Transition areas between metros

[Steely Dan]

Originally Posted by Steely Dan

Midwest county density map (2020):




i would hazard a guess that well over half of the midwest's people live inside the red oval on the map above.

8 of the region's 11 1M+ MSAs are contained within it.

getting curious about the percentage in the red oval, i looked at just the main CSAs/MSAs within it and compared that to the total midwest population.

- main CSAs/MSAs* inside the red oval: 34,943,282

- total midwest popualtion: 68,995,685


so that's already over 50%; throw in all of the smaller towns and famers inside the red oval and it is indeed well over 50% of the total midwest population living there.

we don't often think of the midwest as being a heavily concetrated region, like say the northeast with bos-wash, but the cleveland over to chicago (300 miles) and cincy up to grand rapids (250 miles) part of it really does represent the bulk of it, it's just more "webby", and not as "corridor-ish".




(*)
Chicago CSA
Detroit CSA
Cleveland CSA
Columbus CSA
Indy CSA
Cincy CSA
Milwaukee CSA
Grand Rapids CSA
Dayton CSA
Toledo CSA
South Bend CSA
Youngstown CSA
Fort Wayne CSA
Lansing MSA
Kalamzoo CSA

[iheartthed]

Originally Posted by Steely Dan

getting curious about the percentage in the red oval, i looked at just the main CSAs/MSAs within it and compared that to the total midwest population.

- main CSAs/MSAs* inside the red oval: 34,943,282

- total midwest popualtion: 68,995,685


so that's already over 50%; throw in all of the smaller towns and famers inside the red oval and it is indeed well over 50% of the total midwest population living there.

we don't often think of the midwest as being a heavily concetrated region, like say the northeast with bos-wash, but the cleveland over to chicago and cincy up to grand rapids part of it really does represent the bulk of it, it's just more "webby", and not as "corridor-ish".




(*)
Chicago CSA
Detroit CSA
Cleveland CSA
Columbus CSA
Indy CSA
Cincy CSA
Milwaukee CSA
Grand Rapids CSA
Dayton CSA
Toledo CSA
South Bend CSA
Youngstown CSA
Fort Wayne CSA
Lansing MSA
Kalamzoo CSA

Yes, the eastern Midwest is one of the most densely populated regions in the United States. It's really only second to the Northeast Corridor.

[BnaBreaker]

Originally Posted by Steely Dan

getting curious about the percentage in the red oval, i looked at just the main CSAs/MSAs within it and compared that to the total midwest population.

- main CSAs/MSAs* inside the red oval: 34,943,282

- total midwest popualtion: 68,995,685


so that's already over 50%; throw in all of the smaller towns and famers inside the red oval and it is indeed well over 50% of the total midwest population living there.

we don't often think of the midwest as being a heavily concetrated region, like say the northeast with bos-wash, but the cleveland over to chicago (300 miles) and cincy up to grand rapids (250 miles) part of it really does represent the bulk of it, it's just more "webby", and not as "corridor-ish".




(*)
Chicago CSA
Detroit CSA
Cleveland CSA
Columbus CSA
Indy CSA
Cincy CSA
Milwaukee CSA
Grand Rapids CSA
Dayton CSA
Toledo CSA
South Bend CSA
Youngstown CSA
Fort Wayne CSA
Lansing MSA
Kalamzoo CSA

And realistically you could extend that bubble another 75 miles and include Pittsburgh, Louisville, Madison in there too.

[Steely Dan]

Originally Posted by BnaBreaker

And realistically you could extend that bubble another 75 miles and include Pittsburgh, Louisville, Madison in there too.

well yeah, but i was trying to compare it to "the midwest", and pittsburgers can get pretty damn ornery when you start associating their fine appalachian city with that particular term.

but expanding the oval just a smidge to catch madison and the relatively densley populated fox river valley of wisconsin makes sense.

something more like this:

[edale]

Originally Posted by BnaBreaker

And realistically you could extend that bubble another 75 miles and include Pittsburgh, Louisville, Madison in there too.

I don't think most people would consider Louisville and Pittsburgh to be in the Midwest, though. I'd say both are part of the broader Midwest region, but many would say Louisville is in the South, and Pittsburgh is in...Appalachia? We need another name for Western PA (and NY), as they aren't East Coast, but they aren't Midwest, either. Of course, to a Californian, it's all 'back east'

[iheartthed]

Originally Posted by edale

I don't think most people would consider Louisville and Pittsburgh to be in the Midwest, though. I'd say both are part of the broader Midwest region, but many would say Louisville is in the South, and Pittsburgh is in...Appalachia? We need another name for Western PA (and NY), as they aren't East Coast, but they aren't Midwest, either. Of course, to a Californian, it's all 'back east'

Let's call it the Hairsplitter region.

[Obadno]

The 150 miles Between Phoenix and Tucson metros.

The towns of Casa Grande, Coolidge, Florence, Maricopa, Eloy. For 40 years people have been predicting it to be developed and Phx-Tucson will be one single metro but we aren't really any closer to that today than we were 40 years ago.

Almost the whole stretch looks like this:




Its mostly farms, some Disrtro centers, an airplane graveyard, failed megaprojects and recently some big time manufacturing gains, Lucid, Nikola, Kholor, P&G all have or are building major factories in this area which is likely to draw a lot of new population who will be able to afford the suburban dream on manufacturing salaries so maybe we will see the cities finally connect into the long predicted "Sun Corridor"

[eschaton]

Originally Posted by Obadno

The 150 miles Between Phoenix and Tucson metros.

The towns of Casa Grande, Coolidge, Florence, Maricopa, Eloy. For 40 years people have been predicting it to be developed and Phx-Tucson will be one single metro but we aren't really any closer to that today than we were 40 years ago.

The Gila Reservation is kinda in the way, isn't it?

Seems pretty clear to me that's forming the brake in development, since Metro Phoenix continued to sprawl to the Southeast into Pinal where there wasn't a reservation hemming it in.

[dave8721]

Originally Posted by sopas ej

Sure! Here you go.

Dallas/Ft. Worth. It sprawls differently from LA; to me it looks like a centralized blob that gradually thins out towards the edges. When you look at LA, you can see that most of the development is in the basin and valleys, with hills and mountains being sparse, as well as a lot of the desert areas.


OKC/Tulsa. I assume they're very rural in between? I've never been to Oklahoma.

Tampa/Orlando would be a relatively continuous blob as well which thins out in the Lakeland area between.

[Obadno]

Originally Posted by eschaton

The Gila Reservation is kinda in the way, isn't it?

Seems pretty clear to me that's forming the brake in development, since Metro Phoenix continued to sprawl to the Southeast into Pinal where there wasn't a reservation hemming it in.

The Gila reservation isnt very big



its already nearly surrounded by development plus they have their own large scale agriculture and they tend to build offices, warehouses etc along the highway that they lease. It wont be solid but its like a 20 mile gap