LOS ANGELES | METRO Project Rundown 2.0 (non-downtown)

[LAsam]

Originally Posted by homebucket

Interesting. Did not know that about the history of Westwood Village. I stayed there recently to visit a friend who was giving birth at UCLA Medical Center and found it to be a very relaxed, walkable little neighborhood. A good amount of pedestrian activity, without it feeling overly crowded or congested. Certainly not a place in a state of decline. Sawtelle was very similar in that regard as well. More organic. I think I prefer both to the Third Street Promenade actually which feels more manicured as you allude to.

Candidly, I haven't been to Westwood Village since pre-pandemic times so I'm not sure how it is these days. I have been to the Santa Monica Promenade and that has definitely become much less popular than it was back in the early 2010's. IMO, Santa Monica hasn't invested nearly enough in the Promenade's upkeep or continued modernization. I always preferred Main St in Santa Monica and that's still doing pretty well.

[BrandonJXN]

Originally Posted by sopas ej

I think there's more to Westwood Village's "decline" as a hip place to be; it can be attributed to more than just one thing. It was *THE* spot to hang out in/go to on weekends in LA during the 1980s. There were the movie theaters, boutiques, restaurants, bookshops, Tower Records had a location there, it was a total hangout for teens and twenty-somethings, and of course the UCLA campus provided that college student demographic. Ultimately, people in LA are fickle when it comes to places to hang out at---Westwood Village just became "passé." Right around 1989 or 1990, Santa Monica took what had been a run-down pedestrianized 3rd Street from the 1960s, changed the landscaping and paving, and then rebranded it as the "Third Street Promenade." And then from that point on, "The Promenade" or "Third Street" started becoming more of the hangout place, and Westwood crowds started to diminish. Parking was easier at Third Street Promenade too compared to trying to find parking in Westwood, so that contributed to Westwood starting to become less popular. And then the news media played up the killing of Karen Toshima in Westwood, which happened in 1992 or something, who was a 20-something woman out having fun with friends but got caught in the crossfire of a gang shooting. An unfortunate and sad incident for sure. But people generally point to that incident as the "death" of Westwood as a hangout, but I think it had already started to decline before that.

Edit: Hehe reminiscing about the Westwood Village of my teen years during the 1980s, I'm remembering that there was even a nightclub there called Dillon's, and there was even a Bullock's department store. Back in the 80s on Friday nights, they'd even close down some of the streets in the village, and it'd all be people walking everywhere. They even had pedi-cabs.

And they had bookstores. I think these student-oriented businesses started going away when UCLA expanded its Student Union/bookstore. It's like why would a UCLA student living on campus go into Westwood Village when you can just go to the Student Union?

There is a documentary on Netflix called Let It Burn which focuses on the series of events that lead to the LA Riots of 1992. The shooting of Karen Toshima is discussed.

Personal story: my mother told be that she and her friends went to go see The Exorcist the day it came out at Westwood Village. She told me that midway through the movie, an older Hispanic woman stood up, yelled and cursed at the screen in Spanish, and Usain Bolted out the door.

[SLO]

Originally Posted by sopas ej

I think there's more to Westwood Village's "decline" as a hip place to be; it can be attributed to more than just one thing. It was *THE* spot to hang out in/go to on weekends in LA during the 1980s. There were the movie theaters, boutiques, restaurants, bookshops, Tower Records had a location there, it was a total hangout for teens and twenty-somethings, and of course the UCLA campus provided that college student demographic. Ultimately, people in LA are fickle when it comes to places to hang out at---Westwood Village just became "passé." Right around 1989 or 1990, Santa Monica took what had been a run-down pedestrianized 3rd Street from the 1960s, changed the landscaping and paving, and then rebranded it as the "Third Street Promenade." And then from that point on, "The Promenade" or "Third Street" started becoming more of the hangout place, and Westwood crowds started to diminish. Parking was easier at Third Street Promenade too compared to trying to find parking in Westwood, so that contributed to Westwood starting to become less popular. And then the news media played up the killing of Karen Toshima in Westwood, which happened in 1992 or something, who was a 20-something woman out having fun with friends but got caught in the crossfire of a gang shooting. An unfortunate and sad incident for sure. But people generally point to that incident as the "death" of Westwood as a hangout, but I think it had already started to decline before that.

Edit: Hehe reminiscing about the Westwood Village of my teen years during the 1980s, I'm remembering that there was even a nightclub there called Dillon's, and there was even a Bullock's department store. Back in the 80s on Friday nights, they'd even close down some of the streets in the village, and it'd all be people walking everywhere. They even had pedi-cabs.

And they had bookstores. I think these student-oriented businesses started going away when UCLA expanded its Student Union/bookstore. It's like why would a UCLA student living on campus go into Westwood Village when you can just go to the Student Union?

Its a spot that has great bones so it will be back eventually. I wouldnt say its dead, but not what it was. UCLA students live all around Westwood so the restaurants are well attended, esp that In N Out and Chick fila.

[bossabreezes]

Originally Posted by LA21st

Did you post the comment in Seattle's thread?
They had 4 close with a much smaller population
Troll.

Somebody from.nyc should really really not be talking about crime right now
Social media is going off how nyc sucks these days z not that you would see the truth on this forum.

Reddit covers it very well though. Nyc looks God awful.

I live in Los Angeles. I love Los Angeles. I don't care about Seattle.

You are clearly unhinged, and/or 12 years old. I don't care about your responses to me, if you continue to try and troll me I will ignore you. Los Angeles has a homeless problem. I wish it didn't, which is why I highlight it because I want it to get better. Ignoring it doesn't make it better

Be well <3

[bossabreezes]

Originally Posted by LAsam

Candidly, I haven't been to Westwood Village since pre-pandemic times so I'm not sure how it is these days. I have been to the Santa Monica Promenade and that has definitely become much less popular than it was back in the early 2010's. IMO, Santa Monica hasn't invested nearly enough in the Promenade's upkeep or continued modernization. I always preferred Main St in Santa Monica and that's still doing pretty well.

I was at the promenade a few days ago and it felt really sad. Mostly still occupied by businesses, but the vibe was almost creepy. Santa Monica has seen an absurd influx in homeless, especially by the pier and promenade, that it just doesn't feel pleasant seeing all the suffering.

[LA21st]

Originally Posted by bossabreezes

I live in Los Angeles. I love Los Angeles. I don't care about Seattle.

You are clearly unhinged, and/or 12 years old. I don't care about your responses to me, if you continue to try and troll me I will ignore you. Los Angeles has a homeless problem. I wish it didn't, which is why I highlight it because I want it to get better. Ignoring it doesn't make it better

Be well <3

You've never posted here until someone mentioned something negative.
Thats a troll.

[LA21st]

Originally Posted by bossabreezes

I was at the promenade a few days ago and it felt really sad. Mostly still occupied by businesses, but the vibe was almost creepy. Santa Monica has seen an absurd influx in homeless, especially by the pier and promenade, that it just doesn't feel pleasant seeing all the suffering.

I work next to the promenade. No idea what you're talking about. Tourists have been back for months. I see them every day, at lunch and more after work. Are there some homeless? Sure, but creepy vibe?
Get real.

[Illithid Dude]

The Promenade has definitely fallen on harder times. There are some blocks of it that are over half vacant, and the remaining stores are of a much lower quality than they once were. A few tattoo parlors have even opened up! While I have nothing against tattoo parlors, there would have been a time where such a business operating on the promenade was inconceivable. Now we are lucky to have them. These are all issues that could easily be solved if Santa Monica City Council had the desire and political willpower to do so. The Promenade could be upzoned to include office and residential components. The strip could be evolved form a tourist destination to a genuine residential community. However, I doubt the current slow-growth iteration of the SMCC would support the relatively drastic measures necessary to reverse the Promenade's decline. As of now I think they've proposed... new streetscaping. Like that'll solve anything. Streetscaping is not the Promenade's issue.

[LA21st]

Originally Posted by Illithid Dude

The Promenade has definitely fallen on harder times. There are some blocks of it that are over half vacant, and the remaining stores are of a much lower quality than they once were. A few tattoo parlors have even opened up! While I have nothing against tattoo parlors, there would have been a time where such a business operating on the promenade was inconceivable. Now we are lucky to have them. These are all issues that could easily be solved if Santa Monica City Council had the desire and political willpower to do so. The Promenade could be upzoned to include office and residential components. The strip could be evolved form a tourist destination to a genuine residential community. However, I doubt the current slow-growth iteration of the SMCC would support the relatively drastic measures necessary to reverse the Promenade's decline. As of now I think they've proposed... new streetscaping. Like that'll solve anything. Streetscaping is not the Promenade's issue.

The promenade is 3 blocks.
Where do you get all these blocks from.
The only part that's really struggling is between Arizona and Wilshire, maybe half a block there that sucks.

[CaliNative]

Originally Posted by sopas ej

I think there's more to Westwood Village's "decline" as a hip place to be; it can be attributed to more than just one thing. It was *THE* spot to hang out in/go to on weekends in LA during the 1980s. There were the movie theaters, boutiques, restaurants, bookshops, Tower Records had a location there, it was a total hangout for teens and twenty-somethings, and of course the UCLA campus provided that college student demographic. Ultimately, people in LA are fickle when it comes to places to hang out at---Westwood Village just became "passé." Right around 1989 or 1990, Santa Monica took what had been a run-down pedestrianized 3rd Street from the 1960s, changed the landscaping and paving, and then rebranded it as the "Third Street Promenade." And then from that point on, "The Promenade" or "Third Street" started becoming more of the hangout place, and Westwood crowds started to diminish. Parking was easier at Third Street Promenade too compared to trying to find parking in Westwood, so that contributed to Westwood starting to become less popular. And then the news media played up the killing of Karen Toshima in Westwood, which happened in 1992 or something, who was a 20-something woman out having fun with friends but got caught in the crossfire of a gang shooting. An unfortunate and sad incident for sure. But people generally point to that incident as the "death" of Westwood as a hangout, but I think it had already started to decline before that.

Edit: Hehe reminiscing about the Westwood Village of my teen years during the 1980s, I'm remembering that there was even a nightclub there called Dillon's, and there was even a Bullock's department store. Back in the 80s on Friday nights, they'd even close down some of the streets in the village, and it'd all be people walking everywhere. They even had pedi-cabs.

And they had bookstores. I think these student-oriented businesses started going away when UCLA expanded its Student Union/bookstore. It's like why would a UCLA student living on campus go into Westwood Village when you can just go to the Student Union?

Like you sopas, I remember how "The Village" used to be in the 1970s & early 1980s (was a UCLA undergrad/grad student from 1972-1981). Incredibly crowded on weekends. Restaurants filled. Bookshops crowded with students. Video arcades in the early 1980s. Crowded movie theaters, where some films premiered. Hamburger Hamlet. Friday and Saturday nights were crazy crowded. A refuge from study.

I didn't spend much time in WV after 1982, but when I was there I did notice a slow decline. The recession of 1980-82 may have been the first hit, when interest rates went to 20% and unemployment to 10%, and students didn't go there as much. Maybe people got tired of the high prices, crowds and parking shortages, and found other places to go on weekends. A bit of revival in the mid 1980s. TV news heavily covered the gangs coming in and the Toshima death. That may have factored in, but you are correct sopas--the slow decline started in the early 1980s, a decade before Toshima died from a stray bullet.

Come to think about it, the decline started about the time I stopped going in '82. I dropped a lot of quarters in video games "Starcastles" and Pacman. Sopas, maybe we passed each other in those crowds back then, at the height of the boom.

I have hope the Village will make a comeback. Every UCLA alum should. I think it will, but the fun vibe of 1972-1981 will probably never exactly return. That was MY Village. Nothing is forever. Calinative

[sopas ej]

Originally Posted by CaliNative

Like you sopas, I remember how "The Village" used to be in the 1970s & early 1980s (was a UCLA undergrad/grad student from 1972-1981). Incredibly crowded on weekends. Restaurants filled. Bookshops crowded with students. Video arcades in the early 1980s. Crowded movie theaters, where some films premiered. Hamburger Hamlet. Friday and Saturday nights were crazy crowded. A refuge from study.

I didn't spend much time in WV after 1982, but when I was there I did notice a slow decline. The recession of 1980-82 may have been the first hit, when interest rates went to 20% and unemployment to 10%, and students didn't go there as much. Maybe people got tired of the high prices, crowds and parking shortages, and found other places to go on weekends. A bit of revival in the mid 1980s. TV news heavily covered the gangs coming in and the Toshima death. That may have factored in, but you are correct sopas--the slow decline started in the early 1980s, a decade before Toshima died from a stray bullet.

Come to think about it, the decline started about the time I stopped going in '82. I dropped a lot of quarters in video games "Starcastles" and Pacman. Sopas, maybe we passed each other in those crowds back then, at the height of the boom.

I have hope the Village will make a comeback. Every UCLA alum should. I think it will, but the fun vibe of 1972-1981 will probably never exactly return. That was MY Village. Nothing is forever. Calinative

I guess I missed you by a few years! I was 12 years old in 1982. I didn't start going to Westwood until about 1983-84, when my sister was old enough to drive and she'd drop me and a friend off in the village while she saw her bf who was a UCLA frosh or sophomore at the time, and she was in high school still---funny how times have changed; now that I think of it, when I was in high school, I knew quite a few people who dated older guys. Anyway... after I got my own drivers license at 16, I would go with a friend to Westwood, and yeah, parking was a bitch. I learned to park at the federal building and then we'd walk into the village from there. So I guess by the time I started going to Westwood, it was in somewhat of a second wind as you mentioned, but then started declining even more.

And I was wrong about the year of the Karen Toshima shooting, it happened in 1988. I was confusing the year with the "gang violence" that occurred in Westwood during a showing of "New Jack City" in 1991, which again got a lot of local media attention and played up the supposed "downfall" of Westwood. But anyway, the Toshima shooting was always seen as the turning point in Westwood's popularity as a hangout. And like BrandonJXN pointed out, her shooting and the media response to it pointed out the inequities of media attention and police response, because during the 1980s, South Los Angeles had many gang shootings and kilings, but the Toshima killing got so much attention because it happened on the affluent Westside and the victim wasn't African-American. I totally see how resentment and anger formed from that.

[sopas ej]

Originally Posted by homebucket

Interesting. Did not know that about the history of Westwood Village. I stayed there recently to visit a friend who was giving birth at UCLA Medical Center and found it to be a very relaxed, walkable little neighborhood. A good amount of pedestrian activity, without it feeling overly crowded or congested. Certainly not a place in a state of decline. Sawtelle was very similar in that regard as well. More organic. I think I prefer both to the Third Street Promenade actually which feels more manicured as you allude to.

Sawtelle itself has evolved over the decades. It used to be a much sleepier, smaller version of Little Tokyo. And there were still some Japanese-American owned nurseries there, like at least 2 or 3 of them, if I remember correctly. But yeah, I like Sawtelle, and I eat there occasionally. Like I said, LA's hangout spots constantly change, and LA people can be fickle about what neighborhood is suddenly in and what neighborhood is suddenly out.

Melrose is another good example of that. It's IN. It's OUT. It's IN again...

[homebucket]

Originally Posted by sopas ej

Sawtelle itself has evolved over the decades. It used to be a much sleepier, smaller version of Little Tokyo. And there were still some Japanese-American owned nurseries there, like at least 2 or 3 of them, if I remember correctly. But yeah, I like Sawtelle, and I eat there occasionally. Like I said, LA's hangout spots constantly change, and LA people can be fickle about what neighborhood is suddenly in and what neighborhood is suddenly out.

Melrose is another good example of that. It's IN. It's OUT. It's IN again...

• Video Link

[homebucket]

Originally Posted by sopas ej

Sawtelle itself has evolved over the decades. It used to be a much sleepier, smaller version of Little Tokyo. And there were still some Japanese-American owned nurseries there, like at least 2 or 3 of them, if I remember correctly. But yeah, I like Sawtelle, and I eat there occasionally. Like I said, LA's hangout spots constantly change, and LA people can be fickle about what neighborhood is suddenly in and what neighborhood is suddenly out.

Hide Sushi and Tsujita are my usual go to spots if I'm in that area. Mmm yummy!

[sopas ej]

Originally Posted by homebucket

Hide Sushi and Tsujita are my usual go to spots if I'm in that area. Mmm yummy!

Yes! I don't go to Sawtelle often, but those places are good. And that particular location for Chinchinkurin was the first place I've ever had Hiroshima-style okonomiyaki.

[sopas ej]

Originally Posted by LA21st

The promenade is 3 blocks.
Where do you get all these blocks from.
The only part that's really struggling is between Arizona and Wilshire, maybe half a block there that sucks.

The funny thing is, that particular block between Arizona and Wilshire was ALWAYS the "seediest" part, even back in the early 1990s. That's always where you saw at least one or 2 homeless people. And that was also usually the sleepiest part of the Promenade.

[LA21st]

Originally Posted by sopas ej

The funny thing is, that particular block between Arizona and Wilshire was ALWAYS the "seediest" part, even back in the early 1990s. That's always where you saw at least one or 2 homeless people. And that was also usually the sleepiest part of the Promenade.

Yea, I don't think the promenade is as good as it was but it's actually quite vibrant lately. Nothing creepy about it.

[caligrad]

I've been to the promenade a good 3 times post the covid lockdowns and its actually pretty busy/vibrant. There are a few stores missing/empty but that's to be expected when landlords are asking for an arm and a leg in monthly rent for a glorified outdoor mall that's honestly a tourist trap that is a hassle to get to from anywhere else in the city, parking is blah, what do you expect? Can't blame tenants or the city or visitors. it's these landlords with the idea that "people will want to set up shop here with my outdated stores" when there are 100s of other options elsewhere that are actually even busier. There's nothing new/different there that I couldn't get at any other mall. The theaters along the promenade are dated and take up a lot of space. It looks old.

I'll go as far as to say make the whole corridor a "lights and signs" district. Give it a classier Freemont street treatment and watch what happens.

[LA21st]

Originally Posted by caligrad

I've been to the promenade a good 3 times post the covid lockdowns and its actually pretty busy/vibrant. There are a few stores missing/empty but that's to be expected when landlords are asking for an arm and a leg in monthly rent for a glorified outdoor mall that's honestly a tourist trap that is a hassle to get to from anywhere else in the city, parking is blah, what do you expect? Can't blame tenants or the city or visitors. it's these landlords with the idea that "people will want to set up shop here with my outdated stores" when there are 100s of other options elsewhere that are actually even busier. There's nothing new/different there that I couldn't get at any other mall. The theaters along the promenade are dated and take up a lot of space. It looks old.

I'll go as far as to say make the whole corridor a "lights and signs" district. Give it a classier Freemont street treatment and watch what happens.

If you look closely at some of the closed storefronts, some are opening something soon. I think in a few months you'll see a better improvement. But the crowds have returned.

It's still recovering from covid. Every city is. Even Miami has tons of empty storefronts, and it was "open".

[craigs]

Originally Posted by sopas ej

I think there's more to Westwood Village's "decline" as a hip place to be; it can be attributed to more than just one thing. It was *THE* spot to hang out in/go to on weekends in LA during the 1980s. There were the movie theaters, boutiques, restaurants, bookshops, Tower Records had a location there, it was a total hangout for teens and twenty-somethings, and of course the UCLA campus provided that college student demographic. Ultimately, people in LA are fickle when it comes to places to hang out at---Westwood Village just became "passé." Right around 1989 or 1990, Santa Monica took what had been a run-down pedestrianized 3rd Street from the 1960s, changed the landscaping and paving, and then rebranded it as the "Third Street Promenade." And then from that point on, "The Promenade" or "Third Street" started becoming more of the hangout place, and Westwood crowds started to diminish. Parking was easier at Third Street Promenade too compared to trying to find parking in Westwood, so that contributed to Westwood starting to become less popular. And then the news media played up the killing of Karen Toshima in Westwood, which happened in 1992 or something, who was a 20-something woman out having fun with friends but got caught in the crossfire of a gang shooting. An unfortunate and sad incident for sure. But people generally point to that incident as the "death" of Westwood as a hangout, but I think it had already started to decline before that.

Edit: Hehe reminiscing about the Westwood Village of my teen years during the 1980s, I'm remembering that there was even a nightclub there called Dillon's, and there was even a Bullock's department store. Back in the 80s on Friday nights, they'd even close down some of the streets in the village, and it'd all be people walking everywhere. They even had pedi-cabs.

And they had bookstores. I think these student-oriented businesses started going away when UCLA expanded its Student Union/bookstore. It's like why would a UCLA student living on campus go into Westwood Village when you can just go to the Student Union?

Originally Posted by CaliNative

Like you sopas, I remember how "The Village" used to be in the 1970s & early 1980s (was a UCLA undergrad/grad student from 1972-1981). Incredibly crowded on weekends. Restaurants filled. Bookshops crowded with students. Video arcades in the early 1980s. Crowded movie theaters, where some films premiered. Hamburger Hamlet. Friday and Saturday nights were crazy crowded. A refuge from study.

I didn't spend much time in WV after 1982, but when I was there I did notice a slow decline. The recession of 1980-82 may have been the first hit, when interest rates went to 20% and unemployment to 10%, and students didn't go there as much. Maybe people got tired of the high prices, crowds and parking shortages, and found other places to go on weekends. A bit of revival in the mid 1980s. TV news heavily covered the gangs coming in and the Toshima death. That may have factored in, but you are correct sopas--the slow decline started in the early 1980s, a decade before Toshima died from a stray bullet.

Come to think about it, the decline started about the time I stopped going in '82. I dropped a lot of quarters in video games "Starcastles" and Pacman. Sopas, maybe we passed each other in those crowds back then, at the height of the boom.

I have hope the Village will make a comeback. Every UCLA alum should. I think it will, but the fun vibe of 1972-1981 will probably never exactly return. That was MY Village. Nothing is forever. Calinative

I graduated in 2001, and when I first experienced the Village it was pretty quiet and genteel--someone at school accurately described it as "downtown Bel Air." I remember reading in the Daily Bruin that NIMBY homeowners were constantly fighting against the permitting of anything explicitly student-oriented, including and especially bars, because it might bring a rowdy element into "their" area. Honestly, I went to other parts of town for fun, like West Hollywood and Silver Lake.

Originally Posted by sopas ej

Sawtelle itself has evolved over the decades. It used to be a much sleepier, smaller version of Little Tokyo. And there were still some Japanese-American owned nurseries there, like at least 2 or 3 of them, if I remember correctly. But yeah, I like Sawtelle, and I eat there occasionally. Like I said, LA's hangout spots constantly change, and LA people can be fickle about what neighborhood is suddenly in and what neighborhood is suddenly out.

Melrose is another good example of that. It's IN. It's OUT. It's IN again...

I lived in Sawtelle/West LA for my last two years of college. I couldn't really afford sushi much back in those days, so I cannot reminisce about good food, but the area had a distinctively chill vibe. This was before many of the single-family homes originally owned by Japanese families were torn down and replaced with four-story apartment/condo buildings. Cinefile and the Nuart created a total nexus at that time. I got to chat with Margaret Cho about how we both were from San Francisco at the Nuart one night, it was awesome.