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  #5801  
Old Posted Jul 6, 2022, 3:08 AM
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Brookfield is saying "Made you look" with Manhattan West from this particular angle in Jersey.


Edgewater Fireworks by Jonathan Chu, on Flickr


Edgewater Fireworks by Jonathan Chu, on Flickr
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  #5802  
Old Posted Jul 7, 2022, 8:50 PM
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Thought I would also share this here from SSC, a comparison I made of the original Tower 2 with the 2 current designs we are aware of. There is a slight perspective but it still gives an understanding of the scale.

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  #5803  
Old Posted Jul 7, 2022, 10:42 PM
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^cool comparison, but I think the scale is off. Either the new proposal renderings are exaggerated, or 2 WTC is pinched in. This makes the new proposals look almost twice as wide as the original tower and I'm pretty sure there is no way that is the case.

Edit: no that probably is accurate. Just checked above on google maps and that does appear to be the case. Wow
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  #5804  
Old Posted Jul 8, 2022, 3:59 PM
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Yeah, it has a pretty wide base.

Either version would be fine at this point.
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  #5805  
Old Posted Jul 8, 2022, 5:50 PM
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Yea this tower will be just huge

Provided it ever exists...
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  #5806  
Old Posted Jul 8, 2022, 6:12 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NYguy View Post
Yeah, it has a pretty wide base.
The J Lo Tower: Thick on the bottom!
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  #5807  
Old Posted Aug 1, 2022, 1:43 AM
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https://nypost.com/2022/07/31/wtc-to...or-tenant/amp/

Final piece in WTC tenant puzzle continues to elude developer Silverstein


By Steve Cuozzo
July 31, 2022


Quote:
Last week’s announcement that the state green-lighted Brookfield’s and Silverstein Properties’ plan for a supertall, mostly residential tower at Five World Trade Center ignored the more compelling matter of Two World Trade Center — the office skyscraper that Larry Silverstein has tried to build for more than 15 years.

Some news reports last week absurdly claimed that 5 WTC was the “final piece” of the complex, apparently forgetting that the 2 WTC site — which would finally complete the tower quartet at “Ground Zero” — remains a small-scale art installation.
Quote:
A Silverstein spokesman said on Friday, “We are actively looking for an anchor tenant for 2 WTC and are optimistic we will find one.”

Silverstein’s confidence is based on success at the rest of the 16-acre WTC. The developer’s 3 WTC and 4 WTC are 90 percent and 100 percent leased, respectively. The Durst Organization and the Port Authority’s 1 WTC is also nearly full.


The rep confirmed that architects Foster + Partners had redesigned 2 WTC after Silverstein brought Foster in to replace a more cutting-edge scheme by Bjarke Ingels’ firm, BIG.
Quote:
In January 2020, Silverstein told us during a discussion about a possible 5 WTC, “What’s closest to my heart is Tower Two.”

He also said, “With the level of lease-up activity at Tower Three, my hunch is it won’t be terribly long before an announcement comes up with respect to Tower Two.”

But then the pandemic intervened.

Meanwhile, Five World Trade still faces its own hurdles. Critics, including former Mayor Bill de Blasio and several elected officials, are demanding that the entire residential portion — some 1,200 planned apartments — be used as “affordable” housing, a requirement that would be un-affordable to the developers.

The current plan calls for about 25% of the units to be set aside for lower-income tenants. The gripes will be aired at several planned public hearings.

It’s a sure bet that both new skyscrapers will rise one day. The only real question is, which one first?
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  #5808  
Old Posted Aug 1, 2022, 2:15 AM
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Blind optimism at its finest
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  #5809  
Old Posted Aug 1, 2022, 2:48 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Zapatan View Post
Blind optimism at its finest
?
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  #5810  
Old Posted Aug 1, 2022, 2:56 AM
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?
It’s been 20+ years, not holding my breath for this one no matter what complex it’s part of or who’s behind it.

I’d love to be wrong.
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  #5811  
Old Posted Aug 1, 2022, 2:59 AM
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It’s been 20+ years, not holding my breath for this one no matter what complex it’s part of or who’s behind it.
The amount of time that has passed has little to do with whether they'll find a tenant or not.
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  #5812  
Old Posted Aug 1, 2022, 3:43 AM
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The amount of time that has passed has little to do with whether they'll find a tenant or not.
I guess, but who’s to say it won’t be another 10 or 20 years?

I’m not trying to be too pessimistic but rather just realistic. It’s hard to take any news articles regarding this project seriously anymore.
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  #5813  
Old Posted Aug 1, 2022, 4:38 AM
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I wish they would build on-spec and work on getting numerous smaller tenants over time just to get this rising versus a large commitment. Longer this sits dormant, harder it will get. Midtown East, Hudson Yards and eventually the Penn District are the future.
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  #5814  
Old Posted Aug 1, 2022, 6:35 AM
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I wish they would build on-spec and work on getting numerous smaller tenants over time just to get this rising versus a large commitment. Longer this sits dormant, harder it will get. Midtown East, Hudson Yards and eventually the Penn District are the future.
This exactly. The reasoning of the developers of this site that a more opportune time for construction might lie in the future, has only resulted in the timeline for this tower being pushed ever more into the future. They had this same excuse from 2016-2020. The comparatively better economy back then wasn't enough for them, they insisted on having an anchor tenant before starting. They also decided to do another redesign in 2019/2020 after the BIG redesign in 2015. They waited so long that a pandemic, concurrent labor shortage and declining occupancy office rates delayed the project again.

It's pretty disappointing to see that no one that could help start construction seems to express an urgency in redeveloping the site where the tower would rise. Not Silverstein Properties (despite Silverstein himself now being older than 90). Not the Port Authority. Not companies. Not local or state leaders that control a lot of what goes on at the site. Meanwhile complaints from local residents keep saying to fill existing smaller office buildings first or are more focused on housing (as with the current situation for 5 WTC, where some people are insisting the tower be redesigned to accommodate 'affordable housing'). As much as people here want the tower to be built, a lot of people closer to the site (including those in charge of the construction itself, government representatives, office companies and residents in Lower Manhattan) don't seem to be very eager or interested in that happening.

On skyscrapercity forums, someone said that construction might only start in 2025 so that 2 WTC would be open in time for the 30th anniversary. That would simply be ridiculous, and yet it's not even certain that construction will have started by then (remember the consistent predictions in the mid 2010s that 2 WTC would be well under construction by 2020). Because of many trends (including the increasing practice of engaging in remote work and TAMI companies continually downsizing), it might not even be feasible for an office building to be constructed at the site in a few years, although for now (as the same New York Post author has admitted), the rest of the towers on the WTC site are filling up relatively fast and have retained high occupancy throughout the coronavirus pandemic.

Additionally as TKDV mentions on New York YIMBY forums, a tenant that agrees could demand a redesign (like FOX did which prompted the BIG redesign). And then what's to say that the tenant that demanded the redesign won't then pull out at the last minute like FOX did in 2016 and Deutsche Bank did in 2017?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Zapatan View Post
I guess, but who’s to say it won’t be another 10 or 20 years?

I’m not trying to be too pessimistic but rather just realistic. It’s hard to take any news articles regarding this project seriously anymore.
Agreed, every year leading up to and around the anniversary of 9/11 or so, there's some news about 2 WTC, only for nothing to come of it.

At least St. Nicholas Greek Orthodox Church and Perelman Performing Arts Center (PAC) will be finishing up and both buildings will likely be completed and open sometime in 2023, along with Century 21 on Church Street reopening too. The PAC opening will hopefully result in more walkable space on the WTC site and even less of a feel of a construction site. The graffiti on the mechanical vents of the 2 WTC building stump (built to grade by 2012/2013 and with the decision to decorate these vents being made back in 2018) is getting old, yet that view is probably going to be present for at least a few more years.

Last edited by worldtrade2021; Aug 1, 2022 at 11:21 AM.
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  #5815  
Old Posted Aug 1, 2022, 12:46 PM
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Well, its certainly easier for us to say it should be built on spec. I think they would be rewarded if they did. But office towers, especially of this size, aren’t built on spec. At least not in New York.


Quote:
Silverstein’s confidence is based on success at the rest of the 16-acre WTC. The developer’s 3 WTC and 4 WTC are 90 percent and 100 percent leased, respectively. The Durst Organization and the Port Authority’s 1 WTC is also nearly full.
This is everything you need to know about why this tower remains a viability, and why Silverstein Properties remains confident in its success.
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  #5816  
Old Posted Aug 1, 2022, 1:59 PM
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Originally Posted by NYguy View Post
Well, its certainly easier for us to say it should be built on spec. I think they would be rewarded if they did. But office towers, especially of this size, aren’t built on spec. At least not in New York.




This is everything you need to know about why this tower remains a viability, and why Silverstein Properties remains confident in its success.
Unfortunately, it seems the downtown office market is relatively weak, and I think that weakness is the main reason why it won't be built on spec. If it was in Midtown east or even Hudson Yards, they probably would take a chance, but downtown is too risky at this time. It seems that even the residential and retail markets are weak downtown, with stalled and uncompleted projects.
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  #5817  
Old Posted Aug 1, 2022, 2:04 PM
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Something will rise here eventually. I would not be surprised to see a mixed-use design with office, hotel, and condos.

In the near term, I’d rather see 175 and 350 Park secure tenants.
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  #5818  
Old Posted Aug 2, 2022, 1:41 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NYguy View Post

This is everything you need to know about why this tower remains a viability, and why Silverstein Properties remains confident in its success.
That actually sounds somewhat promising, didn’t realize those buildings were already so full.

Still feel like this site is cursed though, and 5WTC to a lesser extent.
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