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View Poll Results: Were you shocked by any of the cities on the list or the order in which they appeared
Yes 8 40.00%
No 12 60.00%
Voters: 20. You may not vote on this poll

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  #121  
Old Posted Aug 17, 2022, 3:02 PM
mrnyc mrnyc is offline
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Right. Condos in NYC pay insanely high property taxes relative to coops and SFHs. Every residential supertall in NYC is a condo. Hell, there hasn't been a market-rate coop built in NYC in years, I don't think.

If property tax reform ever goes through, property taxes will drop for superluxury housing. It should, if anything, boost supertall housing construction, which currently subsidizes SFHs and coops.
can confirm. the tax abatement in our condo building will disappear in a few years and unless something is done to reform taxes we are in for a tax sticker shocker.
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  #122  
Old Posted Aug 17, 2022, 3:04 PM
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They seriously need to ban exclusive single family zoning in the city. And do all the reforms you guys are talking about as well.
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  #123  
Old Posted Aug 17, 2022, 3:04 PM
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Originally Posted by Shawn View Post
Seriously . . . who lives in all these Miami towers which no one who actually lives and works in Miami can afford?

It'd be a real bummer if a majority of these units are empty most of the time due to absentee ownership.
I don't understand this either. Traditionally, it was a heavy dose of rich Latin Americans and New Yorkas. But Latin America has been in an economic slump, and basically every rich person in the Northeastern U.S. who wants a place in FL already has one. So what is fueling all this high-end construction?

The South Florida job market is still pretty weak. And the long-term prospects for coastal RE are basically the worst on the planet, given the porous limestone/groundwater issues.
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  #124  
Old Posted Aug 17, 2022, 3:24 PM
iheartthed iheartthed is offline
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Originally Posted by Crawford View Post
I don't understand this either. Traditionally, it was a heavy dose of rich Latin Americans and New Yorkas. But Latin America has been in an economic slump, and basically every rich person in the Northeastern U.S. who wants a place in FL already has one. So what is fueling all this high-end construction?
Supposedly the influx from the west coast.
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  #125  
Old Posted Aug 17, 2022, 3:26 PM
iheartthed iheartthed is offline
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Originally Posted by mrnyc View Post
can confirm. the tax abatement in our condo building will disappear in a few years and unless something is done to reform taxes we are in for a tax sticker shocker.
But with tax abatement, I think most condo owners do have much lower tax rates than owners of other housing types in NYC.
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  #126  
Old Posted Aug 17, 2022, 3:29 PM
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Originally Posted by iheartthed View Post
But with tax abatement, I think most condo owners do have much lower tax rates than owners of other housing types in NYC.
yes for now for us and as long as that lasts for other condo buildings. however, over time that expires.
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  #127  
Old Posted Aug 17, 2022, 8:00 PM
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For the first six months of 2022, here's a list of unit counts permitted in U.S. MSAs, for 5+ unit buildings. Certainly not a proxy for highrise residential, but probably shows the MSAs where highrise residential is most likely:

NY - 26,180
Dallas - 14,914
Austin - 13,540
Houston - 11,564
Seattle - 10,021
LA - 9,091
Minneapolis - 8,799
Washington - 8,054
Atlanta - 7,318
Phoenix - 7,134
Miami - 7,027
Denver - 6,747
Orlando - 6,587
San Antonio - 5,824
Jacksonville - 5,480
Boston - 5,431
Charlotte - 4,885
Tampa - 3,852
Raleigh - 3,480
Salt Lake - 3,409
San Diego - 3,279
Chicago - 3,086
Colorado Springs - 3,042
San Francisco - 2,899

Conclusion - The Sunbelt still rules. The only traditional cities with decent multifamily housing construction for 2022 are NY, Seattle, DC and Minneapolis (and Seattle, DC and Minneapolis aren't really old-school metros). Maybe Boston too, which is definitely old-school. Of course a six-month timespan is hardly definitive. And this is more prospective (what's to come) than detailing what's currently rising.

Philly was a notable absence, and they only have around 2,300 units permitted, but they had a fantastic 2021 permit count. If you include most recent years, Philly does well.
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  #128  
Old Posted Aug 17, 2022, 8:07 PM
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Originally Posted by iheartthed View Post
Supposedly the influx from the west coast.
People “escaping” coastal California or Seattle are ending up in significant numbers in Miami nowadays? That would be a new (and also intriguing) phenomenon.
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  #129  
Old Posted Aug 17, 2022, 8:21 PM
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Originally Posted by lio45 View Post
People “escaping” coastal California or Seattle are ending up in significant numbers in Miami nowadays? That would be a new (and also intriguing) phenomenon.
I don't know about "significant numbers" but yes there was quite a lot of "move to Miami" chatter amongst the Bay Area tech elite. I think it's starting to cool off, but the hype was very loud in 2021.
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  #130  
Old Posted Aug 17, 2022, 9:03 PM
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I don't know about "significant numbers" but yes there was quite a lot of "move to Miami" chatter amongst the Bay Area tech elite. I think it's starting to cool off, but the hype was very loud in 2021.
Oh yes, led by that insufferable tool Keith Rabois. There was a while where I couldn't log onto twitter without seeing the tech bros lauding the virtues of Miami while shitting on San Francisco. It does seem to have died off a bit. Miami in the summertime isn't much of a flex, and I bet some of these guys are regretting their moves as the 5th month of 90+ degree weather and extreme humidity fast approaches. Not to mention hurricane season hasn't even started yet. I have nothing against Miami, but I do wish nothing but the worst for Keith and his little legion of tech ghouls who seemed to delight in throwing stones at SF
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  #131  
Old Posted Aug 17, 2022, 9:09 PM
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Originally Posted by Crawford View Post
I don't understand this either. Traditionally, it was a heavy dose of rich Latin Americans and New Yorkas. But Latin America has been in an economic slump, and basically every rich person in the Northeastern U.S. who wants a place in FL already has one. So what is fueling all this high-end construction?

The South Florida job market is still pretty weak. And the long-term prospects for coastal RE are basically the worst on the planet, given the porous limestone/groundwater issues.
Talking about Brazil, the economic malaise had no effect on people who can buy real estate abroad. In fact, such purchases are in all-time high.
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  #132  
Old Posted Aug 17, 2022, 10:15 PM
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Sam Francisco’s numbers are pathetic
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  #133  
Old Posted Aug 18, 2022, 9:34 AM
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Originally Posted by Shawn View Post
Seriously . . . who lives in all these Miami towers which no one who actually lives and works in Miami can afford?

It'd be a real bummer if a majority of these units are empty most of the time due to absentee ownership.
I see the hate for Miami on SSP never fails.
I'm sure if Miami was located in Canada instead some of you would be drooling all over yourselves.
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  #134  
Old Posted Aug 18, 2022, 9:39 AM
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Originally Posted by bobdreamz View Post
I see the hate for Miami on SSP never fails.
I'm sure if Miami was located in Canada instead some of you would be drooling all over yourselves.
To be fair though, none of the major cities in Canada are on the verge of being uninhabitable from climate change in fifty years or less.
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  #135  
Old Posted Aug 18, 2022, 10:22 AM
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I see the hate for Miami on SSP never fails.
I'm sure if Miami was located in Canada instead some of you would be drooling all over yourselves.
Also Vancouver suffers from the same issues of empty towers and foreign owners
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  #136  
Old Posted Aug 18, 2022, 10:24 AM
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Also Vancouver suffers from the same issues of empty towers and foreign owners

as Vancouver's vacant and foreign ownership taxes have shown, both of those are myths not based on reality at all
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  #137  
Old Posted Aug 18, 2022, 12:05 PM
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Originally Posted by bobdreamz View Post
I see the hate for Miami on SSP never fails.
I'm sure if Miami was located in Canada instead some of you would be drooling all over yourselves.
Come on, man. I've been here since 1999. I stopped giving any shits about SSP city love/hate maybe a decade ago. The only place I hate on is Singapore, and that's mostly a joke. Who do you think I am, Denver Matt?

I'm genuinely curious who lives in these places. Looking at the list of 50+ floor towers u/c I was replying to, it practically begs to be asked. I know who the absentee owners are in Vancouver, that's not a mystery.

Is it inappropriate to wonder who is buying vast quantities of luxury units in a city / metro without the high-earning white collar base to support such numbers?
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  #138  
Old Posted Aug 18, 2022, 1:13 PM
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Also Vancouver suffers from the same issues of empty towers and foreign owners
Vancouver towers don't sit vacant, they're just not owned by the people who occupy them.
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  #139  
Old Posted Aug 18, 2022, 2:16 PM
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To be fair though, none of the major cities in Canada are on the verge of being uninhabitable from climate change in fifty years or less.
Why is climate change only localized to Miami?
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  #140  
Old Posted Aug 18, 2022, 3:14 PM
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Why is climate change only localized to Miami?
Bc Miami is the only population center on earth with the Biscayne Aquifier.

It isn't climate change, per se, that's the issue, it's the aquifier, which can't be fixed. There are potential fixes for sea level rise, of course, but that's no different from anywhere else at sea level.
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