Phoenix Development News (3) - Page 808

ASU Diablo · #**16141** Posted **Jan 7, 2020, 4:10 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by RonnieFoos

Derby is a go! Six new permits posted this morning for Derby!

Boom! We should all go to Angels Trumpet and have some celebratory beers

CrestedSaguaro · #**16142** Posted **Jan 7, 2020, 4:11 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by ASU Diablo

Boom! We should all go to Angels Trumpet and have some celebratory beers

biggus diggus · #**16143** Posted **Jan 7, 2020, 5:18 PM**

I'll be there for an event later this week, will ask Mat what has transpired. I heard a rumor he stopped caring once they moved the footprint and also because of a desire to sell the building/business.

To clarify: I am not saying he's selling and I'm not saying he should. I heard a rumor which as of now is 100% unverified. I'm not CNN reporting whatever supports my rhetoric.

gymratmanaz · #**16144** Posted **Jan 7, 2020, 5:22 PM**

Derby....great news!!!!

PHX31 · #**16145** Posted **Jan 7, 2020, 5:32 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by biggus diggus

I'll be there for an event later this week, will ask Mat what has transpired. I heard a rumor he stopped caring once they moved the footprint and also because of a desire to sell the building/business.

I can't be in support of anyone with a weird way to shorten their name. Mat or Rus or Phill.

I'll be so happy once Derby is vertical and then open. There are a lot of nice things happening in those couple of blocks of northern downtown with interesting businesses and restaurants (Matt's Big Breakfast, Film Bar, Cobra, etc. etc. - angels trumpet notwithstanding), this will help solidify the area.

biggus diggus · #**16146** Posted **Jan 7, 2020, 5:35 PM**

I dislike all the hate towards Angel's. The bottom line is it's a great place to explore beers most people have never tried and the food is pretty interesting, not to mention the dog friendly patio is a huge plus. That bar played a huge role in shaping the bar scene in the area and while there are many beer bars with more rare beers or a bigger selection Angel's will always be the original downtown beer bar.

Obadno · #**16147** Posted **Jan 7, 2020, 5:58 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by biggus diggus

I dislike all the hate towards Angel's. The bottom line is it's a great place to explore beers most people have never tried and the food is pretty interesting, not to mention the dog friendly patio is a huge plus. That bar played a huge role in shaping the bar scene in the area and while there are many beer bars with more rare beers or a bigger selection Angel's will always be the original downtown beer bar.

Yeah its unfortunate that the owner is such a pill

Obadno · #**16148** Posted **Jan 7, 2020, 5:59 PM**

Looks like there are Signs up for the apartments on the former Oniel Printing lot.

I think construction is starting on this one, Filmore and 2nd ave apartments?

Crazy that the northwest portion of Downtown is going from acres of dirt to probably the densest residential part of the city in just a couple years.

biggus diggus · #**16149** Posted **Jan 7, 2020, 6:02 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by Obadno

Yeah its unfortunate that the owner is such a pill

He really isn't though, he just stood up for his own interests and there are a select few locals who seem slighted by that action because it doesn't reflect their desire to see a crane.

biggus diggus · #**16150** Posted **Jan 7, 2020, 6:05 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by Obadno

Looks like there are Signs up for the apartments on the former Oniel Printing lot.

I think construction is starting on this one, Filmore and 2nd ave apartments?

Crazy that the northwest portion of Downtown is going from acres of dirt to probably the densest residential part of the city in just a couple years.

To touch on this, I tried counting the other day since I'm in the neighborhood.

There are buildings going up at 1st ave and fillmore, 2nd ave and fillmore, 3rd ave and fillmore, 4th ave and fillmore, and 5th ave and fillmore. See a theme?

If the other stuff along mckinley is built then this will in fact be the densest part of downtown. Time to start buying west of 7th ave and grand avenue.

PHX31 · #**16151** Posted **Jan 7, 2020, 6:29 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by biggus diggus

He really isn't though, he just stood up for his own interests and there are a select few locals who seem slighted by that action because it doesn't reflect their desire to see a crane.

You've gotta know the audience and forum here, of course everyone is going to be annoyed by him/Angel's on SSP - haha. Yeah, we want to see a crane, but also his interests seem a little skewed - why would a place (one of the "originals") think it's a good idea in the long run and make it so difficult for MORE development and residents in the immediate area? Let's say his long term interests are selling the business/building, why wouldn't he get behind a dozen derbys pumping up his business and increasing property value? Seems illogical to delay any good development for years in favor of stagnation.

CrestedSaguaro · #**16152** Posted **Jan 7, 2020, 6:38 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by biggus diggus

he just stood up for his own interests

And that was the problem. Downtown is not HIS private neighborhood. What did he accomplish? Thousands of dollars wasted by the city fighting a lawsuit and stalling a development that would have been completed by now and open for nearly a year, costing lots of lost revenue from the residents that would have been spending their money at Cobra, Churchill, Filmbar...and yes, even at Angels. Matt did nothing but HURT the area. He did not help it.

Development was coming whether he liked it or not. The only thing he accomplished was moved Derby a whopping 5'. I understand this may or may not have hampered his ability to sell down the road, but I think it wouldn't have hurt his ability to sell the lot either way with as hot as the downtown market is right now and most likely will increase his property value. How about just being a good neighbor and enjoy the added revenue he is going to make with 400+ people living 5' from him? Enjoy the fact that other businesses around him will profit?

No offence to Matt as I do not know him. He may be a nice guy, but I can only speak from his actions which I believe hurt the neighborhood more than anything. I see this as selfish.

ASU Diablo · #**16153** Posted **Jan 7, 2020, 6:46 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by RonnieFoos

And that was the problem. Downtown is not HIS private neighborhood. What did he accomplish? Thousands of dollars wasted by the city fighting a lawsuit and stalling a development that would have been completed by now and open for nearly a year, costing lots of lost revenue from the residents that would have been spending their money at Cobra, Churchill, Filmbar...and yes, even at Angels. Matt did nothing but HURT the area. He did not help it.

Development was coming whether he liked it or not. The only thing he accomplished was moved Derby a whopping 5'. I understand this may or may not have hampered his ability to sell down the road, but I think it wouldn't have hurt his ability to sell the lot either way with as hot as the downtown market is right now and most likely will increase his property value. How about just being a good neighbor and enjoy the added revenue he is going to make with 400+ people living 5' from him? Enjoy the fact that other businesses around him will profit?

No offence to Matt as I do not know him. He may be a nice guy, but I can only speak from his actions which I believe hurt the neighborhood more than anything. I see this as selfish.

Well said!

biggus diggus · #**16154** Posted **Jan 7, 2020, 6:50 PM**

That rant read like one of someone who either does not understand property rights or does not care. A zero lot line building with windows would effectively have tied his hands for eternity. if the shoe was on your foot I doubt for a moment that you would have just stead back and let it happen

CrestedSaguaro · #**16155** Posted **Jan 7, 2020, 7:22 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by biggus diggus

That rant read like one of someone who either does not understand property rights or does not care. A zero lot line building with windows would effectively have tied his hands for eternity. if the shoe was on your foot I doubt for a moment that you would have just stead back and let it happen

PHX31 · #**16156** Posted **Jan 7, 2020, 7:35 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by biggus diggus

A zero lot line building with windows would effectively have tied his hands for eternity. if the shoe was on your foot I doubt for a moment that you would have just stead back and let it happen

You might be right. Explain why. Is that what was proposed? And is that because if it is a zero lot line building with windows that means anything ever built on his lot couldn't have windows, or couldn't be built up? If Derby is now 5' off the property line with windows, can he (future owners) now have the potential to build up?

CrestedSaguaro · #**16157** Posted **Jan 7, 2020, 7:44 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by PHX31

You might be right. Explain why. Is that what was proposed? And is that because if it is a zero lot line building with windows that means anything ever built on his lot couldn't have windows, or couldn't be built up? If Derby is now 5' off the property line with windows, can he (future owners) now have the potential to build up?

Biggus is right on that...and I acknowledged the 0' lot line in my "rant" above. However, Derby gave in on the 0' lot line and bumped it to a 5' lot line well over a year ago and yet, Matt did not drop the court case. Here it is still open today with his attorneys finally coming to a settlement conference on Feb. 20th.

Edit: I will also say a 0' lot line is not unheard of. It happens in many cities that have much denser cores than Phoenix where space is very limited. Even here, Stewart has a 0' lot line to the North with windows and balconies. So it can happen even in Phoenix. It never has been confirmed what kind of design that Derby had on the North side because we never seen full renderings. When my records request comes in, we'll know for sure what Derby has on the North side.

biggus diggus · #**16158** Posted **Jan 7, 2020, 8:13 PM**

Ok now imagine your business relies on its patio to survive in such a low margin industry. With stuff flying over your patio is now unsafe to use. That could close your business. This was another legitimate concern, again it's about more than your precious cranes. People's livelihood is at stake and your seem ambivalent.

Going further with this Matt and I discussed it and the developers were not good neighbors. They never once made an attempt to discuss with any of their neighbors what they plan to do or what the neighbors would like to see while it's being done. That just would have been common courtesy.

azsunsurfer · #**16159** Posted **Jan 7, 2020, 8:31 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by biggus diggus

Going further with this Matt and I discussed it and the developers were not good neighbors. They never once made an attempt to discuss with any of their neighbors what they plan to do or what the neighbors would like to see while it's being done. That just would have been common courtesy.

Sorry bro, it's called private property rights. Besides, Matt never discussed with any of us on what color the signage should have been, he went ahead and made a selection. Not a good neighbor if you ask me....

combusean · #**16160** Posted **Jan 7, 2020, 8:52 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by biggus diggus

To touch on this, I tried counting the other day since I'm in the neighborhood.

There are buildings going up at 1st ave and fillmore, 2nd ave and fillmore, 3rd ave and fillmore, 4th ave and fillmore, and 5th ave and fillmore. See a theme?

If the other stuff along mckinley is built then this will in fact be the densest part of downtown. Time to start buying west of 7th ave and grand avenue.

I would not advise anybody to buy west of downtown unless they want to put up some small potatoes project. That area has no precedent and in fact fierce opposition any serious height. If you want to go higher than 30 feet I’d laugh at you.