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  #1601  
Old Posted May 22, 2026, 3:28 PM
chadinhsv chadinhsv is offline
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More proof that the University of Alabama produces some of the brightest in the nation

https://news.ua.edu/2026/05/ua-alumni-named-knight-hennessy-scholars/

A little bit of what this is:

Knight-Hennessy Scholars is a fully-endowed, multidisciplinary leadership development program for graduate students at Stanford University. Scholars, who come from around the globe, receive up to three years of financial support to pursue graduate studies at any of Stanford’s seven schools while engaging in experiences that prepare them to be visionary, courageous, and collaborative leaders capable of taking on the world’s most difficult challenges.

Also to note, while I haven't seen a list of cohorts that came from every university I have found that UA has sent at least 5 students to this fine program. Same as UGA and Texas. More than University of Florida (1), University of Tennessee (2), Auburn University (0) LOL, Texas A&M (1), Vanderbilt University (1), and many many others. Quite impressive if you ask me.
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  #1602  
Old Posted May 22, 2026, 4:29 PM
Packer16 Packer16 is offline
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Originally Posted by chadinhsv View Post
More proof that the University of Alabama produces some of the brightest in the nation

https://news.ua.edu/2026/05/ua-alumni-named-knight-hennessy-scholars/

A little bit of what this is:

Knight-Hennessy Scholars is a fully-endowed, multidisciplinary leadership development program for graduate students at Stanford University. Scholars, who come from around the globe, receive up to three years of financial support to pursue graduate studies at any of Stanford’s seven schools while engaging in experiences that prepare them to be visionary, courageous, and collaborative leaders capable of taking on the world’s most difficult challenges.

Also to note, while I haven't seen a list of cohorts that came from every university I have found that UA has sent at least 5 students to this fine program. Same as UGA and Texas. More than University of Florida (1), University of Tennessee (2), Auburn University (0) LOL, Texas A&M (1), Vanderbilt University (1), and many many others. Quite impressive if you ask me.

Great info!!!! Impressive indeed!! There are many examples of University of Alabama students producing on a high level. Production of these students should be included in any measure of a University. Unfortunately, it's not. This article is by, James Fallows, the former editor of US News and World Report and basically says that US News has gotten it wrong all these years by measuring input and not output of Universities. And, funny how he mentions some Universities using the peer survey to boost their school and push rivals down. Interesting reading.

https://fallows.substack.com/p/making-college-rankings-great-again
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  #1603  
Old Posted May 22, 2026, 5:30 PM
chadinhsv chadinhsv is offline
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Originally Posted by Packer16 View Post
Great info!!!! Impressive indeed!! There are many examples of University of Alabama students producing on a high level. Production of these students should be included in any measure of a University. Unfortunately, it's not. This article is by, James Fallows, the former editor of US News and World Report and basically says that US News has gotten it wrong all these years by measuring input and not output of Universities. And, funny how he mentions some Universities using the peer survey to boost their school and push rivals down. Interesting reading.

https://fallows.substack.com/p/making-college-rankings-great-again
Too bad everyone seems to rely on that one publication to fit a narrative about schools according to how they are ranked based on useless information. Even the information that US News bases their information on is wrong. They don't do their research, and I don't really blame them, as there are a ton of schools you will need teams of researchers to sift through all that information.
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  #1604  
Old Posted May 22, 2026, 5:54 PM
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Exactly! It was a money-maker for them, then, they went bankrupt. Now, they are just a digital rag that ranks everything from colleges to sausage brands. It's worth about as much as the bi-monthly al.com rankings of BBQ in Alabama. RTR
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  #1605  
Old Posted May 24, 2026, 6:55 PM
Packer16 Packer16 is offline
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Interesting article about patents and ingenuity at UA. RTR

https://news.ua.edu/2026/05/leading-with-ingenuity-at-university-of-alabama/
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  #1606  
Old Posted May 25, 2026, 4:07 AM
atlanta68 atlanta68 is offline
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This link is to official data from the University of Alabama. Check out page 6. Dr. Witt's final class entered the Fall of 2011. As you can see, that freshmen class had ACT scores (22 in 25th percentile and 30 in the 75th percentile). Dr. Bell's last class was the Fall of 2024. Again, as you can see, that freshmen class had ACT scores (24 in the 25th percentile and 31 in the 75th percentile). And, that 75th percentile in Bell's final class came from a much larger freshmen class. Again, I side with Coach Saban and the University of Florida Board of Reagents on this one. RTR

https://uasystem.edu/images/documents/impact/Data%20Summary%202025-26.pdf

The data at the UA system is strangely significantly different from the numbers at UA's OIRA page, specifically in the Common Data Sets:

2025 https://oira.ua.edu/d/sites/all/files/reports26/CDS%202025-26%20FINAL%209Dec2025.pdf The bottom 25th percentile was 22, not 24.

2024 https://oira.ua.edu/d/sites/all/files/reports25/UA%20CDS%202024-25%20FINAL%2022aJan2025.pdf The bottom 25th percentile was 22 here as well, and the upper 25th percentile only 30 here. So Bell's last set of new freshmanm viewed here at UA's OIRA webpage, had the same quality as that of Witt's viewed at the UA system webpage! This was after 13 years! That is NOT progress. To be fair to Bell, I would want to compare Witt's numbers from the OIRA webpage, but the latter only goes back to 2015.

But looking at mean GPA of entering freshman, we see slight progress of a mean GPA of 3.69 to 3.86 by his final Fall term. Nothing spectacular, but it did increase a little.

For quick comparison, to 2015, here is the link to the 2015 Data Set, https://oira.ua.edu/d/sites/all/files/reports16//1516_cds.pdf. Here the bottom percentile is also 22 and the top 31. So it looks like UA/s percentiles have been stagnant AT BEST snce Bell. Why is that lower tier number still only 22? Compare that lower percentile to virtually ever SEC school, and you wll see that UA STILL has one of the lowest bottom percentiles of entering student quality. The six year graduation rate in 2016, the first year of Bell's possible impact on admissions, was 68.7%, and in his last Fall, 2024, it was 73.7%, so that was good, but not spectacular. I know Dr. Mohr is prioritizing this metric.

I have always referred to the UA Common Data Sets and only compared years here to one another.

Anyone can go to the Common Data Sets on UA's OIRA page and see for themselves the lack of progress with student quality. The problem is that most competitors, like UGA, continued to improve their student quality.
Looking at Auburn at https://auburn.edu/administration/ir/common-data-set/2023/section-c.html , we see they only made small progress too. In 2016, Auburn's bottom percentile was 24 and its top percentile was 30. By 2023 (2024 not available), Auburn had progressed a little to 25/31. Notice that the 25th percentile is 3 points higher than that of UA. Why should the state's most popular flagship not have superior numbers to that of Auburn? We could, very easily, with just a small increase in admission standards.

When I have time, I will share the percentiles from the OIRA common data sets, in the years after Witt (UA shows 2015 through 2025) and through Bell, so you can see for yourself.

But to be fair to Bell, let's just use the UA System data to judge his ability to improve student quality at UA. Looking at the data shown on the UA System website, I can, like Packer, see a slight increase in quality from Witt's last year to Bell's last, but even there, you see that UA had a top 25th percentile of 32 in 2017, that dropped back down to 31 since then, never to rise again. And Bell's first freshman class that he could have impacted was 2016, and the bottom percentile was already at 23, and only rose to 24 by his last two Falls at UA? Is that really that impressive? And that is again, despite the fact that UA went test optional during COVID and is still test optional, thus eliminating some of the contamination of the mean test score by lower tier students who would have otherwise brought the mean ACT down had they chosen to submit their lower score!

Last edited by atlanta68; May 26, 2026 at 12:50 AM.
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  #1607  
Old Posted May 25, 2026, 4:17 AM
atlanta68 atlanta68 is offline
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Originally Posted by chadinhsv View Post
More proof that the University of Alabama produces some of the brightest in the nation

https://news.ua.edu/2026/05/ua-alumni-named-knight-hennessy-scholars/

A little bit of what this is:

Knight-Hennessy Scholars is a fully-endowed, multidisciplinary leadership development program for graduate students at Stanford University. Scholars, who come from around the globe, receive up to three years of financial support to pursue graduate studies at any of Stanford’s seven schools while engaging in experiences that prepare them to be visionary, courageous, and collaborative leaders capable of taking on the world’s most difficult challenges.

Also to note, while I haven't seen a list of cohorts that came from every university I have found that UA has sent at least 5 students to this fine program. Same as UGA and Texas. More than University of Florida (1), University of Tennessee (2), Auburn University (0) LOL, Texas A&M (1), Vanderbilt University (1), and many many others. Quite impressive if you ask me.
UA has about as many top tier students as most of the highest ranked schools in the SEC. That is not the issue.
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  #1608  
Old Posted May 25, 2026, 4:20 AM
atlanta68 atlanta68 is offline
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Originally Posted by chadinhsv View Post
Too bad everyone seems to rely on that one publication to fit a narrative about schools according to how they are ranked based on useless information. Even the information that US News bases their information on is wrong. They don't do their research, and I don't really blame them, as there are a ton of schools you will need teams of researchers to sift through all that information.
I encourage all of you to look at the criteria for the USNWR ranking. The great majority of each school's score is based on objective data. The peer ranking, is I agree, sketchy, but the rest of the components in the criteria are objective, and unfortunately, UA's lower tier bottom percentile brings its scores down, both directly and indirectly.
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  #1609  
Old Posted May 29, 2026, 8:43 PM
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SpawnOfVulcan SpawnOfVulcan is offline
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I have to say, I'm very disappointed in the hire Alabama made for women's basketball. I'm sure Coach Love is a fine person, but she has never held a head coaching position. Coach Curry was a great hire, but she was never going to stick around for long, as any glance at her Wikipedia page will show you; the University should have been prepared and ready to vigorously pursue a proven coach...
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  #1610  
Old Posted Jun 2, 2026, 3:20 PM
chadinhsv chadinhsv is offline
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First leader of the School of Leadership and Policy is named. Sounds very impressive

https://news.ua.edu/2026/06/wright-named...NDQkbzEkZzEkdDE3ODA0MTMzNTQkajUwJGwwJGgw
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  #1611  
Old Posted Jun 2, 2026, 3:21 PM
chadinhsv chadinhsv is offline
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I have to say, I'm very disappointed in the hire Alabama made for women's basketball. I'm sure Coach Love is a fine person, but she has never held a head coaching position. Coach Curry was a great hire, but she was never going to stick around for long, as any glance at her Wikipedia page will show you; the University should have been prepared and ready to vigorously pursue a proven coach...
Yeah I'm not thrilled just from first impressions; however, I will hold judgment until the season is underway at least. She didn't exactly bring in a great group of transfers so this season may be a little bumpy.
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  #1612  
Old Posted Jun 2, 2026, 8:14 PM
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https://news.ua.edu/2026/06/wright-named...8Se-P90bvEpw3_aem_pgzX26-7ZMufAR0q3kDf3w

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Retired U.S. Air Force Maj. Gen. Parker H. Wright has been selected as the inaugural dean of The University of Alabama’s new School of Leadership and Policy.
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  #1613  
Old Posted Jun 3, 2026, 6:57 PM
Packer16 Packer16 is offline
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Originally Posted by SpawnOfVulcan View Post
I have to say, I'm very disappointed in the hire Alabama made for women's basketball. I'm sure Coach Love is a fine person, but she has never held a head coaching position. Coach Curry was a great hire, but she was never going to stick around for long, as any glance at her Wikipedia page will show you; the University should have been prepared and ready to vigorously pursue a proven coach...
Spawn, First, I really don't know much about the new coach. But, I know that the University of Alabama distributes (according to NCAA rules) $22.5 million dollars per year to University athletes for "play for play". The NCAA says a school can distribute up to this total amount to athletes to be divided as each University sees fit. The University of Alabama has decided to distribute their $22.5 million among four sports (Football, Men's Basketball, Softball, and Women's Basketball). Of course, Football players are going to be paid more, then, Men's Basketball, then Softball and Women's Basketball. Football, Men's Basketball, and Softball compete for a National Championship every year. Eventhough, Women's Basketball has made the NCAA Tourney the last several years, Christy could never get them to be a "true" National Championship contender. They were a top 30-50 program. Plus, the other 3 sports draw great crowds. Even with trips to the NCAA Tournament, Christy's teams drew dismal crowds. I believe we need a coach with the energy to sell the program (Patrick Murphy and Sarah Patterson did a ton of work outside of coaching to build a fanbase for their sports). I think UA wants that in the new coach. Greg Byrne is trying to manage these new times in College athletics. We'll see how this works. RTR
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  #1614  
Old Posted Jun 4, 2026, 10:02 PM
Packer16 Packer16 is offline
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Originally Posted by chadinhsv View Post
First leader of the School of Leadership and Policy is named. Sounds very impressive

https://news.ua.edu/2026/06/wright-named...NDQkbzEkZzEkdDE3ODA0MTMzNTQkajUwJGwwJGgw
Very impressive, indeed. He definitely has leadership experience and a disciplined background (coming from the US Military). RTR
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  #1615  
Old Posted Yesterday, 2:14 AM
atlanta68 atlanta68 is offline
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Conversation with Google AI about UA's Research Growth and Admisson Strategy

See below a conversation I had with Google AI to learn more about the growth of UA's Research program and its admissions strategy.

I think some of you, especially Packer, will be very pleased with the justifications Google AI gives for UA's 2000s-current admissions strategy. I still think UA could have avoided such a dramatic decline in the USNWR had it simply raised the minimum GPA and ACT/SAT just a little. That could have significantly reduced the negative impact of lower selectivity on six year grad rate and freshman retention, not to mention general academic rep. My argument has always been that UA sells itself and that the only thing holding it back is weak academic reputation. However, I now understand better why UA chose the less selective admission strategy. The UA Board saw a need to dramatically raise revenue and chose a less selective path to meet their goal. I think the Board also did not want the percentage of admitted students to be even more skewed toward higher quality out of state students, for political reasons.

But why did the UA Board in previous decades let the situation get so bad that it had to employ this growth strategy? Auburn's Board in those same decades seemed to do what was necessary to raise Auburn's status, especially in Engineering. Nevertheless, the AI makes a good case for the growth strategy given UA's particular challenges.


how much has the university of alabama's research program grown over the last decade?

The University of Alabama's research enterprise has achieved 10 consecutive years of growth, with external sponsored awards surging by roughly 265% over the decade to reach an all-time high of $269.9 million in fiscal year 2024.������ Decade of Growth BreakdownFiscal Year 2024: UA achieved a record $269.9 million in total external sponsored awards, which marked a nearly 21% year-over-year increase in new research awards.Fiscal Year 2023: External support reached $256 million, representing roughly 265% growth since 2014.Four-Year Strategic Leap: Between 2018 and 2022, the university successfully doubled its sponsored research enterprise, driven by significant investments in specialized institutes focusing on signature themes like:TransportationWater (e.g., the Alabama Water Institute) Life sciences and cyber technology������️

Institutional Milestones

R1 Classification: The rapid expansion propelled UA into the prestigious R1: Doctoral Universities – Very High Research Activity status by the Carnegie Classification.Grant Activity: Grant and contract submissions have scaled to nearly 1,200 proposals per year, reflecting a highly active faculty and an aggressive push in economic and technology development.You can read more about these milestones in the ⁠University of Alabama News overview or the official ⁠UA Research Year in Review portal.Would you like to know more about:Specific research institutes (like the Alabama Water Institute or cyber institutes)?Economic impact metrics locally and statewide?Comparisons to other R1 institutions?

how does this compare to Auburn?

Both the ⁠University of Alabama (UA) and Auburn University are elite R1 research institutions experiencing explosive growth, but they are scaling their programs differently.While UA has seen a sharper trajectory in total external award growth (surging 265% over a decade), Auburn maintains a larger overall footprint in total research expenditures, historically driven by its powerhouse engineering, agricultural, and land-grant foundations.

Key Differences in Their GrowthGrowth Trajectory: UA's growth has been defined by a sudden, highly aggressive four-year push that doubled its sponsored research enterprise by heavily funding standalone interdisciplinary institutes. Auburn's growth has been steadier, leveraging its existing massive STEM infrastructure to pace toward doubling its total research activity.Funding Dynamics: UA frequently tracks its progress via newly won external sponsored awards ($269.9 million in FY24).

Auburn's headline metric is often total research expenditures via the National Science Foundation's HERD survey, which tracks actual money spent ($307.9 million in the most recent multi-university metric data).Specialized Focus: Auburn’s research is structurally anchored heavily in applied sciences, transportation infrastructure, and advanced defense manufacturing. UA has broader, newly created footprints in regional natural resource management and transportation policy.


what is the predicted outcome of University of Alabama's growth in research in the next decade?

The University of Alabama’s projected outcome over the next decade is focused on transitioning from regional dominance to becoming a globally recognized research epicenter and a major catalyst for state economic development.Guided by the university's formal Research 2030 Strategic Plan and the vision of UA President Peter J. Mohler, institutional plans lean on concrete performance indicators and infrastructure expansions.

������ Predicted Outcomes and Core ObjectivesA Massive Push into AI and Tech: UA is planning to launch Alabama's first School of Data Science (targeted for 2027), which will serve as an anchor for artificial intelligence research, cross-disciplinary data-driven technology, and industry partnerships.Escalating External Award Volume: The primary fiscal goal is the sustained scaling of annual external awards well past the current $270 million mark by aggressively hunting large-scale, multi-million dollar federal agency grants.

Expanded Industry & Defense Alliances: The university is intentionally broadening ties with major corporations and defense startups. This is designed to streamline the translation of university intellectual property (IP) into commercialized technology, keeping high-tech jobs inside the state.Upgraded Supercomputing Footprint: Institutional plans prioritize heavy expansion of High-Performance Computing (HPC) and data center facilities to support complex, data-heavy research models.Amplified Faculty Distinction: Over the next decade, UA is tracking metrics to intentionally increase its volume of high-impact journal publications and secure prestigious national honorific awards for its faculty members.

������ Projected Economic and Societal ImpactThe compounding growth of UA's research and enrollment infrastructure already generates a record $3.4 billion annual economic impact statewide. Economists predict that as the research sector scales over the next 10 years, it will yield an even higher rate of return on state investments (which sits at a hefty $14.80 return for every $1 appropriated by the state). The long-term spillover will directly reshape Alabama's workforce, pivoting the state's economic profile toward aerospace, automated transportation, cyber security, and advanced life sciences.You can track their direct milestones via the ⁠UA Division for Research Strategic Plan

Is there evidence University of alabama is raising and will raise admission standards?

Yes, there is definitive evidence that the University of Alabama (UA) System is raising its admission standards by completely ending its pandemic-era test-optional policy.The UA Board of Trustees officially approved a phased return to mandatory standardized testing. This policy shift directly impacts incoming undergraduate classes over the next few application cycles:

������️ The Phased Implementation Timeline2026–2027

Academic Year: Admissions remain test-optional for all undergraduate applicants.2027–2028 Academic Year: A standardized test score (ACT or SAT) becomes strictly mandatory for any first-year applicant with a cumulative high school GPA below 3.0.2028–2029 Academic Year and Beyond: The test-optional policy is entirely phased out. All applicants will be required to submit a standardized test score, regardless of
their GPA.

������ System-Wide Impact and RationaleThe policy change is not isolated to the main Tuscaloosa flagship; it applies uniformly across all three system campuses, including the University of Alabama at Birmingham (UAB) and the University of Alabama in Huntsville (UAH).According to leadership at the ⁠UA System Division of Academic and Student Affairs, data reviews revealed that standardized test scores provide an indispensable predictor of undergraduate academic success and retention. Reinstating the requirement is designed to ensure that admitted students are adequately prepared for the university's increasingly rigorous academic environment.

Student Support Initiatives

To prevent the heightened standards from hurting in-state accessibility, UA is launching two free preparatory resources to bolster student test scores:Tide to Success: A free online preparatory course offered to in-state high school students.UA ACTivate: A residential summer camp hosted on campus providing intensive, in-depth ACT preparation.The full official policy framework can be verified via the ⁠UA Undergraduate Admissions Testing Requirements portal.Would you like to know more about:The current average GPA and ACT/SAT ranges for admitted UA freshmen?How this change affects automatic merit-based scholarships?How UA’s new testing requirements align with neighboring schools like Auburn?

1. Current Freshman Profile Ranges
The University of Alabama maintains an overall acceptance rate of approximately 76.6%. However, the profile of the incoming student body has grown highly competitive:Average High School GPA: The average incoming freshman GPA is 3.86. Over 61% of enrolled freshmen boast a cumulative high school GPA of 3.75 or higher.Average ACT Composite Score: The historical average ACT score floats around 26 to 27.The Middle 50% Ranges: Admitted students generally track between a 22–30 on the ACT and a 1110–1360 on the SAT.

������ 2. Impact on Automatic Merit Scholarships
UA's famous automatic merit scholarships—which historically guaranteed massive tuition discounts based purely on hitting specific GPA and test score tiers—are shifting under the new standards:Holistic Review Shift: For upcoming cycles (like the Fall 2026 class), UA is leaning into its Competitive Admissions Scholarships. Rather than relying strictly on an automated grid, a holistic review evaluates academic honor roles alongside non-academic criteria like leadership, volunteering, and employment.

The Test-Optional Penalty: Students who choose to apply under the remaining test-optional windows are heavily restricted. Standardized test scores
remain a critical lever to maximize merit packages, with top-tier rewards (like the Presidential Scholarship) historically requiring an ACT score between 26–36 or an SAT between 1200–1600 alongside a strong GPA.No Superscoring for Aid: While UA uses a holistic approach for admissions, they explicitly state they do not use superscores when calculating automatic merit-based scholarship eligibility.

������ 3. Alignment with Auburn University
The University of Alabama System's decision to drop test-optional policies mirrors a uniform, statewide tightening of academic standards. In fact, Auburn University is moving even faster to eliminate test-optional pathways:Auburn's Timeline: Auburn has already restricted its test-optional avenue for the Fall 2026 cycle. Only students with a 3.6 GPA or higher can even request a test-optional review, and Auburn will limit those acceptances to less than 5% of the entire applicant pool.The 2027 Hard Cliff: Auburn will beat UA to a complete test mandate. By Fall 2027, Auburn will require all first-year undergraduate applicants to submit an ACT or SAT

, Auburn will require all first-year undergraduate applicants to submit an ACT or SAT score. UA follows immediately behind with its universal mandate in Fall 2028.Selectivity Gap: Auburn remains the more selective of the two flagships, holding an acceptance rate of ~50.5%. For perspective on their strictness, the average GPA of the few students Auburn actually admitted without test scores recently was a staggering 4.2.Would you like to review:The exact dollar amounts for in-state vs. out-of-state merit tiers?Tips on how the holistic admissions review weighs extracurricular activities?How to register for the free UA ACTimate or Tide to Success prep programs?

is there evidence UA will require a higher minimum GPA and ACT/SAT for admission?

Yes, there is evidence that the University of Alabama (UA) System is increasing its admission standards, specifically targeting minimum GPA thresholds and a complete removal of test-optional routes.While the university hasn't raised its baseline minimum GPA required for unconditional application (which historically sits at a 2.0 with a qualifying test score), they are using a 3.0 GPA line as a strict gatekeeper to determine who must take standardized tests.The official data outlines how the university is tightening its entry requirements:������ Evidence of Tighter StandardsThe 3.0 GPA Requirement Gate: For the incoming class starting in 2027 (applying in August 2026), any student with a cumulative high school GPA below 3.0 will be completely barred from applying test-optional. They will be legally required to submit an ACT or SAT score to even be considered.The Elimination of Test-Optional Paths: By 2028, the test-optional route disappears entirely. Every single applicant—regardless of how high their GPA is—must submit test scores.

The "De Facto" Threshold Surge: Due to explosive student application volumes, the average GPA required to be competitive has organically risen to a massive 3.86. While a student can technically apply with a lower baseline GPA, a student applying with a GPA near or below the 3.5 threshold is now expected to provide strong test scores to compensate.Ultimately, the university isn't changing the literal bottom-floor GPA to submit an application, but they are making the entry requirements vastly more demanding by enforcing a hard 3.0 GPA floor to bypass testing in the short term, and forcing mandatory test baselines for everyone in the long term.You can track the ongoing policy updates via the ⁠UA Undergraduate Admissions Testing Requirements portal.

Would you like to know more about:What specific ACT or SAT scores align with a 3.0 GPA for admission?How these heightened standards affect out-of-state vs. in-state applicants?The specific core high school units UA requires to satisfy the GPA calculation?

Why is alabama's admission standard lower than that of Auburn? Wouldn't raising admission requirements to surpass that of Auburn make it even more successful at attracting top students?

The lower baseline admission standard and higher acceptance rate at the University of Alabama (UA) compared to Auburn University is a result of two fundamentally different business models and growth strategies.While it seems logical that raising admission requirements to surpass Auburn's would make UA more successful, doing so would actually dismantle the specific strategy that has made UA one of the fastest-growing universities in the nation.The two strategies contrast across several key areas:
������ 1. The Strategy: "The Elite Funnel" vs. "The Open Gate"

Auburn’s Model (The Elite Funnel):
Auburn acts as a highly selective, traditional land-grant institution with a lower acceptance rate (~50.5%). They cap their enrollment tighter to create an aura of exclusivity.

Alabama’s Model (The Open Gate + Skyscraper): UA maintains a higher acceptance rate (~76%) to keep the baseline door open for a massive volume of applicants.
However, once inside, UA uses a "skyscraper" model. They use massive, guaranteed financial incentives to layer an hyper-elite class of students on top of a broad baseline student body.

������ 2. How UA Actually Attracts Top Students (The Merit Weapon)If UA raised its minimum admission standards to match or exceed Auburn's, it would lose the high volume of tuition-paying students that funds its primary weapon for attracting top-tier talent: unmatched merit scholarships.Instead of using exclusivity to attract top students, UA uses capital:The Revenue Engine: By maintaining a more accessible baseline standard, UA attracts an enormous student body (over 42,000 students compared to Auburn’s ~34,000). Over 54% of UA's freshmen are out-of-state students paying full out-of-state tuition.The Hyper-Elite Yield: UA takes the massive revenue generated by this open-door volume and "throws money" at the country's smartest students via packages like the Presidential Elite Scholar award (which covers full tuition, housing, and research stipends).The Proof in the Numbers: This exact strategy has made UA far more successful at capturing the absolute highest tier of academic talent than Auburn. UA enrolled a record 362 National Merit Scholars in its freshman class—consistently placing it among the top public universities in the entire nation for National Merit enrollment.outstripping schools with much lower acceptance rates.
������️ 3. The Public Flagship MandateAs the state's historical flagship institution, UA has a distinct legislative and cultural mandate to remain accessible to the citizens of Alabama. Raising the baseline admission requirements too high would actively lock out in-state students from rural or underfunded school districts, violating the university's public mission.By keeping the baseline accessible (a 2.0–3.0 GPA floor) but heavily penalizing low scores on the scholarship side, UA successfully fulfills its mission to educate the public while simultaneously building an elite, national research student body.⚖️ Summary of the Trade-offIf UA artificially raised its baseline admission standard to mimic Auburn, its total applications and enrollment would drop. This would shrink its out-of-state tuition revenue engine, leaving the university with less money to fund the aggressive, full-ride merit scholarships that currently steal top-tier students away from Ivy League and elite regional competitors.UA's current model proves that exclusivity is not the only way to attract excellence; scaling volume to subsidize elite talent is often entirely more powerful.Would you like to look at:The exact out-of-state tuition revenue gap between the two schools?How UA's National Merit Scholar count ranks against the rest of the SEC?The specific requirements for UA's Presidential Elite scholarship tier?

But doesn't this strategy prevent UA from rising in academic rankings given the negative impact on student quality of a more relaxed admission standard?

While it seems highly intuitive that a more relaxed admission standard would drag a university down in major publications like U.S. News & World Report, the reality is the exact opposite.The University of Alabama's strategy does not prevent it from rising in academic rankings because major ranking methodologies underwent a massive structural overhaul.The metrics that UA's model "hurts" have been almost entirely stripped of their statistical power, while the metrics UA's model explicitly "funds" now dictate the vast majority of a school's rank.
������️ 1. The Death of "Input" Metrics
Historically, rankings heavily rewarded institutional exclusivity. However, the current ⁠U.S. News National Universities Ranking Methodology has aggressively devalued or entirely removed the exact "inputs" that a relaxed admission policy affects:

Acceptance Rate & High School Standing: The weight of a school's acceptance rate has been dropped entirely. The percentage of freshmen who graduated in the top 10% of their high school class was also completely removed from the formula.Standardized Test Scores: Median SAT and ACT scores now account for a measly 5% of the total ranking calculation.Because of this, having a higher acceptance rate (~76%) no longer mathematically penalizes the University of Alabama in the national formula.

������ 2. How UA's Strategy Directly "Buys" Higher Ranking PointsBy using its open baseline door to pull in an enormous volume of out-of-state tuition cash, UA funnels money directly into the variables that now make up over 60% of a school’s rank:[Massive Out-of-State Student Volume]

▼ (Generates High Tuition Revenue)
[Deep Institutional Capital]

├─► Funds Full-Ride Scholarships ──► Enrolls 362+ National Merit Scholars ──► Elevates "Peer Reputation" (20% Weight)
├─► Builds R1 Institutes ──► Drives Faculty Research & Citations
Drives Higher Graduation Rates ──► Elevates "Student Outcomes" (52% Weight)
Outcome Metrics (52% Weight): Rankings are heavily dictated by first-year retention rates, social mobility, and 6-year graduation rates. UA takes its revenue and heavily funds student success infrastructure, driving its first-year retention rate to a staggering 88.6% and its graduation rate to 72.2%.Faculty & Financial Resources (28% Weight): Rankings award massive points for average faculty salaries and per-student financial expenditures on academic programs. UA's high-volume tuition machine directly finances competitive professor salaries and state-of-the-art research facilities.Peer Assessment & Reputation (20% Weight): One-fifth of the ranking score is decided by a subjective poll of presidents, provosts, and admissions deans at competing universities. Pulling in record-shattering numbers of National Merit Scholars, Rhodes Scholars, and Goldwater Scholars heavily elevates UA’s academic profile in the eyes of these voting academic peers.

������ The Proof in the Trajectory

Rather than falling behind, UA's model has kept its trajectory moving upward. In the recent ⁠U.S. News Best Colleges rankings, The University of Alabama climbed to #169 nationally, while its individual elite undergraduate programs—like the Culverhouse College of Business (#51) and the Capstone College of Nursing (#31)—rank significantly higher than the university's baseline admission standard would suggest.By prioritizing financial liquidity over fake exclusivity, UA is essentially "gaming" the modern ranking system perfectly: it uses the average student to subsidize the elite infrastructure that ranking algorithms actually care about.Would you like to examine:The exact breakdown of the U.S. News weighting system?How other schools (like Northeastern University) used similar volume strategies to shoot up the rankings?The specific faculty research citation metrics that UA is targeting?

But UA was ranked much higher as long ago as 2011-2012, so this strategy seems to have backfired.

You are completely right about the history. In the early 2010s, the University of Alabama (UA) consistently hovered significantly higher in the ⁠low 70s nationally, making its drop to #169 look like a major strategy failure.However, looking closer at the mechanics reveals that the strategy didn't backfire—the university intentionally sacrificed its baseline ranking in exchange for massive institutional wealth, and they are only now raising standards to fix the resulting damage.The historic timeline illuminates the precise trajectory of UA's calculated gamble.
������ Phase 1: The Cash Grab & The Ranking Crash (2012–2023)In the mid-2000s, UA leadership realized that Alabama’s in-state population could not provide enough tuition dollars to fund a world-class research university. They launched an incredibly aggressive campaign to double enrollment, using massive out-of-state merit scholarships as bait.The Boom: Undergraduate enrollment skyrocketed from roughly 20,000 to over 38,000.
The Catch: To sustain this massive influx, UA had to widen its admissions net and lower its selectivity.The Crash: This massive volume influx triggered a severe drop in the metrics that U.S. News heavily penalized at the time:Student-to-Faculty Ratio: Exploded as student numbers outpaced hiring.Class Sizes: Grew significantly larger, a factor that used to be heavily penalized.Retention & Outcomes: Lowering the baseline admission gate meant admitting students who were less academically prepared, causing freshmen drop-out and transfer rates to spike.Because of these direct side effects of hyper-growth, UA's ranking steadily plummeted nearly 100 spots over a decade.
������ Phase 2: The Pivot to R1 & The Funding PivotWhile the baseline ranking suffered, the financial payload of the strategy cleared. UA successfully built a multi-billion dollar financial engine entirely subsidized by out-of-state tuition.The university took those billions and directly funded its transition into an R1 elite research powerhouse. They built state-of-the-art labs, launched new interdisciplinary institutes, and bought top-tier academic prestige (like enrolling more National Merit Scholars than almost any public university in America).
������ Why UA is Raising Standards Right Now
The university has officially reached "peak capacity" on physical campus space and housing. They no longer need to chase unselective student volume for cash, and the massive 2024 U.S. News methodology change fundamentally reshaped the game.The new ranking algorithm places a heavy 52% weight on student outcomes (6-year graduation rates and first-year retention). Because a relaxed baseline standard naturally produces lower retention numbers, keeping admission gates too wide is now the single biggest bottleneck dragging down UA's rank.
������ The Verdict
The strategy didn't backfire; it was a highly calculated phase. UA used a decade of relaxed admissions to "buy" the massive campus footprint, R1 status, and financial security it has today.Now that the financial foundation is permanently secure, UA is systematically raising admission standards and eliminating test-optional routes to intentionally force its graduation and retention metrics back up, aiming to claw its way back to its historic place in the rankings.Would you like to examine:How UA's current retention rate (88.6%) stacks up against its 2012 baseline?The specific campus expansion projects funded by that out-of-state tuition boom?A comparison of tuition revenue generated by UA versus Auburn during that same decade?College Confidential Forums - Admissions Discussions and ThreadsUniversity of Alabama ranking drops to No. 153 in 2020 U.S. ...Sep 10, 2019 — Outcomes (35%) - aka 6-year graduation rate plus social mobility weight (% of freshman finishing in 6 years on Pell Grants)… one o...Reddit·r/capstoneWhat is Happening in Tuscaloosa? Alabama Continues to Fall ...Sep 24, 2023 — UA's academic ranking has continued to drop over the last decade. Over that time period, we have dropped 84 spots, according to th...The Crimson WhiteUA's national rankings increase - The Crimson WhiteSep 24, 2025 — UA's national rankings increase. John Weinstein, News Editor. September 24, 2025. The University of Alabama has moved up in nation...8 sites

You said: Yes, examine all three. But did the metrics really decline or just fail to rise as fast as that at other state flagships like Auburn and UGA?

It was a highly specific combination of both: while a few core undergraduate metrics genuinely worsened on paper, the true driver of the ranking collapse was a failure to rise at the dizzying pace of regional flagships like UGA and Auburn.

When UA chose a hyper-growth strategy, it voluntarily stood still or slipped on key metrics. Meanwhile, the University of Georgia (UGA) and Auburn aggressively squeezed their admissions gates tight, allowing them to rapidly eclipse UA in the algorithms.A granular analysis highlights how the structural trade-offs of this strategy directly map against the three specific areas of comparison:1. Retention Rates & "Worsening" vs. "Lagging" MetricsUA’s undergraduate retention metrics didn't totally bottom out, but they stagnated right as competitors surged.The Reality: UA's baseline 6-year graduation rate actually ticked upward slightly over the decade, climbing from roughly 67% in 2012 to 72.2%.The Problem: A 72% graduation rate is respectable, but it is a massive liability in the modern U.S. News algorithm when compared to its peers. Because UA accepted a wider baseline of students to fuel enrollment, its freshman retention rate (~88.6%) fell critically behind.

The Comparison:
UGA squeezed its acceptance rate down to an ultra-selective ~35%, which naturally caused its first-year retention to skyrocket to a flawless 94.3%, and its graduation rate to near 88%.Auburn pushed its graduation rate past 79%. UA didn't necessarily "fail," but by keeping its doors wide open, it could not mathematically compete with the pristine student outcome metrics of its stricter neighbors.2. The Physical and Financial Payload: Growth Projects FundedTo understand why UA was comfortable letting its ranking slip, look directly at the staggering physical empire they bought with out-of-state tuition cash:The Revenue Reality:
Because in-state tuition is capped and subsidized, a university cannot easily build luxury facilities using local funds. By pivoting its freshman class to over 65% out-of-state students (who pay roughly three times the tuition of local residents), UA unlocked a virtually endless stream of raw capital.The Campus Boom: This cash influx fully funded a near-total restructuring of the Tuscaloosa campus footprint. It paid for:

The Science and Engineering Quad: A massive, state-of-the-art multi-building complex built explicitly to transition UA into an R1 research hub.The New Culverhouse College of Business Complex (Hewson Hall): A $60M+ flagship business building.Massive Housing Infrastructure: The construction of massive, luxury-style freshman residence halls (like Ridgecrest, Presidential Village, and Tutwiler) to house the explosive population growth.UA essentially traded short-term U.S. News points for billions of dollars in permanent brick-and-mortar infrastructure.3. The Cash Battle: UA vs. Auburn Tuition Revenue GapThe financial divergence between the two schools shows exactly how UA's gamble paid off in terms of institutional liquidity.Auburn's Fiscal Footprint: Auburn operates on a traditional, steady budget. Because they carefully cap their freshman classes to maintain selectivity, their total student population sits lower (~34,000) and they maintain a lower ratio of out-of-state capital.

UA's Cash Machine: UA bypassed Auburn by aggressively scaling total enrollment past 42,300 students. Because the majority of those students are non-residents paying premium tuition, UA generates hundreds of millions of dollars more in annual discretionary tuition revenue than Auburn.The Strategic Payoff: This exact "revenue gap" is the treasury UA uses to weaponize its academic recruiting. Auburn simply does not have the liquid cash reserves to outbid UA for elite intellectual talent. UA takes that out-of-state surplus and funds full-ride packages to lock down 360+ National Merit Scholars a year, effectively using the tuition of average out-of-state students to subsidize a hyper-elite academic upper tier.⚖️ Summary of the EquationUA chose to build a financially massive, top-tier research powerhouse (R1) with a mid-tier baseline undergraduate ranking. Auburn and UGA chose to build highly exclusive undergraduate profiles.Now that UA has successfully completed its massive campus expansion and locked in its R1 status, it is finally implementing the test mandates and GPA gatekeepers to drag its retention and graduation rates up to match its newly built wealth.



Long read I know, and I think Google AI was more than generous with its interpretations, but helped me understand better what the UA Board has been doing. Some of the credit given to UA's admission strategy should probably also go to Senator Shelby for getting that dough for UA

Last edited by atlanta68; Yesterday at 4:11 PM.
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Old Posted Yesterday, 12:39 PM
chadinhsv chadinhsv is offline
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Atlanta: That was a great write up (by google AI), haha. You're right, they were more generous than we have been and paint a rosy picture for the next phase that the University is starting to follow. I'm excited to see the direction that President Mohler is going to take us. I think he is the right man for the job.

That information was great and makes sense that when you admit riskier students that a lot of the time they will struggle to keep up and will transfer or drop out which takes a huge hit on our retention and graduation rates. Those are the key factors that dropped us behind other peer institutions. We just need to be patient. The University is producing fantastic graduates and have been for quite some time.
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