point if they were honest enough to argue that the road network as it stands in that area is not going to be able to handle a huge amount of increased traffic. Since drivers can't go south Chestnut they will all go right on Chestnut, left on Creelman and turn left onto Cypress to get out. Go have a coffee at the Sbux patio on Cornwall and see how you think that's going to work out. And since there are so many vocal cyclists here I'm surprised nobody has pointed out Cypress is a bike route.
You'll be happy to know that a two-lane road can handle 1,000 vehicles a day... and there's less than 900 parking spaces in Senakw. Since there's two ways in (Cypress and Pennyfarthing), that's enough for every resident driver and 1,100 Uber Eats deliveries; the majority of the traffic on Cornwall and Burrard will continue to be from Point Grey and Kerrisdale residents driving downtown.
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  #863  
Old Posted Aug 8, 2022, 10:17 PM
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Originally Posted by Migrant_Coconut View Post
As of 2018, I can confirm the existence of entitled Asian NIMBYs. Don't ask.
Take a look at any proposed hospice anywhere ever, but if anyone were to see a hospice with opposition get built in a high Chinese population neighbourhood and people went "Nice, glad to see those superstitious Chinese cry", I'd be furious.
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  #864  
Old Posted Aug 8, 2022, 10:27 PM
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Take a look at any proposed hospice anywhere ever, but if anyone were to see a hospice with opposition get built in a high Chinese population neighbourhood and people went "Nice, glad to see those superstitious Chinese cry", I'd be furious.
TBF hearing the old folks squeal about a new tower next to a graveyard gets stale very fast (G-g-g-ghosts!).
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  #865  
Old Posted Aug 8, 2022, 10:30 PM
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And if you're parking on the street in Kits Point I'm 95% sure you need a parking permit.
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  #866  
Old Posted Aug 8, 2022, 10:33 PM
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Originally Posted by Migrant_Coconut View Post
TBF hearing the old folks squeal about a new tower next to a graveyard gets stale very fast (G-g-g-ghosts!).
As I said before, hate the sin not the sinner. Superstition is dumb at best and destructive at worst but Chinese people are people, just like white people are people.
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  #867  
Old Posted Aug 8, 2022, 10:34 PM
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Originally Posted by whatnext View Post
Yes, as I stated using dogwalking space as an excuse is bogus. That area of the park is the least used of a (literally) shitty park. And if you accept that any area in the city is subject to have a road built through it then Kits Point should not be immune. However, they would have a point if they were honest enough to argue that the road network as it stands in that area is not going to be able to handle a huge amount of increased traffic. Since drivers can't go south Chestnut they will all go right on Chestnut, left on Creelman and turn left onto Cypress to get out. Go have a coffee at the Sbux patio on Cornwall and see how you think that's going to work out. And since there are so many vocal cyclists here I'm surprised nobody has pointed out Cypress is a bike route.
The new road will have a two-way bike path that will continue across Greer and then south on Cypress.
That block is going to get more congested - or it may clean up if they remove on-street parking when the bike lanes go in (?)
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  #868  
Old Posted Aug 8, 2022, 10:51 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Changing City View Post
Bosa Bluesky's Granville Street rental building from 13 years ago has 106 apartments and 18 parking spaces. So providing relatively few spaces for rental buildings has been around for a while.

No doubt there will be Modo, Zerocar and/or Evo spaces in Senakw.
If you're renting a 320 sq ft apartment on the Granville Strip owning a car probably wasn't likely. We'll see when the size and rental rates of Senakw are released, though the switch to largely one bedrooms may help that.

Has there been much released on car ownership data in the CoV lately? certainly the absolute number has gone up though I'm curious if this trend manifests itself here:

...The recent Covid trend of New Yorkers’ buying cars may share some of the blame. Between the summers of 2019 and 2021, new car registrations increased by 19 percent, according to data provided by the New York State Department of Motor Vehicles....
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  #869  
Old Posted Aug 8, 2022, 10:56 PM
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I mean if someone wants to rent a brand new apartment here, bring their car (or get one after moving in), park it maybe (minimum) over a block away if they get a permit for street parking, and then on top of that roll the dice about finding said street parking spot... they can have at 'er.
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  #870  
Old Posted Aug 8, 2022, 10:58 PM
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Originally Posted by GenWhy? View Post
I mean if someone wants to rent a brand new apartment here, bring their car (or get one after moving in), park it maybe (minimum) over a block away if they get a permit for street parking, and then on top of that roll the dice about finding said street parking spot... they can have at 'er.
I might be wrong here, but I thought the CoV will only issue street parking permits for residents of the block that requires the permit?
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  #871  
Old Posted Aug 8, 2022, 11:06 PM
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Originally Posted by chowhou View Post
I might be wrong here, but I thought the CoV will only issue street parking permits for residents of the block that requires the permit?
Hmm Kits Point is in the Residential Permit Parking area, and I think is less restrictive than the resident-only parking permit. But I guess they technically don't have a "City" address so maybe they wouldn't be able to apply at all!
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  #872  
Old Posted Aug 8, 2022, 11:10 PM
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Originally Posted by chowhou View Post
Is one of the problems of this country "white people"?

It grosses me out when white people are racist towards anyone including white people and it grosses me out when Chinese people are racist towards anyone including Chinese people. Your race has nothing to do about it.

"Yes, the tears of old, white, entitled privilege are tasty" to me feels identical to "Yes, the tears of immigrant, Chinese, greed are tasty". It's so otherizing and comes from a place of hate.
You view this topic in such simplistic terms. I’m done. Have a nice day.
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  #873  
Old Posted Aug 8, 2022, 11:16 PM
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Originally Posted by GenWhy? View Post
I mean if someone wants to rent a brand new apartment here, bring their car (or get one after moving in), park it maybe (minimum) over a block away if they get a permit for street parking, and then on top of that roll the dice about finding said street parking spot... they can have at 'er.
If Concord was smart they'd incorporate some extra parking in whatever the Molson site ends up as.
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  #874  
Old Posted Aug 8, 2022, 11:17 PM
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Originally Posted by dreambrother808 View Post
You view this topic in such simplistic terms. I’m done. Have a nice day.
You too, I hope we both had something to think about.

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Originally Posted by whatnext View Post
If Concord was smart they'd incorporate some extra parking in whatever the Molson site ends up as.
I'm not sure the economics would work out for building additional underground parking to try to sell monthly passes to people in this development.
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  #875  
Old Posted Aug 8, 2022, 11:55 PM
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You're in a condo? Go count the amount of cars. The condos I've been in downtown have a lot of vehicles in them. Maybe you're right and because this is close to downtown they won't but I don't see why it would be different from the building on Marinaside I was in last week which is just as close. Sure, maybe the fact Senakw doesn't provide the spaces will make the difference and residents won't just clog nearby streets or rent private parking. Then again, maybe not.
There are two factors at play here. First, the location of the development should mean that the demand for private vehicle usage will be lower. Second, the small number of underground spaces in the development and curbside spots in the surrounding neighbourhood will constrain the supply of parking spots.

Plenty of buildings have the first of these factors. The condos in Downtown Vancouver with 1+ parking spots for every unit is one example. These residents can walk or bike for just about every essential trip, yet many of them choose to own a car for one reason or another. Another example is Suburban town centres like Metrotown or Brentwood, where many of the residents could take transit to work but they choose to own and drive a car instead. For both of these situations the decision whether or not to own a car is fairly frictionless. Sure, you need to pay your annual insurance bill, but the day-to-day act of owning a car is a breeze since you never need to move you car for street cleaning, never need to plug the meter, don't lose sleep over a drunk driver taking your mirror off, etc. You simply park your car underground and forget about it.

The second factor, constrained supply, is a lot more rare in Vancouver. Since every new build for quite some time has had to comply with parking minimums you won't find a lack of supply in new neighbourhoods or infill projects. However, older neighbourhoods have plenty of walkup apartments where there isn't an assigned spot for every unit. These neighbourhoods aren't bursting at the seams with cars. And if they are, market forces such as the cost of a residential permit or the price of private parking could be used to bring demand back in-line with supply.

This is why I think the West End is a very good parallel for Senakw. The West End is close enough to all the essentials and downtown that most residents hardly drive at all. Also, I think a proper study would find that the West End has far fewer parking spots that it does residents. Because of this lack of supply, an annual neighbourhood parking permit for the West End costs 10x what a permit for almost any other neighbourhood costs.

I think it is absolutely bonkers that we live in a part of the world that goes gaga for the free market, but the one thing that is consistently handed out for free or at a cost well below market value is parking spots. Let's let the free market handle all of the parking issues. There will be a limited supply of assigned stalls, curbside spots, and private parking lots, so the price will eventually reach equilibrium. Let's not pretend the parking situation around this development will every be so dire that it would be economical for Concord to turn the Molson brewery into one giant surface parking lot.
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  #876  
Old Posted Aug 9, 2022, 12:05 AM
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If Concord was smart they'd incorporate some extra parking in whatever the Molson site ends up as.
I looked at some downtown parkades to see what a monthly pass typically costs, and it seems to be between $200 and $300. I believe it costs between $25k and $50k per stall to build an underground parkade. Assuming that the extra parking would involve going deeper and that the cost per stall would be at the high end, it would take 200 months ($50k / $250) to pay off the cost of an extra stall. That doesn't factor in borrowing or operating costs or any months when the stall was not rented, and I am not convinced a parking lot on the brewery site would fetch nearly the monthly rent per stall that a downtown lot does.
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  #877  
Old Posted Aug 9, 2022, 12:11 AM
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Originally Posted by FarmerHaight View Post
I think it is absolutely bonkers that we live in a part of the world that goes gaga for the free market, but the one thing that is consistently handed out for free or at a cost well below market value is parking spots. Let's let the free market handle all of the parking issues. There will be a limited supply of assigned stalls, curbside spots, and private parking lots, so the price will eventually reach equilibrium. Let's not pretend the parking situation around this development will every be so dire that it would be economical for Concord to turn the Molson brewery into one giant surface parking lot.
As long as we have publically subsidized and supply managed street parking, it's not a free market. Someone once brought up to me that it's insane how in most of Metro Vancouver you can store your 6.7m 8000lb long crew cab long box F-450 indefinitely on a public road (in the CoV you can't store it indefinitely in front of a property on a block you don't live on, but in the DNV you can!), but if someone decided to set up a tent there they're getting yeeted as soon as anyone notices.

The less publically provided parking the better. I wouldn't even mind if private properties were allowed to replace or even surpass the amount removed, but this system doesn't seem fair or good for the city. Japan is the model to look at here.

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Originally Posted by FarmerHaight View Post
I looked at some downtown parkades to see what a monthly pass typically costs, and it seems to be between $200 and $300. I believe it costs between $25k and $50k per stall to build an underground parkade. Assuming that the extra parking would involve going deeper and that the cost per stall would be at the high end, it would take 200 months ($50k / $250) to pay off the cost of an extra stall. That doesn't factor in borrowing or operating costs or any months when the stall was not rented, and I am not convinced a parking lot on the brewery site would fetch nearly the monthly rent per stall that a downtown lot does.
I can't imagine residents would be too happy with this either. There's two options:

A) You put the public monthly paid parking above the residential parking and make everyone drive and park deeper
B) You put the public monthly paid parking below or with the residential parking and remove all security from the parkade.

Don't forget that people in this development are going to have below market rate leases, is this demographic going to pay an additional $300 a month for parking?

EDIT: Not everyone will have below market rate leases

Last edited by chowhou; Aug 9, 2022 at 12:26 AM.
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  #878  
Old Posted Aug 9, 2022, 12:22 AM
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Originally Posted by chowhou View Post

Don't forget that people in this development are going to have below market rate leases, is this demographic going to pay an additional $300 a month for parking?
You're mistaken. 80% of the units are market rental units. Only 20% are intended to be below market rental. This is predominantly an investment development to generate an income stream for the Squamish Nation.
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  #879  
Old Posted Aug 9, 2022, 12:27 AM
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You're mistaken. 80% of the units are market rental units. Only 20% are intended to be below market rental. This is predominantly an investment development to generate an income stream for the Squamish Nation.
I didn't say all units were below market (though it was what I was implying, I was wrong about that), and that 20% is the demographic I'm talking about.
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  #880  
Old Posted Aug 9, 2022, 12:49 AM
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I didn't say all units were below market (though it was what I was implying, I was wrong about that), and that 20% is the demographic I'm talking about.
Fair enough. I think this is an interesting experiment that will show whether car ownership in the second half of the 20th century was just a blip in human history, and it turns out access to other convenient means of movement is more important than individual vehicle ownership.
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