CHICAGO | General Developments

[dropdeaded209]

Carbine and Carbon building crown is going to be permanently lit starting November 16 at 5PM. Tribune has the full story.

anyone know if the beacon atop the Palmolive Building is going to start swinging anytime soon?

[Loopy]

All of this talk about Carbide and Carbon's "crown" makes me wonder about whether there was a "spire" at one time.

In the Hard Rock Hotel, there is a beautiful green terra-cotta tapering "column" in the adjacent China Grill and a more pointed matching piece on the roof of the low-rise section of the building. The color matches the terra-cotta of the building perfectly.

I have always wondered whether this "spire" was once mounted on the "crown" and removed for safety reasons.

Anybody know what I'm talking about?

[VivaLFuego]

Congress Hotel is definitely the best location, in my opinion.

Block 37 would be decent, location-wise, but it's a non-starter this late in the game in that project's development. Oh well.

The Post Office is intriguing, but a distant second to the Congress site. Distant second because 1) I can't really fathom the cost effectiveness and 2) while its transport access is decent, it is in a wasteland in terms of hotel/entertainment amenities. It would require building a whole new upscale entertainment disctrict (this has to be upscale or da mare ain't interested), which would also mean ancillary costs like moving the Greyhound bus depot, streetscaping, fighting with landowners over rezonings to encourage redevelopment, etc. It would be great if it would happen, but it would be an incredibly expensive and time consuming process to make it happen.

Lower Wacker is probably thrown in as a joke.

The Congress site offers up top scores on almost every measure of location quality for a casino. And I urge you guys to try to convince me that dump (and its even dumpier parking garage) are worth saving. (EDIT: in fairness, the north building has some nice facade details that could possibly be re-used)

[Alliance]

Originally Posted by VivaLFuego

It would require building a whole new upscale entertainment disctrict (this has to be upscale or da mare ain't interested), which would also mean ancillary costs like moving the Greyhound bus depot, streetscaping, fighting with landowners over rezonings to encourage redevelopment, etc. It would be great if it would happen, but it would be an incredibly expensive and time consuming process to make it happen.

Eaxctly.

[aaron38]

Originally Posted by VivaLFuego

The Post Office is intriguing, but a distant second to the Congress site. Distant second because 1) I can't really fathom the cost effectiveness and 2) while its transport access is decent, it is in a wasteland in terms of hotel/entertainment amenities.

But isn't that the point, to spur redevelopment and expand the vibrant areas of downtown?
If you put the casino on Michigan ave, then an already busy area just becomes overcrowded, and a wasteland stays a wasteland.

[Haworthia]

I have to agree with Alliance, put it in the old Post Office. It would spur development in that area and bring to life another part of downtown.

It would save an iconic building.

It would be a novelty. Putting it there would grab headlines. I think we'd be more likely to get people from out of state if we put it there. Where as Block 37, it may be the most logical choice, but it isn't the most exciting choice.

Also, I think putting near any area that is booming would be a disaster. For instance, near McCormick. The South loop and near Southside seem to be doing OK all by themselves in terms of development.

No matter where it would go, it needs to be near the loop. I suppose that goes without saying.

Old Post Office!

[honte]

Originally Posted by Loopy

All of this talk about Carbide and Carbon's "crown" makes me wonder about whether there was a "spire" at one time.

In the Hard Rock Hotel, there is a beautiful green terra-cotta tapering "column" in the adjacent China Grill and a more pointed matching piece on the roof of the low-rise section of the building. The color matches the terra-cotta of the building perfectly.

I have always wondered whether this "spire" was once mounted on the "crown" and removed for safety reasons.

Anybody know what I'm talking about?

Hi Loopy,

That piece was a new fabrication by Mr. LaGrange's office, in an attempt to tie the modern addition into the old. I am not aware of any extra material ever being atop the Carbide and Carbon; I believe the original drawings show it pretty much as-is. Nice idea though!

[nomarandlee]

The thing about the post office it is so large that it could fit what many stand alone resort casinos in Las Vegas do and put many of those amenities (a club, some bars, few restaurants, production theater) all inside the OPO. Not to mention I think the South end of the Union Station parking lot could be fused together with the OPO and serve as a connecting complext/hotel. The transit access isn't just good it is amazing. Arguably the best anywhere in the city with its proximity to Metra, Amtrak, Blue Line, and the IKE. Also I think it would make sense to have a new bus depot somewhere over by the Clinton blue line and Metra as well. I have always thought that the Greyhound was built a few blocks too far west.

I agree with those who say that Block 37 and The Congress are too close to the city center. Yes, they very well may be successful and increase traffic to those areas but those areas already are near attractions and will have functions that serve their purpose without putting an awkward mix of casino right in the middle.

It is just as important to ask how big the casino the city wants and what exactly we want to get from it. From what I have read the intention seems to be a mega complex of near Vegas proportion and not a complementing venue and if that is the case then I especially think the OPO is the one that make sense.

[Ch.G, Ch.G]

Originally Posted by Loopy

I would vote for the Post Office and Navy Pier as the best Locations; Congress Hotel and Riverside Park as the worst.

I wish there were a suitable location along Ohio. That corridor's so close to being endearingly kitschy... a glitzy casino, I'm sure, would really do the trick.

[forumly_chgoman]

I go w/ the old post office...I think it could serve to segue area in the south loop, the loop and west loop..all these areas are seeing burgeoning development growth this could serve as part of the grout holding it all together..

It could be amazing

[forumly_chgoman]

At 2.5 million sq ft how would this compare w/ a typical vegas style casino?

[GregBear24]

Why can't we create a resort with a hotel and casino on the lake somewhere? Maybe a little south of mccormick place with a nice new beach? I would like to see a casino be targeted and mostly available to tourists/ other visitors who have a lot of dough instead of yours truly wasting his money away there, which doesn't seem to get our city anywhere when it's all said and done if the money coming from the casino to build transit comes from the same people who use the transit- doesn't that defeat the general purpose of it all? We have a beautiful coastline, so why can't we do a better job at showcasing it to outsiders? My friends from Indiana didn't even know we had amazing sandy beaches until I showed them this summer, and if they don't know then I'm assuming most of the world doesn't either. With that unrealistic statement out of the way, I'm for mccormick or old post office.

[forumly_chgoman]

^^^The beaches must remain public...not some gated, walled of coven of well to do hi-steppers

[firstcranialnerve]

I have a question about Chicago's lack of underground shopping systems. If you go to Sydney, China or Japan, you will find extremely extensive underground shopping walkways and systems what link up to businesses, shopping centers, train stations, public buildings, theaters etc, all from teh underground. I grew up in Sydney and Chicago and Sydney has winters around 50 -65 at coldest, yet they still have such an extensive system. Whereas here in Chicago, the underground between the train and Daley is shocking and horrible to walk through, as well as being extremely short, with almost no decent stores or shopping malls connected. While i don't give block 37 any love, it may be the start of the kind of underground linkage system Chicago needs. At least I hope so... Is there some kind of reason these systems haven't been developed here? I think it is because the trains are elevated. In China now, they are developing miles and miles of these linked systems underground as we type. Montreal also has a great underground system. Can we use what we have and make a great underground system here?

Wiki: Underground Cities
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Underground_city

[trvlr70]

Originally Posted by VivaLFuego

Congress Hotel is definitely the best location, in my opinion.


)

No way! That hotel has gorgeous bones and public areas....even if they are in a current state of disrepair. This hotel will eventually be sold and refurbished into its original 5-star status. A casino would not help IMHO.

[Mr Downtown]

Originally Posted by firstcranialnerve

Is there some kind of reason [underground pedway] systems haven't been developed here?

Because they suck the life off the sidewalks, there was a sort of policy in the 80s and 90s to discourage them, particularly over-street skyways. In places like Charlotte and Dallas, skyway systems got to be known as "honky tubes" because the office workers stayed in their hermetically sealed environments and the only people left on the sidewalks were poor folks waiting for a bus.

Chicago does have a fair-sized underground system, but two chunks of the main east-west spine have been closed for the last several years: Block 37 and the Heritage site. Chicago also has a lot of through-block passages that allow the cognoscenti to move several blocks through the Loop with only a few brief dashes across streets.

[jpIllInoIs]

^ From what Ive seen skywalks tend to really kill the sidewalk activity. In Minneapolis you can make an argument for them because their winters are even more brutal than Chicago. But in Des Moines, the skyway system has had a deafening affect on the pedestrian - sidewalk activity even in the summer.

[Alliance]

Originally Posted by GregBear24

We have a beautiful coastline, so why can't we do a better job at showcasing it to outsiders?

Because our coastline is not for developing and is for PUBLIC use.

Period.

[Nowhereman1280]

Originally Posted by Alliance

Because our coastline is not for developing and is for PUBLIC use.

Period.

I agree, what good is "showcasing" our coastline to outsiders if we can't even use it ourselves. There are much better ways of showing off our coastline, like better integrating it with already hot neighborhoods, a la the plan to cover up the McCormick staging lots for a park or the Olympic village...

If we had a few billion sitting around I would say to sink all of Lakeshore drive South of downtown, the north is already very integrated with the lake despite LSD and that leg has probably the best skyline views in the world.

[Alliance]

If we had a few billion I'd be enacting a few Chicago Prizes, ibut first and formost, building an Olympic stadium in place of Smith's POS obs tower in the lake.