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  #7181  
Old Posted May 25, 2022, 2:56 PM
WinCitySparky WinCitySparky is online now
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I feel like at this point replacing the parkade with commercial ground level would be more cost effective, and more financially plausible for the developer, plus overall better for the streetscape
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  #7182  
Old Posted May 25, 2022, 2:59 PM
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I think there's a bit of commercial on the main floor.

I'm not defending it, but towers are really difficult to design and make interesting. I just really hate the massive parkade base.
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  #7183  
Old Posted May 25, 2022, 3:38 PM
BAKGUY BAKGUY is offline
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I know nobody likes that tower, but I dunno... I see it as a good density builder. For instance, Hong Kong has a spectacular skyline but really once you get away from the harbour where the showpiece office towers are, there are very few beauties and a lot of unremarkable vertical people-warehouses. You don't get the density and vitality without those types of buildings.

And anything that fills in one of the biggest gaping holes in the downtown streetscape with a tower has to have some merit. Not to mention the fact that the on-site parking will hopefully reduce demand for the surface parking nearby and maybe prod some development there.

Even then, while it's not beautiful, it isn't hideous either. There are much uglier towers in the skyline than this one. On the whole when you consider its appearance and the density it would bring, it will be a net positive. Not a huge positive, but a net positive nonetheless. I hope it gets built.
Without the top hat, which has apparently been removed or trimmed vastly, plus a prettied up parkade it is not too bad.
We have way uglier hi-rises.. The Radisson, former Place Louis Riel, Holiday Towers + man others so this is actually somewhat better. I think we should all be patient and wait to see the new renderings before we judge too harshly. There are not too many large projects announced after True North is completed. This will add many people to the social fabric of our city centre.
I also prefer main floor retail on all new builds...but if not.. there exists plenty of empty fronts on Portage avenue that will anxiously be able to cater to the new residents here & 300 main etc..
This is a huge deal for downtown & the city's skyline and overall image Again, I think we can not expect something more grand without it being beyond unaffordable & not relatable to our market.
There is not much action downtown right now so perhaps we need to celebrate this, especially since they altered the design.

Last edited by BAKGUY; May 25, 2022 at 4:46 PM.
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  #7184  
Old Posted May 25, 2022, 3:50 PM
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With the current state of our downtown I am frankly amazed that developers feel there is potential in residential development at all right now. It is not an inviting place these days. If someone wants to build new residential then the City should take the money and run as far as I am concerned.
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  #7185  
Old Posted May 25, 2022, 4:59 PM
Sheepish Sheepish is offline
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Fair enough...I will hold judgement (not that the developer would care about my judgement!). I just think there is a wide space between hideous and iconic...and the render as is leans heavily to the hideous. (particularly if you take away the beautiful park like setting it has been plopped down in in the rendering!)
Here is my issue - in a city that is lacking in natural beauty (once you get away from the rivers), there needs to be some creative use of design to create beauty. This sure doesn't do it! And defending this by noting there is 'far worse' would seem to suggest that '2 wrongs indeed make a right'. We should expect better.
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  #7186  
Old Posted May 25, 2022, 5:08 PM
zalf zalf is offline
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If you have rigid aesthetic requirements for every residential highrise in downtown Winnipeg, you're not going to get a bunch of beautiful towers, you're going to get no towers at all.

I think the first step to getting the market to deliver consistently high-quality towers being built downtown is making downtown for desirable, and the first step to that is just getting more people living and spending time downtown.

Is the tower ugly? Yeah. Does it a giant hideous parkade? Yes, but from other posts here it sounds like the part that actually faces the sidewalk would be CRUs. I see this as a strict improvement. The site is currently an empty lot.
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  #7187  
Old Posted May 25, 2022, 5:10 PM
T'Cona T'Cona is offline
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I don't think you have to break the bank to find something in the middle in terms of design and material.
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  #7188  
Old Posted May 25, 2022, 5:21 PM
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There is ugly and there is ugly.

Some buildings are just so bad that they are truly objectionable. That Baydo Tower in downtown Saskatoon comes to mind, it is just a blight on that otherwise beautiful city. I realize some might disagree, but I don't think this one, at least based on the renderings we've seen, is in that category.
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  #7189  
Old Posted May 25, 2022, 5:31 PM
GreyGarden GreyGarden is offline
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I think the first step to getting the market to deliver consistently high-quality towers being built downtown is making downtown for desirable, and the first step to that is just getting more people living and spending time downtown.
I agree with Zalf.

This is an objectively ugly tower by Canadian standards. Bulky, small window coverage, and cheap looking cladding/paneling. I think removing the giant hat will be an improvement and will hopefully make it stand out less.

But at the end of the day it adds residential density to a vacant lot so that is a win in my books. Its unfortunate that due to its size it will be fairly prominent, but there are plenty of nearby lots which if developed tastefully could dilute the ugliness of this building. In order to get nice buildings there needs to be more people who want to spend money on nice apartments. To do that, downtown needs to become more vibrant which I believe we can only achieve by adding more residents and the amenities they attract. Even if those residents have modest incomes and live in modest buildings, they will have an important contribution to the downtown.
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  #7190  
Old Posted May 25, 2022, 9:33 PM
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This MMF project was formally announced today for downtown Selkirk (posted in the other Manitoba developments thread). David Chartrand confirmed in his speech that the building will be replicated on the Roxy Lanes property on Henderson Highway. That will be interesting to have two identical buildings in two different cities.

https://www.chrisd.ca/2022/05/25/sel...is-federation/

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  #7191  
Old Posted May 25, 2022, 9:37 PM
Sheepish Sheepish is offline
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It's ugly by Russian standards too! Yeah...the empty lot is a terrible eyesore and needs to be developed. But this?? 1970's architecture with a hat! Downtown deserves better.
To my mind, the development would be better suited to front on Graham...without the horrible parking pedestal. And further...a high rise isn't necessarily the right answer for the space. Yes, Sky City was pretty interesting and exciting, but that was one solution. An interesting mid rise on Graham could be a stronger addition, rather than trying to shoehorn this monstrosity into an ill-suited space.
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  #7192  
Old Posted May 26, 2022, 12:44 AM
WinCitySparky WinCitySparky is online now
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Originally Posted by trueviking View Post
This MMF project was formally announced today for downtown Selkirk (posted in the other Manitoba developments thread). David Chartrand confirmed in his speech that the building will be replicated on the Roxy Lanes property on Henderson Highway. That will be interesting to have two identical buildings in two different cities.

https://www.chrisd.ca/2022/05/25/sel...is-federation/


Wow, that is nice
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  #7193  
Old Posted May 26, 2022, 12:51 AM
WinCitySparky WinCitySparky is online now
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The Ray Wan tower in Tuxedo is underway
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  #7194  
Old Posted May 26, 2022, 12:38 PM
davequanbury davequanbury is offline
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Originally Posted by esquire View Post
With the current state of our downtown I am frankly amazed that developers feel there is potential in residential development at all right now. It is not an inviting place these days. If someone wants to build new residential then the City should take the money and run as far as I am concerned.
This reminds me of something a prof said during a lecture in an intro to urban geography course, "When the economy is strong, residents are more selective about what gets built in their city. When the economy is weak they are willing to let anything get built."
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  #7195  
Old Posted May 26, 2022, 1:42 PM
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Originally Posted by davequanbury View Post
This reminds me of something a prof said during a lecture in an intro to urban geography course, "When the economy is strong, residents are more selective about what gets built in their city. When the economy is weak they are willing to let anything get built."
This becomes a problem when you're talking about letting drive thru restaurants get built downtown, or strip malls with parking lots like this:



A highrise residential building though? I don't think that is really letting standards slide all that much IMO. If we insist on Monaco-level design standards for downtown Winnipeg residential then the surface lots will remain there until the end of time. Sometimes you have to take the bird in the hand.
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  #7196  
Old Posted May 26, 2022, 1:45 PM
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Originally Posted by trueviking View Post
This MMF project was formally announced today for downtown Selkirk (posted in the other Manitoba developments thread). David Chartrand confirmed in his speech that the building will be replicated on the Roxy Lanes property on Henderson Highway. That will be interesting to have two identical buildings in two different cities.
It's a great design, might as well have two of them. I like it. It will improve the streetscape along that stretch of Henderson.

The MMF has quietly become a major developer across Manitoba... they have put up buildings in smaller towns and cities that haven't seen much development at all in the last 50 years.
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  #7197  
Old Posted May 26, 2022, 10:01 PM
Gravity Wins Gravity Wins is offline
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Slightly off topic, but now I am wondering how common it is to see the same team construct the exact same building in different cities. Are there famous examples of this?
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  #7198  
Old Posted May 26, 2022, 10:33 PM
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^^^ the IKOY milk carton buildings
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  #7199  
Old Posted May 26, 2022, 11:24 PM
WinCitySparky WinCitySparky is online now
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Slightly off topic, but now I am wondering how common it is to see the same team construct the exact same building in different cities. Are there famous examples of this?
The guy that designed the original World Trade Center towers built a single shorter exact copy of one in another US city
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  #7200  
Old Posted May 27, 2022, 3:53 AM
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The guy that designed the original World Trade Center towers built a single shorter exact copy of one in another US city
Really... now I'm curious.
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