Edmonton Construction 9 (2008-08) - Page 426

Daveography · #**8501** Posted **Oct 15, 2009, 5:37 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by cdnklc

what's been resurrected and talked about in this discussion was never an actual design, not even when it was done. it was a purely conceptual and preliminary massing model done as part of our "pre-purchase due diligence" in acquiring the site.

Thanks for the inside scoop Ken. With that in mind it is pretty fascinating to have seen this project go from this vision and evolve into its current reality.

Daveography · #**8502** Posted **Oct 15, 2009, 5:39 PM**

And while we're blasting from the past, here's a couple more pics I had laying around - note that they are not mine and I'm not sure who deserves the credit for them:

I can actually see my office under construction in that last one.

kcantor · #**8503** Posted **Oct 15, 2009, 5:41 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by Coldrsx

true

for Vancouver has a complex network of freeways and few bottlenecks into downtown which created a dense, vibrant downtown by way of fluid movement for those who live in burnaby or poco to pop in and out of the core.

try living there and commuting through the deas tunnel or over the lion's gate or port mann bridges or along hastings street... it has "few bottlenecks" only in the sense that it is one large bottleneck that doesn't need much more than a sneeze to come to a complete standstill. it's "dense vibrant downtown" is reasonably readily accessible by transit but developed that density as much to escape those bottlenecks as through any lack of them.

Coldrsx · #**8504** Posted **Oct 15, 2009, 5:53 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by cdnklc

try living there and commuting through the deas tunnel or over the lion's gate or port mann bridges or along hastings street... it has "few bottlenecks" only in the sense that it is one large bottleneck that doesn't need much more than a sneeze to come to a complete standstill. it's "dense vibrant downtown" is reasonably readily accessible by transit but developed that density as much to escape those bottlenecks as through any lack of them.

tongue in cheek ken

Kevin_foster · #**8505** Posted **Oct 15, 2009, 7:08 PM**

Cool concept for an above ground parking garage, perhaps for near a library

http://farm1.static.flickr.com/186/418008212_92405fdf50_b.jpg

240glt · #**8506** Posted **Oct 15, 2009, 8:11 PM**

Ahhh.. it is so nice to have a set of office tower plans & specs on my desk again. I haven't had that honor since Bentall 5 in Vancouver

0773|=\ · #**8507** Posted **Oct 15, 2009, 8:16 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rogie

Well said.

The more I live in Vancouver, the more I realize freeways are not the way to go (although at times I do wish there were ONE quick way to get east-west in the city). Urbanism in Toronto was born around opposition to a freeway (what later became the Allen Expressway which stops dead at Eglinton); unfortunately, research shows (at least the research I read from Edmonton Transit), ring roads push development out, so we can all expect to see more of these awful business campus-type developments along the Henday, particularly where it meets with the QE2. Great development area, from a highway access point of view.

There has to be a happy medium. You can't convince everyone to take transit, and you can't convince everyone to drive (as is evident on this forum). What you can do before you ever reach that threshold where a critical mass of workers coming downtown necessitates the perceived more desirable mode of transportation, is to make both modes reasonably easy to use to access downtown or bring residential areas downtown and promote the hell out of that.

Two cities have each taken one of these options and for both it has paid off in a unique way:

Vancouver obviously doesn't have amazing road access downtown, but there is a high density residential area promoting rapid transit to the area, which solves the movement of office staff into the area. Now Vancouver is left having to promote businesses to operate out of Vancouver, and some of those workers also like their suburban homes. Expanding transit (now viable) will solve that in time.

Calgary on the other hand, while not having a big freeway loop around their core, still has free-flowing roads that come just close enough to make suburban perception of getting downtown to be "easy" and granted one doesn't travel at peak hours, "quick". I'm speaking of course of Bow Trail and Memorial Drive, which connect directly into the suburban network of Crowchild, Deerfoot, and Glenmore Trail freeways. They haven't killed their downtown, and they have decent roadway access (and C-Train went along with it thanks to an Olympic bid). Calgary's struggle now is to attract more residential development, and right now, that seems to be progressing nicely.

Edmonton is different once again. Probably leaning more towards Vancouver's model, but certainly has better road-connectivity... just not as good as Calgary. To stop suburban business development, Edmonton just might have to build one (or maybe two) faster routes that bring a car-commuter just close enough so that in their head, even if our logic doesn't tell us this when traffic is backing up on this road, they will see their accessibility into the downtown core as quick, easy, especially in off-peak hours.

Coldrsx · #**8508** Posted **Oct 15, 2009, 8:16 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by 240glt

Ahhh.. it is so nice to have a set of office tower plans & specs on my desk again. I haven't had that honor since Bentall 5 in Vancouver

hmmm...

240glt · #**8509** Posted **Oct 15, 2009, 8:17 PM**

^ :p

Coldrsx · #**8510** Posted **Oct 15, 2009, 8:18 PM**

"Edmonton is different once again. Probably leaning more towards Vancouver's model, but certainly has better road-connectivity... just not as good as Calgary. To stop suburban business development, Edmonton just might have to build one (or maybe two) faster routes that bring a car-commuter just close enough so that in their head, even if our logic doesn't tell us this when traffic is backing up on this road, they will see their accessibility into the downtown core as quick, easy, especially in off-peak hours."

ok ok, access is part of it but IMO what would be far more attractive is making downtown THE PLACE TO LIVE/WORK/PLAY and thereby create demand to push towards more of a vancouver model.

0773|=\ · #**8511** Posted **Oct 15, 2009, 8:22 PM**

Right. But you will admit that we're up against a suburban culture on this one, right? You can't convince EVERYONE that they want to live in a condo. Some people legitimately might prefer having a backyard, and many of them are useful office workers to have in your core regardless. You need to attract as wide a variety of employment as possible, and that means build all kinds of residential development downtown AND improve its accessibility for the suburban culture that inevitably will always exist. You can't alienate a demographic that can potentially help your city out (even if they drain more city resources than a downtown dweller).

Coldrsx · #**8512** Posted **Oct 15, 2009, 8:28 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by 0773|=\

Right. But you will admit that we're up against a suburban culture on this one, right? You can't convince EVERYONE that they want to live in a condo. Some people legitimately might prefer having a backyard, and many of them are useful office workers to have in your core regardless. You need to attract as wide a variety of employment as possible, and that means build all kinds of residential development downtown AND improve its accessibility for the suburban culture that inevitably will always exist. You can't alienate a demographic that can potentially help your city out (even if they drain more city resources than a downtown dweller).

well of course... but there are MANY MANY people who might want to reconsider and live centrally/core if they had better reason to do so.

MANY

on that note... it was hylarious yesterday hearing stories of 1-2.5hr commutes into downtown from all over greater Edmonton. Heard more than a few people say "i wish i lived downtown sometimes"...

time for a billboard campaign in winter:

"If you lived downtown you would be eating dinner and not missing Oprah right now"

"You could have had beers 5,6,and 7"

"under your covers faster than getting to the high level"

Kevin_foster · #**8513** Posted **Oct 15, 2009, 8:33 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by 240glt

Ahhh.. it is so nice to have a set of office tower plans & specs on my desk again. I haven't had that honor since Bentall 5 in Vancouver

You are an HVAC guy right? Can you divulge as to ... new building, existing building? Edmonton???

Coldrsx · #**8514** Posted **Oct 15, 2009, 9:40 PM**

Edmonton Urban Design nominees unveiled

BY KEITH GEREIN, EDMONTONJOURNAL.COMOCTOBER 15, 2009 3:02 PMBE THE FIRST TO POST A COMMENT

STORYPHOTOS ( 1 )

A view of Louise McKinney Park in Edmonton.
Photograph by: Ryan Jackson, Edmonton Journal
EDMONTON — Louise McKinney Park is on the list. So are three new LRT stations and the downtown YMCA.

Some are recent additions to the city’s urban landscape. Others only exist in the imaginations of architects.

A total of 53 projects are up for this year’s Edmonton Urban Design Awards, an ecletic list of nominees featuring condominiums, pedestrian walks, cultural facilities, building facades, post-secondary institutions and even a car parkade.

The awards were launched in 2005 and are held every two years to promote public awareness of the importance of urban design.

For this year’s competition, the city brought in a star-studded lineup of design experts, including former Edmonton architect Douglas Cardinal, most famous for designing the Canadian Museum of Civilization in Gatineau, Que.

Other judges are Toronto landscape architect Michael Hough, Seattle architect Shannon Nichol, Vancouver’s director of planning Brent Toderian, and president of the Toronto-based Artscape agency Tim Jones.

All five judges spent Thursday morning discussing the nominees and went out to visit some of the sites during the afternoon.

All said they were impressed by the quality of the submissions. Cardinal, in particular, said Edmonton’s designs have advanced considerably since 1985, the year he moved to Ottawa to work on the museum.

“The submissions are really much better than they were in past, which can only help the overall environment of the city,” he said.

“They are addressing the pedestrian more, the urban environment more and the quality of the street.”

However, Cardinal said he remains concerned Edmonton is not doing enough to embrace its location as a winter city. Glass-encased, ground-level atriums situated between buildings is an example of something that could help to increase street life during the colder months, he said.

“The Scandinavian countries have done an excellent job of addressing their urban landscape in the winter. We have to do better at that.”

The winners in six categories will be announced at a gala event on Nov. 18.

[email protected]

© Copyright (c) The Edmonton Journal

http://www.edmontonjournal.com/business/Edmonton+Urban+Design+nominees+unveiled/2107279/story.html