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  #81  
Old Posted Jan 28, 2020, 7:27 PM
vandelay vandelay is offline
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So much nonsense being peddled here. Is there a mod here? Making a freshman congressman the bogeyman who singlehandedly torpedoed the Amazon deal is a gross oversimplification and shows how susceptible people are to right wing and corporate media programming.

The Amazon deal was lambasted from all sides and all levels. The biggest company in the world, headed by the richest man needed $3B in incentives to go to NYC, the richest city in the world? Disney just spent $650M for a new campus, Google just invested $1B for a new campus in NYC. All without pursuing incentives.
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  #82  
Old Posted Jan 28, 2020, 11:46 PM
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I agree with Crawford on this when he said " Her celebrity opposition sunk the project ".

She had been very critical of Amazon. They are still growing the footprint in NYC, but they want stability. With the large LIC project, consistent opposition especially on the political realm is not good for stability. If they need 2 mil-sq ft by "X" target year, they need that space. Adding uncertainty to the whole equation imposes huge risk. But its expected from AOC, who doesn't have a shred of economic knowledge or how NYC works. Sensationalism for every issue.

Not to worry, NYC has been through its share of bs before, and will survive.

And before anybody things this is an Amazon specific issue, no, its not. The uncertainty element also extends to other businesses. Words matter, and somebody like AOC threatens future business because other companies are watching, and they are listening. A bad business climate is a bad business climate, and NYC does not need an iota of that discourse in its long term outlook. Now some will start talking about global warming, but that is a different topic. On a side note, unless the whole world gets involved, won't make a shred of difference. Not a singular, localized issue, but a macro-scale issue.

With Sunnyside Yards, her resigning is good news for the project from a development standpoint and getting shovels on the ground.
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  #83  
Old Posted Jan 30, 2020, 6:45 AM
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Originally Posted by mrnyc View Post
thankfully in the end it looks like nyc still grabbed up around half that amazon work anyway, to be scattered around hudson yards. nashville got the rest, which is going to a hideous office park development. meh.
You and I have very different definitions of both the word "hideous" and the phrase "office park," my friend. lol
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  #84  
Old Posted Jan 30, 2020, 7:20 AM
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Originally Posted by vandelay View Post
So much nonsense being peddled here. Is there a mod here? Making a freshman congressman the bogeyman who singlehandedly torpedoed the Amazon deal is a gross oversimplification and shows how susceptible people are to right wing and corporate media programming.

The Amazon deal was lambasted from all sides and all levels. The biggest company in the world, headed by the richest man needed $3B in incentives to go to NYC, the richest city in the world? Disney just spent $650M for a new campus, Google just invested $1B for a new campus in NYC. All without pursuing incentives.
Nothing in this post is accurate. Entirely fabricated nonsense.

The reality is that AOC, who is extremely influential in local politics, torpedoed 40k new high-paying jobs because she's trying to make a name for herself nationally. And she succeeded, brilliantly. The reality is that NYC is poorer for her efforts. Anyone who calls themselves progressive should be upset at her demagoguery. It's probably the worst economic development news in modern NYC history, and at the same time we have an openly hostile President and Congress, who would like nothing better than to sink urban America.

The vast majority of New Yorkers, including liberal New Yorkers, supported this economic development, but stupid Trumpian populist tripe like "billionaires will be flying into Queens in helicopters while the poor sleep in the streets" muddied the waters enough that Bezos got cold feet, not wanting to deal with the political cluster---k around a wildly influential populist.

It may be that NY gets the jobs anyways. Maybe. But we don't know. What we know is that they won't be coming to Queens, where, in conjunction with Cornell Tech, there would have been a powerful new innovation ecosystem.
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  #85  
Old Posted Jan 30, 2020, 2:31 PM
BuildThemTaller BuildThemTaller is online now
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Originally Posted by Crawford View Post
Nothing in this post is accurate. Entirely fabricated nonsense.

The reality is that AOC, who is extremely influential in local politics, torpedoed 40k new high-paying jobs because she's trying to make a name for herself nationally. And she succeeded, brilliantly. The reality is that NYC is poorer for her efforts. Anyone who calls themselves progressive should be upset at her demagoguery. It's probably the worst economic development news in modern NYC history, and at the same time we have an openly hostile President and Congress, who would like nothing better than to sink urban America.

The vast majority of New Yorkers, including liberal New Yorkers, supported this economic development, but stupid Trumpian populist tripe like "billionaires will be flying into Queens in helicopters while the poor sleep in the streets" muddied the waters enough that Bezos got cold feet, not wanting to deal with the political cluster---k around a wildly influential populist.

It may be that NY gets the jobs anyways. Maybe. But we don't know. What we know is that they won't be coming to Queens, where, in conjunction with Cornell Tech, there would have been a powerful new innovation ecosystem.
I think the left and the right are making entirely too much out of a freshmen member of Congress that has not held local office in her lifetime. To be completely honest, I like some of the stuff Ocasio-Cortez has to say. I also abhor the treatment of her as some sort of rock star. What signature legislation has she passed? Besides the Bernie endorsement and twitter clapbacks, I haven't seen her actually accomplish anything. That's hard to do in a divided Congress, so it's not meant as a dig at her. My point is that we are giving her too much credit.

But she did have a point. You make it seem like she torpedoes the Amazon deal out of spite. There were real costs associated with that deal, costs the city and state had to bear. Corporate welfare is a serious issue and I, for one, am glad to hear a voice speak out against it. The right has a legitimate concern about the government picking winners. This was a case of governments showing favoritism towards Amazon. The whole HQ2 show was a spectacle in corporate greed. Google didn't need huge incentives to expand in NY or elsewhere. Why should Amazon? And as it turns out, most of the land they were going to redevelop will be redeveloped anyway. So did New York really lose all that much? Consider the costs, not just the other side of the ledger.
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  #86  
Old Posted Jan 30, 2020, 3:44 PM
vandelay vandelay is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Crawford View Post
Nothing in this post is accurate. Entirely fabricated nonsense.

The reality is that AOC, who is extremely influential in local politics, torpedoed 40k new high-paying jobs because she's trying to make a name for herself nationally. And she succeeded, brilliantly. The reality is that NYC is poorer for her efforts. Anyone who calls themselves progressive should be upset at her demagoguery. It's probably the worst economic development news in modern NYC history, and at the same time we have an openly hostile President and Congress, who would like nothing better than to sink urban America.

The vast majority of New Yorkers, including liberal New Yorkers, supported this economic development, but stupid Trumpian populist tripe like "billionaires will be flying into Queens in helicopters while the poor sleep in the streets" muddied the waters enough that Bezos got cold feet, not wanting to deal with the political cluster---k around a wildly influential populist.

It may be that NY gets the jobs anyways. Maybe. But we don't know. What we know is that they won't be coming to Queens, where, in conjunction with Cornell Tech, there would have been a powerful new innovation ecosystem.
Nothing you said here was accurate. Although a narrow plurality (not a majority) of voters supported the deal, they also disapproved of how the deal was made. If you go borough by borough, support is even more mixed. Liberal Manhattanites rejected the deal, as did conservative Staten Islanders. The district's councilman Van Brammer was against the deal. State senators and assemblymen were against the deal. Seattle councilmembers warned about any deals. Amazon was then raked over the coals in council meetings. Unions, transit and housing advocates, etc. protested the deal. Once the deal left the backroom of two deeply unpopular politicians (Cuomo and Deblasio), and into the public it got shredded. All this at a time when the MTA continued to fall apart, NYers continued to be squeezed by housing, and corporate welfare and tax evasion became a greater issue? This was a third rail issue.

The corporate media loves to put up Ocasio Cortez as a bogeyman or heroine, but she only gets a lot of credit because of that media attention. Demagoguery only works if people focus on figureheads, either as heroes or villains. As they say, "Great minds discuss ideas. Average minds discuss events. Small minds discuss people."
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  #87  
Old Posted Mar 3, 2020, 3:24 PM
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NYC and Partners Release Plans for Sunnyside Yards

12,000 affordable apartments, 10-12 new schools, 60+ acres of park space, and a new regional train station. Read about it all in the WSJ.


Source: WSJ
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  #88  
Old Posted Mar 3, 2020, 4:30 PM
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  #89  
Old Posted Mar 3, 2020, 4:44 PM
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^ It's just a master plan, and pretty much it was expected to be mostly housing. I'm not mad with that. But the NIMBYs will be all over it anyway.



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12,000 affordable apartments, 10-12 new schools, 60+ acres of park space, and a new regional train station. Read about it all in the WSJ.

Quote:
A master plan to develop Sunnyside Yard in Queens envisions a $14.4 billion deck over the train yards to make room for 12,000 affordable apartments, in what would be New York City’s largest such development in decades.

Half of Sunnyside Yard’s housing would provide rental apartments for low-income families earning below 50% of the area median income with the other half committed to affordable homeownership programs, according to the plan by the New York City Economic Development Corp.

The venture would represent the largest development of affordable housing in the city since the middle-income complex Co-op City was built in the Bronx about a half-century ago, housing-policy analysts said. It also would be the rare instance when every new apartment in such a large development would be classified as affordable.

“We’re running out of land in New York City, and it is harder and harder to find places for real affordable housing,” said James Patchett, president of the EDC, the city’s economic-development arm “When you think about a site of that scale you need to put affordable housing at its center.”
Quote:
Details of the proposal are in a master-plan summary reviewed by The Wall Street Journal. The plan is a nonbinding document that sets out a flexible, long-term development guide.

The $14.4 billion figure includes estimates for the cost of building the deck, the streetscape and necessary structures for utilities and continued train operations below.

Exact costs and funding of such a development have yet to be determined, city officials said. But analysts and affordable housing developers said it would require an enormous amount of public investment.

Details could change with planning and public input. The project is also expected to take decades to complete, with housing developed in phases after the creation of a regional rail station, EDC officials said.
Quote:
The plan focuses on about 80% of the 180-acre train yard, and it includes a new rail station to serve all regional commuter agencies. It also calls for 60 acres of open spaces and parks, new libraries, 10 to 12 new schools as well as office, industrial and retail space.

The city’s EDC led the public planning process and co-wrote the master plan with Amtrak, which controls a large portion of the rail yard.

“It’s unprecedented in the last 50 years and it’s amazing,” said Jonathan F.P. Rose, president of Jonathan RoseCompanies, a real-estate firm specializing in affordable housing development. “When you combine those things with schools, parks, health care, social services, it creates the platform for people to move forward economically with their lives.”
Quote:
The master plan aims to help tackle the city’s housing needs. From 2009 to 2018, New York City’s employment grew by 700,000 jobs but the housing supply didn’t keep pace, adding only 197,000 housing units, according to the city’s Department of City Planning.

The portion of city renters spending more than 30% of their income on rent was 52.6%, according to the NYU Furman Center.

...Half the 6,000 low-income rental apartments would target very low-income families, those earning 30% of the area median income. The other 6,000 housing units available for ownership would target families earning an average of 100% of the median area income, Economic Development Corp. officials said.

The high cost of building over rail yards will be a challenge for the project.

Federal, state and city tools, including tax-exempt bonds and affordable housing subsidies, could be used, Mr. Patchett said. Reduced property taxes also could come into play.

But financing the area’s proposed level of affordable housing, which is expected to have more apartments than Manhattan’s Stuyvesant Town-Peter Cooper Village, likely will be tough, developers and policy experts in the affordable housing sector said.






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  #90  
Old Posted Mar 3, 2020, 5:38 PM
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its an absolute miracle amtrak sat down with anybody to come up with a master plan for that.
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  #91  
Old Posted Mar 3, 2020, 6:33 PM
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Where is the "oh...my..god... food falling from your mouth" level of ambition here? 12,000 units? And yes, the hood is going to fight even that. They should be shooting for 40,000 to make the most of the enormous investment.
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  #92  
Old Posted Mar 3, 2020, 8:59 PM
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Where is the "oh...my..god... food falling from your mouth" level of ambition here? 12,000 units? And yes, the hood is going to fight even that.
They should be shooting for 40,000 to make the most of the enormous investment.
The numbers don't really matter, NOTHING that gets built here will be liked, because basically nobody likes anything. Sad but true. The more ambitious, the more the outrage.



https://twitter.com/yfreemark/status...56969065967619





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  #93  
Old Posted Mar 3, 2020, 9:15 PM
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“Office buildings are our factories – whether for tech, creative or traditional industries we must continue to grow our modern factories to create new jobs,” said United States Senator Chuck Schumer.
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  #94  
Old Posted Mar 4, 2020, 10:59 AM
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Beh. Looks like the new neighborhoods being built in the far reaches of Moscow in the 1980s.
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  #95  
Old Posted Mar 4, 2020, 1:25 PM
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Shame this couldn't be built in 5-10 years. This is going to take a very, very, very long time.
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  #96  
Old Posted Mar 4, 2020, 1:55 PM
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This could be built in 10 years. The absurd planned timeline seems to think we're not in the middleof an affordable housing crisis.
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  #97  
Old Posted Apr 6, 2020, 10:03 PM
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covering over the space eating rail yard is of course fantastic.

but those preliminary apt bldg designs???

what kind of low self-esteem, cheap, thoughtless, off the shelf, repetitive, slapped up soviet era crap is that?

i thought we won the cold war?
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  #98  
Old Posted Apr 7, 2020, 1:34 AM
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Holy Novy Arbat, Batman!
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