CHICAGO: Transit Developments

[denizen467]

^ I think that's what ardecila was referring to.

Originally Posted by ardecila

Well that gets into a bigger discussion about the responsiveness of our infrastructure investment. We are not building the infrastructure for today's need, let alone tomorrow's. You'd think the scarcity of money and political will would force governments to focus on the most urgent projects and those with the biggest return on investment, but instead it's a wedge for politicians to push their ill-conceived pet projects under the rubric of "something is better than nothing" (see the Illiana). Even the business community is starting to turn on that boondoggle.

Sigh.

[rlw777]

Has anyone been here been to the Museum Campus transportation meetings?

[CTA Gray Line]

Originally Posted by rlw777

Has anyone been here been to the Museum Campus transportation meetings?

I went to both, you can see my contribution here: http://www.civicartworks.com/project...opular&phase=1

Please register, and support the Idea!

[le_brew]

my best museum campus suggestion is to finish block 37 superstation and route a shuttle from block 37 along the red line to the connector tracks south of roosevelt, thru a new subway tunnel to the museum campus. though in this town, this would probably never be seriously considered.

note: this does not negate the gray line proposal

[ardecila]

I really like that super-streetcar idea. From Ogilvie, Canal to Roosevelt, then cut in front of the Field Museum to Museum Campus Drive and south to McCormick Place.

It doesn't have the usual problems of streetcar systems - confusing one-way couplets, mixed traffic, etc - and the route is a logical complement to existing rail lines with carefully-planned transfers. Unfortunately they call it a loop, which it should not be.

They call it a streetcar, but really it should be more like Houston's or SF's light rail systems, with widely placed stops, exclusive lanes, and sizable platforms with shelters/ticket machines. Something on par with the Parisian trams.

[Mr Downtown]

^To my surprise (I'm usually very skeptical about streetcars), a C-shaped route (Navy Pier-Ogilvie/Union-Museum Campus) makes a lot of sense to me, too. It seems the right use for the slightly higher capacity and the much higher visibility/attractiveness to visitors of streetcars.

One problem Jeff Sriver of CDOT noted, however, is the limited ROW on Roosevelt (State to Michigan). We already have trouble squeezing in the moving lanes, the bus zones, the pedestrian hordes, and bike lanes. Where will we find another 18 feet for dedicated streetcar lanes?

[pilsenarch]

eminent domain the bustle on the apartment tower on the southwest corner of Roosevelt and Michigan, and part of the bp gas station as well as the two out buildings @ the jewels....

[Mr Downtown]

^Indeed, that was my immediate suggestion to him. Also that he'd have to stand firm in some PD meetings about the Crescent Heights property.

[ardecila]

I do like those two outbuildings, they humanize what would otherwise be a soul-killing suburban strip mall right on top of the city's second-busiest rail hub. But yeah, that whole section of Roosevelt should be redeveloped. 18' of this is an acceptable sacrifice.

[CTA Gray Line]

Does anyone know what the present working cost estimate is
for constructing the Red Line Extension from 95th to 130th?

[pilsenarch]

Originally Posted by ardecila

I do like those two outbuildings, they humanize what would otherwise be a soul-killing suburban strip mall right on top of the city's second-busiest rail hub. But yeah, that whole section of Roosevelt should be redeveloped. 18' of this is an acceptable sacrifice.

I agree, however, the entire site should be redeveloped into a multi-use tower. There were rumors a few years ago that that was in the pipeline...

[denizen467]

Originally Posted by Mr Downtown

^To my surprise (I'm usually very skeptical about streetcars), a C-shaped route (Navy Pier-Ogilvie/Union-Museum Campus) makes a lot of sense to me, too.

This doesn't seem to be the bottleneck here, but would completion of the Taylor Street bridge grease the decision at all? Then, head south on Wells-Wentworth. This might even be welcome by R Collection (e.g., elevator down to an adjoining grade level station), and could help avoid congestion or pedestrian issues at Delano. Figuring out how to rejoin Roosevelt is the trick, but you could instead continue under Roosevelt and use SCAL straight to the Lucas. This would even plant a seed for Riverside Park's development (and indeed the blank slate stage would be the best time to do such a thing). May the force be with this.

Speaking of which, is Taylor Street even going to happen any time this decade?

[ardecila]

^ Possibly. CMK just bought the parcel south of River City, so if/when that gets developed, we may see what demands the city places on the project relative to the future Taylor bridge abutment. The city already worked with Southgate Market to construct the west abutment.

The more interesting question is whether the bridge needs to be operable. That would make sense, given the sailboat traffic on the South Branch, but would add millions to the price. CDOT has avoided operable bridges wherever possible - the new Division bridges will be fixed, and they have proposed a fixed bridge at Chicago in recent years.

[wierdaaron]

Roosevelt is being put on a diet right there now isn't it? They're experimenting with elevated bike lanes and new types of lane configurations. It's been promising to me that it's getting attention from CDOT as its been a problematic traffic and pedestrian situation for a while.

I think a L (Train stations to Museum Campus) or C (same plus Navy Pier) would be pretty great for a number of reasons, one of them being that if they had a stop around Roosevelt and State/Wabash/Michigan it would make the South Loop a major dumping ground for tourists coming in by train or bus, because that would make it the "downtown" stop on such a line.

I've always wished there were an easy way for people coming into the two stations to get downtown. You're fresh off the amtrak or megabus, you want to get to your Loop hotel, what do you do? The L is useless to you, and nobody can figure out the buses. With an L-shaped streetcar track, that area of Roosevelt would be where you'd want to hop off, and with a C-shaped one it'd either be that or somewhere in River North (maybe they'd want it somewhere near Merchandise Mart to connect to the L there?).

Either way, it'd be a nice way to increase the foot population around Roosevelt and be a huge boon for the businesses that have been trickling in.

There's lots of political will behind some kind of big transit move in order to improve Museum Campus accessibility, so if we can get a bold move out of it that could improve the whole city I'm all for it.

[Mr Downtown]

The CMK parcel is way too small to trigger construction of a Taylor bridge, and the CMK parcel ends at the north edge of the Taylor ROW. It's the next parcel south that might trigger some movement.

A Taylor bridge will indeed have to be a moveable span, unless the Coast Guard is convinced that the South Branch should suddenly be downgraded like the North Branch (above North Avenue) was during the 20th Century.

[denizen467]

Must an adjacent property really be the trigger? It would seem that booming development along Clark, as well as the British School and Roosevelt Collection, plus The Maxwell, etc, should be plenty adequate impetus for a bridge at Taylor. Alternatively, wouldn't a Wells extension (or rebuild down to Taylor) be a trigger?

Anyway, has the Coast Guard downgraded the North Branch anywhere south of North in the last or this century? Will the Division Street bridge along the North Branch (not the island canal) be fixed? There has been talk in these parts about the Chicago Ave bridge having aged as well. I'm not clear as to whether final decisions have been made about those. Developers now are wanting to replace the boat yard next to Kendall College with unrelated uses, so, for one, there may be no more recreational need to navigate with masts as far as Goose Island.

[the urban politician]

I was amazed at the traffic congestion headed east on Roosevelt through the S Loop yesterday. What a clusterfuck the city created, and for absolutely no good reason. Thanks a lot, Dearborn Park!

[k1052]

Originally Posted by denizen467

Will the Division Street bridge along the North Branch (not the island canal) be fixed? There has been talk in these parts about the Chicago Ave bridge having aged as well. I'm not clear as to whether final decisions have been made about those. Developers now are wanting to replace the boat yard next to Kendall College with unrelated uses, so, for one, there may be no more recreational need to navigate with masts as far as Goose Island.

Yes, they are doing both Division Street bridges. Since people still need to access Goose Island they can only close one at a time. Both the Chicago Ave bridge over the river and the decrepit Halsted/Chicago viaduct are slated for replacement by 2017, IIRC.

[denizen467]

^ By "fixed" I was referring to bridges being non-moveable, not to bridges being repaired (because they're to be replaced, not repaired). So the question in the second half of my post was whether any of those replacement bridges over the North Branch will be moveable in the light of any changes to government policy.

[k1052]

Originally Posted by denizen467

^ By "fixed" I was referring to bridges being non-moveable, not to bridges being repaired (because they're to be replaced, not repaired). So the question in the second half of my post was whether any of those replacement bridges over the North Branch will be moveable in the light of any changes to government policy.

No. All three will be non-movable like the new Halsted bridge.