Burrard Inlet Rapid Transit - Park Royal-Metrotown via 2nd Narrows | BRT/RRT?

[GenWhy?]

Originally Posted by VancouverOfTheFuture

one way any rail could deal with the grades is a series of viaducts and tunnels, ignoring the natural slope as needed. its been done in the past and can be still.

This is similar to the systems in Calgary and Edmonton.

[jollyburger]

Originally Posted by chowhou

Perhaps Google is tricking my eyes, but Connors Road on streetview looks much less steep than E 3rd or E Keith.

...

My extremely rough calculations based on topography have the E 3rd hill with a 9% average grade and the steep section of E Keith from Heywood to Cloverley with a 12% grade! The peak slope is certainly higher since those roads are definitely not linearly slopey.

I'm not sure what the steepest part of Connors Road is but it seems pretty gradual and the stretch from the footbridge up to 95th is around 4% grade on average which is pretty typical for dedicated passenger rail.

I think the Google cycling directions has fairly accurate elevation changes. From the 94/95 intersection up to the pedestrian bridge it's like 28m over 700 m.

From Kennard up to Queensbury on East 3rd is like 51m over a similar distance.

[chowhou]

Originally Posted by jollyburger

I think the Google cycling directions has fairly accurate elevation changes. From the 94/95 intersection up to the pedestrian bridge it's like 28m over 700 m.

From Kennard up to Queensbury on East 3rd is like 51m over a similar distance.

As a bit of a cyclist I can tell you that East 3rd doesn't really pick up until Heywood. According to Google I get over 10% grade (36m/350m) for the steepest section. Not really rail territory!

[Migrant_Coconut]

Originally Posted by GenWhy?

This is similar to the systems in Calgary and Edmonton.

IIRC that's actually part of how we got the Expo Line - Burnaby wanted so many grade separations for the LRT that planners just gave up and put the entire thing on one big grade separation instead.

I mean, if we didn't already have metro infrastructure, I'd say go for it, but the end result as-is would be an equally-pricey SkyTrain that's still vulnerable to traffic disruptions and doesn't integrate with the rest of the network.

[madog222]

North Shore BRT map showing station locations released by Translink and a survey is now open.

https://translinklistens.ca/bus-rapid-transit-program


Image from Translink

[Denscity]

What would be the benefit of Boundary Road allignment over Willingdon?

[chowhou]

Originally Posted by Denscity

What would be the benefit of Boundary Road allignment over Willingdon?

From inside the questionnaire:

There are two possible route options under consideration to connect Kootenay Loop to Brentwood Town Centre.

Option 1 Hastings St/Willingdon Ave provides a direct connection to local destinations in Burnaby Heights via Willingdon Ave and Hastings St.
Benefits:
Provides direct access to local businesses and residential areas in Burnaby Heights
Provides access to seven bus routes along Hastings St.
Trade-offs:
Curbside parking on Hastings St would be removed from Willingdon Ave to Boundary Rd
Reduce to one driving lane on Willingdon Ave between Hastings St and Lougheed Hwy
Access to Gilmore Station would require a transfer to the Millenium Line at Brentwood Town Centre
Future design considerations:
Commercial loading access for Hastings St. businesses


Option 2 Boundary Rd/Lougheed Hwy provides direct connection to Gilmore SkyTrain station via Lougheed Hwy and Boundary Rd.
Benefits:
Provides direct access to local businesses and residential areas around Gilmore station
Provides access to the Millenium Line at Gilmore Station and three bus routes
Trade-offs:
Curbside parking on Lougheed Hwy and Boundary Rd (where applicable) would be removed
Reduce to two driving lanes on Lougheed Hwy where there are three today
Access to Burnaby Heights would require a transfer to another bus service at Kootenay Loop or Brentwood Town Centre
Future design considerations:
Steep hill on Boundary Rd
Power transmission lines on Boundary Rd

At the end of the day, this should be a Skytrain line.

[Denscity]

Originally Posted by chowhou

From inside the questionnaire:



At the end of the day, this should be a Skytrain line.

Thank you.
Hm not sure what I prefer now. Not too familiar with the Gilmore area but do know it has the tallest tower in BC and a Skystrain Station. And quite a bit of retail?

[Migrant_Coconut]

Originally Posted by Denscity

What would be the benefit of Boundary Road allignment over Willingdon?

There isn't one. And it barely connects to Gilmore. It's pageantry to appease the Hastings businesses who're scared of losing their parking lanes.

[officedweller]

Lougheed and Boundary are wider streets, with fewer busy cross-streets, so they may be faster.

[jollyburger]

Originally Posted by Denscity

What would be the benefit of Boundary Road allignment over Willingdon?

They keep street parking on East Hastings

[RedArbutus]

Originally Posted by Migrant_Coconut

There isn't one. And it barely connects to Gilmore. It's pageantry to appease the Hastings businesses who're scared of losing their parking lanes.

This x 1000000. It's all one big song and dance to pretend they're consulting with the idiot business owners on Hastings. It's not going down Boundary.

[Migrant_Coconut]

Originally Posted by officedweller

Lougheed and Boundary are wider streets, with fewer busy cross-streets, so they may be faster.

Not really; back when I took the 28, it'd always get stuck at Lougheed and Boundary for 2-3 light cycles, and Boundary itself wasn't much faster.

At any rate, TransLink IIRC plans to add dedicated bus lanes and signals, so cross-traffic won't be a problem with either option.

[jollyburger]

Originally Posted by Migrant_Coconut

Not really; back when I took the 28, it'd always get stuck at Lougheed and Boundary for 2-3 light cycles, and Boundary itself wasn't much faster.

At any rate, TransLink IIRC plans to add dedicated bus lanes and signals, so cross-traffic won't be a problem with either option.

It will be interesting to see how they prioritize BRT buses through any parts of the route that require a turn. I assume this might play a factor on whether the centre or curb lane would be used?

[Kisai]

Originally Posted by chowhou

From inside the questionnaire:



At the end of the day, this should be a Skytrain line.

Given how every transit priority has evolved, it will be eventually, in like 2060.

Like realistically, until there is a plan to replace the Ironworkers Memorial bridge or add another crossing, they're not going to build a Skytrain line and then make it stop at Ironworkers Memorial bridge.

Though we could just go the Skybridge route and build another skytrain only bridge. At least if the bridge is transit only, any traffic accident doesn't impair the bridge.

[Sheba]

Originally Posted by chowhou

At the end of the day, this should be a Skytrain line.

Originally Posted by Kisai

Given how every transit priority has evolved, it will be eventually, in like 2060.

If we had unlimited money to play with, this would be Skytrain - but we don't. I for one am happy that TransLink has decided to spend some money on a bunch of BRT routes across the region instead of only building one Skytrain route every so often. There are a lot of areas that need better transit yesterday and they're not likely to see a Skytrain line before 2060.

[griswold]

I feel like the a Skytrain to and across the north shore should be the next priority for Translink after the other extensions are finished. The traffic is atrocious and only getting worse each year.

[Henbo]

Originally Posted by Denscity

What would be the benefit of Boundary Road allignment over Willingdon?

I would be curious to know the travel time difference from Phibbs to Millennium Line and Metrotown between the two options

As a north shore resident, the Boundary option might actually be more appealing

[Metro-One]

Seeing how the North Shore should be next after the UBC extension (phase two) is complete (my guess is that will be around 2035) saying there won’t be any Skytrain on : connecting the North Shore until 2060 is highly pessimistic.

The honest estimate for the purple line opening (in completion) in conjunction with a Iron Workers’ Memorial Bridge should be 2040.

It’s currently 2025, even with our over regulated environment there is no good reason for it to be any later than that. That’s 15 years.

Essentially phase two of the Broadway extension should commence around 2028, finishing in 2034 or 2035. The Purple Line project should commence around 2033 with a 2040 opening.

That is a reasonable project time schedule for mass transit projects over the next 15 years.

[ecbin]

Originally Posted by Henbo

I would be curious to know the travel time difference from Phibbs to Millennium Line and Metrotown between the two options

As a north shore resident, the Boundary option might actually be more appealing

Distance travelled is the same and traffic volume is pretty similar depending on time of day so maybe there's a 30-60 second variance in either direction for both routes.

The Boundary route is horrible - like others have said, it's just theatre to placate stupid business owners (there's lots of parking off Hastings anyways - I never park on Hastings when I go there, it's always a side street).