Ogden: the Junction City mega thread

[Future Mayor]

Just an FYI, don't confuse Phoenix-Mesa with Sky Harbor.

[UTAZLoVer]

Originally Posted by Future Mayor

Just an FYI, don't confuse Phoenix-Mesa with Sky Harbor.

Oh I'm definitely not. The Phoenix-Mesa airport is at the old Williams Air Force Base in case people want to know.

[isangpogi]

Originally Posted by wrendog

Oh wow. That is interesting. We now have 3 commercial airports on the Wasatch Front. Will be interesting to see if there will be any additional destinations out of Ogden or Provo...

Hey awesome news! I'll bet Ogden gets expanded service now even before Provo does. Reason being that Provo is offering nothing original to what SLC has (1x daily Frontier to DEN). So at best maybe they get one or two more Frontier flights a day to Denver. I doubt Delta goes in (where are they going to fly, SLC?) I guess United or Delta could do LA for all those SoCal college kids without rides up to SLC.

But Ogden is getting Allegiant, an ultra-low-cost carrier. You're going to see weekenders driving from as far as SLC, UT county and Logan to grab these cheap flights. Watch out though, Allegiant is known to pull out quickly when performance isn't up to par and they are pretty gimmicky so make sure you read all the fine print about fees before you book.

[Bob The Builder]

Originally Posted by UTAZLoVer

Yeah it will be. There was an article in the Standard (and also the Tribune) about it that I've been meaning to post, but I've been too lazy. They are also considering routes to LA, Bellingham, WA (Seattle), Las Vegas, and Honolulu. I think they are waiting to see how this goes.

That is good news for Ogden! Note that Bellingham is about a 2 - 2 1/2 hour car ride away from Seattle. If you are flying to Bellingham then you are most likely going there and then on to Canada - which is fun to do.

Hopefully Ogden gets more fights.

[scottharding]

Ogden's River clean-up has been very successful. That city just continues to reinvent itself.

http://www.sltrib.com/sltrib/news/54...award.html.csp

[Future Mayor]

Originally Posted by scottharding

Ogden's River clean-up has been very successful. That city just continues to reinvent itself.

http://www.sltrib.com/sltrib/news/54...award.html.csp

What a great asset for downtown Ogden. I hope that the future development along the edge of the river can be much more organic and welcoming, rather than big box asphalt jungles, not creating a welcoming environment. I am thinking River Walk esque in San Antonio, really it isn't that much of a stretch to think it could be something like that. Allow for developement to face the river, and have the pedestrian paths between the river and the shops/restaurants. There really is HUGE potential for very urban, and organic development to occur along the river, get future developers involved with clean up past the 1.1 mile stretch, with incentives and tax breaks to do so.

[redzeppelin]

Originally Posted by isangpogi

Hey awesome news! I'll bet Ogden gets expanded service now even before Provo does. Reason being that Provo is offering nothing original to what SLC has (1x daily Frontier to DEN). So at best maybe they get one or two more Frontier flights a day to Denver. I doubt Delta goes in (where are they going to fly, SLC?) I guess United or Delta could do LA for all those SoCal college kids without rides up to SLC.

But Ogden is getting Allegiant, an ultra-low-cost carrier. You're going to see weekenders driving from as far as SLC, UT county and Logan to grab these cheap flights. Watch out though, Allegiant is known to pull out quickly when performance isn't up to par and they are pretty gimmicky so make sure you read all the fine print about fees before you book.

Mesa has a large LDS population, and I expect that cheap flights from Ogden to Mesa will fill up fast with people going back and forth to visit family in summer. In the winter we'll see Utahns go south to golf and enjoy the sun, while some from Arizona will fly to Ogden for ski vacations. It will do well.

As for new airlines offering service to either Ogden or Provo, I think that the one wildcard to watch here is Alaska/Horizon. They have a great West coast network with hubs in Seattle, Portland and LAX. They are also building up a nice base in San Diego and are adding more and more flights into the middle of the country. They don't operate their own planes to SLC, but have a tight code-share relationship with Delta. I think the Delta partnership is the only reason that they don't fly to SLC right now--they don't want to compete with a partner. You can earn Delta Skymiles on all Alaska/Horizon flights, so they should have an automatic customer base in Utah. If anybody outside of the LCC market adds flights to Ogden or Provo any time soon, Alaska flights to LAX or SEA from either airport wouldn't surprise me.

[delts145]

I was curious as to how far along they are on the construction of the Ogden LDS Temple. This is a big deal for the further redevelopment of Downtown Ogden. So glad the LDS Church saw the need for this. Here are a few updated pics I found.

Photograph taken June 28, 2012, courtesy of the webcam














Additional Pics:

http://www.ldschurchtemples.com/ogden/construction/


Also, here are some update pics of the new Brigham City LDS Temple, some taken as recently as a few days ago

Photograph taken July 7, 2012, courtesy of Lane Montgomery


Photograph taken July 7, 2012, courtesy of Lane Montgomery






Photograph taken July 3, 2012, courtesy of Joyce Palmer


Photograph taken June 16, 2012, courtesy of Brandon Price


Photograph taken June 11, 2012, courtesy of Lane Montgomery


Photograph taken June 11, 2012, courtesy of Lane Montgomery


Additional Pics:
http://www.ldschurchtemples.com/brig.../construction/

.

[TonyAnderson]

Nice find Delts. The new LDS 'Temple Square' project combined with the river development/restoration should do wonders for that side of downtown.

[delts145]

Agreed Tony, I'm very impressed with what they are doing with the river restoration. It's an amazing tranformation from what it use to be.

[delts145]

Layton voters to decide whether to overturn Village Center zoning code

http://www.sltrib.com/sltrib/neighbo...-west.html.csp

By Pamela Manson, The Salt Lake Tribune

Officials envision the future West Layton Village Center as a vibrant, walkable neighborhood that offers a healthy mix of homes, shops, businesses, recreation and government offices.

But some residents see a jarring mishmash of uses, which they contend would take away the rural feel of the area at 2200 West and Hill Field Road and would increase density, pollution and traffic problems.

PhotosAt a glance—

What’s next

Layton residents will cast ballots in the Nov. 6 general election on whether to overturn two decisions by the City Council that created a Village Center zone at 2200 West and Hill Field Road. For more information, visit the Layton city website at www.westlaytonvillage.org/ and the Citizens for Responsible Growth in West Layton’s website at www.westlaytonvillage.info.

"It’s so loosely designed we could have as many as 800 apartments on 100 acres," resident Brian Pead said. "They want to make an urban center and take away our rural center."...

...City officials counter that the Village Center code will create a sustainable neighborhood with amenities and housing choices that are attractive to families, young married couples, single professionals and empty nesters.

"This West Layton Village Center will be one of the most desirable neighborhoods in Layton," Mayor Steve Curtis said in a written statement...


Sketches of the proposed West Layton Village Center, which would be located at 2200 West and Hill Field Road. Opponents say it will destroy the rural feel of the area.

.

[arkhitektor]

I went to see the Dark Knight Rises in Farmington tonight, and since my brother-in-law was late arriving- I decided to make myself useful by taking some pictures of Station Park while I waited:

It's not a perfect TOD, but it's much better than you'd expect from Davis Co., which tends to be almost exclusively rural and suburban. And it really is a step above what I've come to expect from a suburban Utah lifestyle center like The District, Jordan Landing, Valley Fair, etc. The architecture and quality of the finishes really stand out- even the big-box stores on the perimeter and much nicer than you'd typically see.

(Sorry about the image size- I'm too lazy to re-size them all, so you get in them in whatever dimension my phone took them)


The development is less than 1/2 built-out. It's going to look pretty cool once it all fills in:


Speaking of which, here is some new building going up just west of the theater:


These bus-stop looking shelters make me wonder if they'll eventually have some kind of shuttle from the pedestrian mall area to the FrontRunner station:


Gas lamps:


The restaurants have outdoor seating, I really liked the biparting doors which, when opened as they are here, open the inside of the restaurant to the outside:


Couches for outdoor seating:


I rode the train, so I can report a little on the proximity of the station itself to the theater area. The distance felt about the same as walking down two Salt Lake City blocks. It was inconvenient only because the area in-between is the part that is currently still under construction. Once it's all filled in, getting off the train, walking down the plaza and back won't be any worse than walking from one end of Gateway to the other and back.

[Old&New]

But will it be a straight shot along some tree/building shaded, safe, path? Remember, it's only one poorly developed block, along 200 South, that is causing a disconnect between the east and west sides of downtown... What would two blocks of parking do?

[arkhitektor]

Originally Posted by Old&New

But will it be a straight shot along some tree/building shaded, safe, path? Remember, it's only one poorly developed block, along 200 South, that is causing a disconnect between the east and west sides of downtown... What would two blocks of parking do?

Once it's built, you'll have to traverse the distance (400 ft according to google earth) between the FrontRunner station and the edge of the UTA parking lot (which has a sidewalk with trees):

Beyond that, you will be inside the development and surrounded by buildings:


This was never going to be a development where you popped off the train and into the market for a loaf of bread on the way home from work-
But the 'village center' area that they are developing is easily accessible from the train station. If you are just window shopping and going to a movie on a Friday night, you'll have no trouble taking the train instead of driving.

Given that the citizenry of nearby Layton is fighting a much smaller village center and recently collected enough signatures to place the issue on the ballot this fall, I'd say that it's pretty remarkable that this development is going to be as dense as it is in Farmington, which has been historically far less receptive to commercial growth. (This is basically the only commercial center in the city- it's otherwise almost entirely residential.)

[TonyAnderson]

Originally Posted by delts145

Layton voters to decide whether to overturn Village Center zoning code

http://www.sltrib.com/sltrib/neighbo...-west.html.csp

By Pamela Manson, The Salt Lake Tribune

Officials envision the future West Layton Village Center as a vibrant, walkable neighborhood that offers a healthy mix of homes, shops, businesses, recreation and government offices.

But some residents see a jarring mishmash of uses, which they contend would take away the rural feel of the area at 2200 West and Hill Field Road and would increase density, pollution and traffic problems.

PhotosAt a glance—

What’s next

Layton residents will cast ballots in the Nov. 6 general election on whether to overturn two decisions by the City Council that created a Village Center zone at 2200 West and Hill Field Road. For more information, visit the Layton city website at www.westlaytonvillage.org/ and the Citizens for Responsible Growth in West Layton’s website at www.westlaytonvillage.info.

"It’s so loosely designed we could have as many as 800 apartments on 100 acres," resident Brian Pead said. "They want to make an urban center and take away our rural center."...

...City officials counter that the Village Center code will create a sustainable neighborhood with amenities and housing choices that are attractive to families, young married couples, single professionals and empty nesters.

"This West Layton Village Center will be one of the most desirable neighborhoods in Layton," Mayor Steve Curtis said in a written statement...

.

I hadn't seen that proposal before. I'd like to see that go through.

[scuba1415]

I think a notable difference between the development in Farmington and that in Layton is the FrontRunner station. The one in Layton is nowhere near any kind of anything. The nearest FrontRunner station is a couple miles down mainstreet in either direction. Traffic at the nearest freeway offramp is already a nightmare. I think this kind of development is great, but location is very important.

[Future Mayor]

While I appreciate the design quality that the pictures show, and the overall layout of the center itself. I still refuse to acknoweldge Farmington Station as a TOD, because there is no way it is. A TOD, IMO, is defined as a development of housing, office and retail that has a direct connection or minimal distance between retail and housing, to the transit access. I am appreciate the attempt, but I would venture to guess that 90-95% of the patrons of Farmington Station arrive by car. The retail portion of a true TOD, shouldn't need to rely on 100% of it's patron coming from off premises.


As for the Layton Center, it is so frustrating to see residents not see the vision of what is truly trying to be accomplished with this plan. I hadn't heard of this plan prior to today either, but I would like to know how the planning code addresses the surrounding agricultural land. If the densities are greater in this "village Center" in order to accomodate growth while still maintaining agriculture than I am all for it. Is there a purpose behind the higher densities in the long range?
This is what I had planned for the future west side of Payson. I had identified the most fertile agricultural lands, and assigned those as TDR sending sites with the areas around major intersections as small village centers with higher density. Between those village centers and the preserved agricultural land were conservation subdivisions, which allow for houses closer together with more open (partially natural) space to have a nice transition from more urban to agricultural. The thing that frustrates me is that if this zoning is voted down it will be replaced with a more traditional residential zoning in the future and I wouldn't be surprised if one of the indivduals that is spearheading the overturn in zoning is the first one to sell their land and it turns into a traditional subdivision.

People need to see the vision, and listen to planners. We went to school for this for a reason. UGH

It's the same situation that occured with the Holladay Village Center, minus the agricultural land. The vision was developed by those that understand what it takes for a "town center" to be successful, but because of fear of change and stereo types of renters, the Hollady Village Center went from a nice three mix use, to simply retail and some small office. Requiring all patrons to come from off site.

[Old&New]

That's lame, I hadn't heard that update.

[delts145]

I ran across this little pic this morning. Residential was definitely a component in the original plans for Station Park. I believe it still is. Frankly, I've been quite surprised at how quickly the Station Park development is moving forward. It seems like each month more development is announced, and new construction is begun. It's important to remember that a TOD is something created in phases. Especially with Metro SLC, there is the elbow room to begin a phase I, and advance through many phases over time. What now might be simply a station in a vacant field(like so many in the southern portion of the Salt Lake Valley) will be a vibrant village center in ten to twenty years.

Station Park is pretty much a carbon copy of many of the nicer lifestyle centers here in California. Most of these L.A. Centers, such as The Grove, or The Americana are served by bus of course, but donot have the luxury of rail transit, like SLC Metro. As with Lifestyle Centers here in So Cal.,which include mid-rise residential on site or across the street, the day will come when Station Park will also have residential, it's just a matter of time. Remember, this TOD hit the development phase just as the condo market was plummeting. Residential rentals are only a part of the mix, which also must include Condo Sales. When condo sales recover, then we'll see the anticipated residential component.


www.metrojacksonville.com

[DCRes]

Station Park is moving very quickly now but it has been in planning stages for a long time (as I'm sure all large projects go through). But i remember nearly 10 years ago Park Lane dead ended at the 1-15 on ramp. Highway 89 went through a big renovation, adding a bridge over Shephard Lane and freeway style on and off ramps. Then Park Lane was extended over to State Street, which created the triangle piece of land that Station Park sits on. The bridge to Legacy Parkway sat unfinshed for years as legal battles ensued. Finally, Legacy was built, Frontrunner was put in, and many new subdivisions went into west Farmington. It has been quite the transformation, and has been stated, 'old town' Farmington has kept it's historic and small town feel on the east side of I-15.