Great Lakes Cities

[Wigs]

With the amount of Londoners that use the Great Lakes in the summer (as opposed to say Kitchener Waterloo region) I'd say it's borderline
Do a lot of Londoners have cottages on Lake Erie or Huron?

[subterranean]

If you’re in the basin, you’re in.

[Wigs]

Nice map that I've never seen before!

[ChiSoxRox]

Originally Posted by subterranean

If you’re in the basin, you’re in.

With a special exemption for Chicago because it reversed its own river.

[Steely Dan]

Is Chicago a great lakes basin city or a Mississippi basin city?


Yes to both.


Thank you, mud lake.

[ChiSoxRox]

"This river doesn't go the way we want it to."

Some cities would dredge the harbor to another shape. Some cities would cut a channel to shorten a bend.

Chicago: "Hold my shovel."

[Steely Dan]

And Cleveland was like:

"fuck that shit, the river is fine"



Source: https://www.cleveland.com/galleries/...AXNN5P5DU4ENA/

[lio45]

Originally Posted by ChiSoxRox

With a special exemption for Chicago because it reversed its own river.

The St. Lawrence also seems to get an exemption in that map, because last I checked, it hadn't yet gotten the Chicago treatment to make it drain from the Atlantic into Lake Ontario...

I would dispute a few things on that map, that being one of them (Cornwall isn't a "Great Lakes" city no matter how much you stretch it).

[lio45]

On that topic, one definition that I find works pretty well is that any location that can be on the interior side of a line drawn between any two points of actual Great Lakes is quite firmly a "Great Lakes" location.

Let me illustrate with a couple examples:

- Being on the inside side of any line from Georgian Bay to Lake Ontario, all of the triangle-shaped Southern Ontario is "Great Lakes";

- Being on the inside side of any line from the southern tip of Lake Michigan to Lake Erie (i.e. from about Gary to about Toledo), all of Michigan is "Great Lakes";

- The part of Wisconsin that's on the inside side of a line from the SW tip of Lake Superior to the southern tip of Lake Michigan (about where Chicago is), is "Great Lakes".

People inside those boundaries have Great Lakes on multiple sides, basically. (Even if they live quite a bit inland.)

[SIGSEGV]

Originally Posted by lio45

On that topic, one definition that I find works pretty well is that any location that can be on the interior side of a line drawn between any two points of actual Great Lakes is quite firmly a "Great Lakes" location.

Let me illustrate with a couple examples:

- Being on the inside side of any line from Georgian Bay to Lake Ontario, all of the triangle-shaped Southern Ontario is "Great Lakes";

- Being on the inside side of any line from the southern tip of Lake Michigan to Lake Erie (i.e. from about Gary to about Toledo), all of Michigan is "Great Lakes";

- The part of Wisconsin that's on the inside side of a line from the SW tip of Lake Superior to the southern tip of Lake Michigan (about where Chicago is), is "Great Lakes".

People inside those boundaries have Great Lakes on multiple sides, basically. (Even if they live quite a bit inland.)

Here is the convex hull spanning the great lakes (+ Lake Nipigon).



Strangely the shapefile I'm using (from natural earth) includes some of the St. Lawrence as Lake Ontario. Perhaps the border is not quite well defined? I guess it stays at Lake Ontario level until the Iroquois Dam, but that's not the border shown here as far as I can tell...

[SIGSEGV]

Originally Posted by lio45

The St. Lawrence also seems to get an exemption in that map, because last I checked, it hadn't yet gotten the Chicago treatment to make it drain from the Atlantic into Lake Ontario...

I would dispute a few things on that map, that being one of them (Cornwall isn't a "Great Lakes" city no matter how much you stretch it).

Wikipedia has a better image:

[Nite]

Originally Posted by subterranean

If you’re in the basin, you’re in.

I have always liked how Ontario original borders match up to the Great lakes basin



(99% of Ontario 16 Million population is still inside the original borders as well)

[subterranean]

Originally Posted by lio45

The St. Lawrence also seems to get an exemption in that map, because last I checked, it hadn't yet gotten the Chicago treatment to make it drain from the Atlantic into Lake Ontario...

I would dispute a few things on that map, that being one of them (Cornwall isn't a "Great Lakes" city no matter how much you stretch it).

A different take:

[lio45]

Originally Posted by SIGSEGV

Here is the convex hull spanning the great lakes (+ Lake Nipigon).



Strangely the shapefile I'm using (from natural earth) includes some of the St. Lawrence as Lake Ontario. Perhaps the border is not quite well defined? I guess it stays at Lake Ontario level until the Iroquois Dam, but that's not the border shown here as far as I can tell...

Exactly what I meant, except that I think this map includes too much of Inland Northern Ontario because it decided to include Lake Nipigon, which I would never have thought of doing; Great Lakes only. (And since it ALSO happens to go too far northeast on the other end too, the line that's the top right edge is too far back in a parallel way to what I would consider the real boundary.)

The five-color map of basins is also a very good definition of the Great Lakes "area" on land, and it overlaps a lot with my straight lines definition.

The white map subterranean just posted above is also just as good for the Great Lakes part, but it has one huge (inexplicable to me) flaw as it cuts the St. Lawrence Valley area right in its heart for some reason. Either include it or not.

I wouldn't include it, personally; it's very different from the Great Lakes region, even if it's the same water. Imagine "deciding" that the Danube's immediate basin is a logical coherent region, grouping southern Germany with the coastal areas of Romania and Ukraine (rather than with, like, central Germany...)

[iheartthed]

Originally Posted by MolsonExport

Would London (Ontario, metro pop 575K*) be considered a "Great Lakes City"? It is not directly on any lake, but 40 minutes' drive from Lakes Huron and Erie, 60 minutes' drive from Lake St. Clair, and 90 minutes' drive to Lake Ontario. Due to the bedroom communities of St. Thomas and Port Stanley, the CMA technically extends into Lake Erie.



*https://www150.statcan.gc.ca/t1/tbl1...pid=1710013501

I would lean no, but depends on the context.

[Wigs]

Originally Posted by Steely Dan

And Cleveland was like:

"fuck that shit, the river is fine"



Source: https://www.cleveland.com/galleries/...AXNN5P5DU4ENA/

The Cuyahoga always looks gross.
Even the Buffalo River which also caught fire numerous times in the 60s/70s looks pretty dang good by comparison today in 2023

Buffalo Niagara Riverkeeper played a role in that. Fish and other aquatic species have come back. While I wouldn't swim in it it's fine to kayak and boat on.

[Steely Dan]

if Cleveland had been founded by Chicagoans.

[pj3000]

^ Yeah, I took youre original comment to mean that Cleveland said, "let's not straighten it and make our lives much easier for the centuries ahead. Fuck it, let's just make that curvy little creek a bit wider... our boats are tiny anyways".

[mrnyc]

Originally Posted by pj3000

^ Yeah, I took youre original comment to mean that Cleveland said, "let's not straighten it and make our lives much easier for the centuries ahead. Fuck it, let's just make that curvy little creek a bit wider... our boats are tiny anyways".

i dont know about that. they are big enough to attract their own gullnados.

[mrnyc]

there is of course a cute corollary to that —
if chicago had been founded by clevelanders —