Ottawa Macdonald-Cartier International Airport (YOW/CYOW)

[Dominion301]

Today’s departure count: 62

Today’s cancellation count (so far): 2

[Calfan12]

Originally Posted by Dominion301

As it currently stands, nobody is offering YOW-YEG nonstop in winter 23-24. Seems like a golden opportunity for Porter to enter.

Not surprised as Ottawa YOW- YEG - YOW is quite seasonal✅.

Makes sense to consolidate the passengers through Toronto YYZ, Vancouver YVR, Montreal YUL & Calgary YYC.

[Calfan12]

Originally Posted by originalmuffins

With Westjet and AC pretty much abandoning Ottawa (I know AC still offers flights - but its very barebones on what they want to provide for us here - they don't care about our market), Flair could swoop in and look into making Ottawa a secondary hub. That plus KLM or Lufthansa providing direct services to Amsterdam or Frankfurt would be huge. We really wouldn't need AC or Westjet again after that. Porter+Flair+AF+??? would serve and allow Ottawa's airport to flourish with great passenger volume and great options for direct/1 connection across Canada, USA, sun destinations, and Europe (sprinkled in with a bit of United). Here's hoping!!!

Ottawa YOW is quite a seasonal market✅. So not surprising why Air Canada & WestJet & along with few other airlines have limited flights✈️ there.

As for KLM it codeshares with WestJet to connect passengers through Toronto YYZ, Calgary YYC, Vancouver YVR, Montreal YUL & Edmonton YEG in Canada from Amsterdam AMS currently & don't think will see KLM at YOW as it already has Air France (which is part of KL/AF Airlines alliance group).

Lufthansa is connecting passengers from Frankfurt FRA through Toronto YYZ, Vancouver YVR, Montreal YUL, (Calgary YYC which is a joint venture between Air Canada /LH with AC operating it year round. Also Eurowings Discover which is owned by LH operating it Spring/Summer seasons to both YYC / Halfax YHZ.

I think YOW (maybe) has a better chance of getting a Eurowings Discover service to FRA.

[fanofYOW]

I’m hoping for Icelandair due to their partnership with Porter. I also feel like YOW is only a seasonal airport because AC and WS have made it that way. I’ve said this before and I’ll say it again: If Calgary can be made into a global hub, so can YOW. Now more than ever people are looking for alternatives to YYZ and YUL.

It’s been also said here before that if Porter really prioritizes YOW, pax can climb into 8-10m+. It’s a good sign that YOW is currently looking into a terminal expansion. My ultimate hope 5-7 years down is an announcement from Porter for purchase rights to XLRs.

Flair by the way is doing year-round YOW-YEG 3x weekly.

[RomanR27]

Just noticed on Flightradar there was a HiFly A340 that took off for Lisbon. Came in from Tenerife earlier today.

[Dominion301]

Originally Posted by fanofYOW

I’m hoping for Icelandair due to their partnership with Porter. I also feel like YOW is only a seasonal airport because AC and WS have made it that way. I’ve said this before and I’ll say it again: If Calgary can be made into a global hub, so can YOW. Now more than ever people are looking for alternatives to YYZ and YUL.

It’s been also said here before that if Porter really prioritizes YOW, pax can climb into 8-10m+. It’s a good sign that YOW is currently looking into a terminal expansion. My ultimate hope 5-7 years down is an announcement from Porter for purchase rights to XLRs.

Flair by the way is doing year-round YOW-YEG 3x weekly.

Interesting that the moment AC reduce YEG to summer seasonal, F8 restore it to year-round.

Originally Posted by RomanR27

Just noticed on Flightradar there was a HiFly A340 that took off for Lisbon. Came in from Tenerife earlier today.

I saw a glimpse of a 340 here while driving along Letrim. Figured it was HiFly. Was down at DND so no doubt a troop charter.

[Harley613]

Originally Posted by RomanR27

Just noticed on Flightradar there was a HiFly A340 that took off for Lisbon. Came in from Tenerife earlier today.

I just came on to ask if anyone else saw that A340 this evening! It took off right over my head while I was having dinner on a patio in Barrhaven. So awesome!!!!

[originalmuffins]

Originally Posted by fanofYOW

I’m hoping for Icelandair due to their partnership with Porter. I also feel like YOW is only a seasonal airport because AC and WS have made it that way. I’ve said this before and I’ll say it again: If Calgary can be made into a global hub, so can YOW. Now more than ever people are looking for alternatives to YYZ and YUL.

It’s been also said here before that if Porter really prioritizes YOW, pax can climb into 8-10m+. It’s a good sign that YOW is currently looking into a terminal expansion. My ultimate hope 5-7 years down is an announcement from Porter for purchase rights to XLRs.

Flair by the way is doing year-round YOW-YEG 3x weekly.

This exactly, I hate the "Ottawa is a seasonal airport" because it can be much more - especially when Calgary or other similarly sized cities get way better direct routes. It can get there, it just needs to be focused on by the likes of Porter and Flair, plus some other direct routes via tourism funding. Hopefully we can see the growth in the next 7-8 years. I'm hopeful with Porter's investment and plan.

Personally, I've gotten very tired of the stopping in YYZ or YUL and having to run on a 50 minute - 1 hour transfer. It's why I'll be using Porter exclusively for in Canada airfare.

Glad to see Flair restore YOW-YEG as a regular. Would be nice if Flair bump up Ottawa from a focus city to a hub for eastern connections.

[mxg308]

Originally Posted by originalmuffins

This exactly, I hate the "Ottawa is a seasonal airport" because it can be much more - especially when Calgary or other similarly sized cities get way better direct routes. It can get there, it just needs to be focused on by the likes of Porter and Flair, plus some other direct routes via tourism funding. Hopefully we can see the growth in the next 7-8 years. I'm hopeful with Porter's investment and plan.

Personally, I've gotten very tired of the stopping in YYZ or YUL and having to run on a 50 minute - 1 hour transfer. It's why I'll be using Porter exclusively for in Canada airfare.

Glad to see Flair restore YOW-YEG as a regular. Would be nice if Flair bump up Ottawa from a focus city to a hub for eastern connections.

In before Calfan replies with the standard but YOW is between YUL and YYZ and YYC serves an area that isn't in direct competition and therefore YOW should be happy to have flights to only YYZ, YUL, YYC and YVR. Anyway, I agree there is potential at YOW but it has to be incremental and it needs to market itself as an alternative to YYZ and YUL. If HFR gets off the ground, Porter should partner itself with VIA and offer connections to YUL and along the new corridor to Peterborough. It's too bad we can't make YOW intermodal with a route from Barrhaven --> YOW --> Ottawa Train Station. That would really transform YOW into a hub.

[caetura]

To me, a strong a strategy for Porter out of YOW would be 1. direct connections to major US hubs LGA, JFK, MIA, DFW, LAX, SFO, and 2. interline or code share agreements with OneWorld (American, Alaska, Qantas, Cathay, British, JAL)

Aside from Boston + domestic east coast routes, Porter seems to be overlapping with AC. For O&D traffic your now competing on price with AC. For connecting traffic out of YHZ/YYZ/YVR Porter offers a lot less options than AC in terms of onward choices. So why not offer something AC cannot? I don't think they would have any problems filling planes to major US hubs, particularly with single ticket connections onwards.

Think routes like YOW - LAX - MEL (Porter -> Qantas). Where today the only options require 2 stops (e.g. YOW - YYZ/YUL - LAX - MEL or YOW - YVR - BNE/SYD - MEL)

[fanofYOW]

I totally agree that Porter should consider One World in the future. I’m not an expert in this so I don’t know what criteria is if any a carrier would need to join. An increase in Porter operations in YOW may make BA interested in serving YOW-LHR. That and connections with AA in US hubs from places like LAX, SFO, MIA, DFW would be fantastic. A massive chunk of the potential Porter destinations in the US are already hubs for AA. There is just so much opportunity right now for YOW thanks to Porter.

[originalmuffins]

Originally Posted by mxg308

In before Calfan replies with the standard but YOW is between YUL and YYZ and YYC serves an area that isn't in direct competition and therefore YOW should be happy to have flights to only YYZ, YUL, YYC and YVR. Anyway, I agree there is potential at YOW but it has to be incremental and it needs to market itself as an alternative to YYZ and YUL. If HFR gets off the ground, Porter should partner itself with VIA and offer connections to YUL and along the new corridor to Peterborough. It's too bad we can't make YOW intermodal with a route from Barrhaven --> YOW --> Ottawa Train Station. That would really transform YOW into a hub.

Yeah, it's this mentality that Ottawa is small that irks me. Calgary committed and now has 14mil pax. Ottawa doesn't have to get that number in the immediate future, but like others said; it can work to get to 8-10 mil especially with Porter using it as a hub. I'm glad Porter saw the opportunity because we were a zero-hub airport prior. I too think a direct route from Barrhaven - YOW - Ottawa Train station would be huge especially for integration with HFR. Good example would be those in Kingston would then be able to prefer/take routes via Ottawa instead of having to go YYZ. Potential to have Ottawa as a transit hub for maritimes. They'd now have the choice to transit through YOW versus having to transit through YYZ or YUL. I hate transiting through YYZ, it's just insane how much you have to run if the gates don't land beside each other.

Originally Posted by caetura

To me, a strong a strategy for Porter out of YOW would be 1. direct connections to major US hubs LGA, JFK, MIA, DFW, LAX, SFO, and 2. interline or code share agreements with OneWorld (American, Alaska, Qantas, Cathay, British, JAL)

Aside from Boston + domestic east coast routes, Porter seems to be overlapping with AC. For O&D traffic your now competing on price with AC. For connecting traffic out of YHZ/YYZ/YVR Porter offers a lot less options than AC in terms of onward choices. So why not offer something AC cannot? I don't think they would have any problems filling planes to major US hubs, particularly with single ticket connections onwards.

Think routes like YOW - LAX - MEL (Porter -> Qantas). Where today the only options require 2 stops (e.g. YOW - YYZ/YUL - LAX - MEL or YOW - YVR - BNE/SYD - MEL)

This is a very good point too. I agree, I think for Porter to truly maximize, they need to join an alliance like OneWorld. Then, frequent travelers can start accumulating points on international destinations, and routes become easier with less transits. Part of the reason I would like for euro direct flights like London, Frankfurt, or Amsterdam to return. The point of KLM having agreements with WestJet so why would they start direct routes to Ottawa doesn't make sense either, AF is part of the same ownership group.

If Porter was able to join OneWorld (even SkyTeam), that would be awesome. BA can start offering direct to London which would then open up routes via Porter for incoming passengers from UK.

Originally Posted by fanofYOW

I totally agree that Porter should consider One World in the future. I’m not an expert in this so I don’t know what criteria is if any a carrier would need to join. An increase in Porter operations in YOW may make BA interested in serving YOW-LHR. That and connections with AA in US hubs from places like LAX, SFO, MIA, DFW would be fantastic. A massive chunk of the potential Porter destinations in the US are already hubs for AA. There is just so much opportunity right now for YOW thanks to Porter.

Exactly, that BA direct to London offering creates much better routes/connections further into Europe or ME. YOW --> LHR --> ??? makes things so much better than YOW --> YYZ --> ??? --> ???. That opportunity Porter is creating is huge. It is just nice to see them seeing the open opportunity and taking it. I hope Porter is successful so this makes AC/WJ see what was missing (but even if they don't, I just want Porter to succeed). AF routes being successful will be huge in expansion to future routes and YOW+ can futureproof with their new terminal planning if all starts going well.

[Dominion301]

Originally Posted by Calfan12

Ottawa YOW is quite a seasonal market✅. So not surprising why Air Canada & WestJet & along with few other airlines have limited flights✈️ there.

As for KLM it codeshares with WestJet to connect passengers through Toronto YYZ, Calgary YYC, Vancouver YVR, Montreal YUL & Edmonton YEG in Canada from Amsterdam AMS currently & don't think will see KLM at YOW as it already has Air France (which is part of KL/AF Airlines alliance group).

Lufthansa is connecting passengers from Frankfurt FRA through Toronto YYZ, Vancouver YVR, Montreal YUL, (Calgary YYC which is a joint venture between Air Canada /LH with AC operating it year round. Also Eurowings Discover which is owned by LH operating it Spring/Summer seasons to both YYC / Halfax YHZ.

I think YOW (maybe) has a better chance of getting a Eurowings Discover service to FRA.

All airports in Canada have seasonality but Ottawa isn’t much different than Toronto or Montreal in terms of shifting travel patterns. Having a look at the monthly pax stats on YOW’s website is evidence of that. Atlantic Canada is where you see the extreme seasonality. It’s why Charlottetown can support nonstops to YYC and YEG in summer yet only a couple of CR9s per day in winter to YYZ vs Rouge 319/20/21s in summer. I wish YHZ would publish monthly statistics to show those seasonal swings. I actually in I think 2018 asked YHZ for their monthly numbers and they actually emailed them to me. I’ll see if I can dig them out to show you what I mean.

Today’s departure count: 68

Today’s cancellation count (so far): 2

[RomanR27]

Originally Posted by Harley613

I just came on to ask if anyone else saw that A340 this evening! It took off right over my head while I was having dinner on a patio in Barrhaven. So awesome!!!!

It means nothing in the grand scheme of the pandemic, but I'm still so bummed Covid took away YOW having scheduled A340 service.

[fanofYOW]

Pretty random observation but YOW-LAS with Flair is actually pretty expensive for an ULCC. Probably because of good uptake I hope?

[RomanR27]

Originally Posted by fanofYOW

Pretty random observation but YOW-LAS with Flair is actually pretty expensive for an ULCC. Probably because of good uptake I hope?

My first thought was that it could also be that they're able to charge more of a premium on this route since they have no direct competition, but checking Google Flights further out dates have some cheap fares so that's a good sign bookings are strong.

[Tesladom]

I flew Porter to YYZ last week. Nice plane, still great service, but they must be bleeding cash. No more than 30 passengers on both flights (132 capacity)

[Tesladom]

Originally Posted by Calfan12

I think YOW (maybe) has a better chance of getting a Eurowings Discover service to FRA.

Eurowings is Luftansa's budget leisure brand (their Swoop or Rouge)

Why not Transat? At least in summer?

[MountainView]

Originally Posted by Tesladom

Eurowings is Luftansa's budget leisure brand (their Swoop or Rouge)

Why not Transat? At least in summer?

Perhaps with Air Transat if Porter continues to build operations at YOW, as they have a codeshare with AT. This could feed YVR, YQT, YTZ (maybe YYC/YEG if added) to an AT flight on an A321 to Europe (LGW, AMS, or CDG in that order).

AT would need folks ending their ticketed journey at their destination in Europe though, whereas Eurowings passengers could connect onwards.

I think our best bet is LH reinstating/beginning FRA (if they have the planes), AC redeploying a B788 (which they only have 8) to LHR, YOW airport authority working magic to bring BA to YOW even 5x to LGW to begin (LHR is preferable), or folks in YOW proving that AF to CDG is a win and it going daily next summer on the A330 or even 5-6x on the B789 (I think daily A330 would be a big win though).

Not sure AT really cares about much outside of YUL, YYZ, and to an extent, YQB nowadays.

[originalmuffins]

Originally Posted by Tesladom

I flew Porter to YYZ last week. Nice plane, still great service, but they must be bleeding cash. No more than 30 passengers on both flights (132 capacity)

That's odd, both times I flew Porter to YYZ then to YVR (with a sizeable chunk of that flight transferring from YOW, atleast more than half), the planes were packed. But frankly, I think the smaller planes to YTZ might be better for YOW-Toronto since YOW will be getting more direct options so they won't need to stop by YYZ as much from YOW.

Originally Posted by MountainView

Perhaps with Air Transat if Porter continues to build operations at YOW, as they have a codeshare with AT. This could feed YVR, YQT, YTZ (maybe YYC/YEG if added) to an AT flight on an A321 to Europe (LGW, AMS, or CDG in that order).

AT would need folks ending their ticketed journey at their destination in Europe though, whereas Eurowings passengers could connect onwards.

I think our best bet is LH reinstating/beginning FRA (if they have the planes), AC redeploying a B788 (which they only have 8) to LHR, YOW airport authority working magic to bring BA to YOW even 5x to LGW to begin (LHR is preferable), or folks in YOW proving that AF to CDG is a win and it going daily next summer on the A330 or even 5-6x on the B789 (I think daily A330 would be a big win though).

Not sure AT really cares about much outside of YUL, YYZ, and to an extent, YQB nowadays.

I think this is the key here. LH or Porter joining OneWorld and YOW getting BA to dedicate a direct route to YOW is huge, even if 4-5 times a week year round. LH might be our best bet though, but I'm all for it. As long as the FRA and CDG routes are supported, then we can continue getting them year-round. I've decided to dedicate myself to using Porter and Flair as much as possible as those are our best bet at YOW growing and getting us those better connections and direct routes.