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  #6341  
Old Posted Jun 10, 2023, 3:19 AM
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I guess capacity-wise, 4-car automated trains every 90 seconds would be better — 27,200 per hour. Plus, the construction method Bechtel is proposing allows for easy platform extensions.

If they were to go with the existing technology with maximum 4-minute headways, you'd have closer to 25,000 per hour. The current Breda A650s have a capacity of 1,080 per 6-car consists, which is low because of the seating configuration. For context, NYC's B Division cars that are just as wide but are 60 feet long have a capacity of 240. That means LA's would be 265-275 — 1,590-1,650 per consist, for a capacity of 23,850-24,750 passengers per hour.

If only they could combine A4 and A6.
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  #6342  
Old Posted Jun 10, 2023, 4:11 AM
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Good news: We don’t have to worry about phase 2 for a while.

Bad news: We don’t have to worry about phase 2 for a while.
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  #6343  
Old Posted Jun 10, 2023, 5:06 AM
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Bectel's proposal probably calls for the same linear induction technology as Vancouver's SkyTrain. But according to Wikipedia, "Bombardier now markets the Innovia Metro alongside the larger Movia Metro and has touted its system versatility."

It would be great if the technology and specs could be compatible with our existing HRT lines. Based on what we know so far, Bechtel is looking at 72-foot-long trains... not far off from the 75-foot Breda A650s. I know they are proposing a narrower-profile rolling stock because of the single-bore, but you're literally only talking an extra 16 inches for each train. That extra width actually significantly increases train capacity, and would reduce the need for any platform expansions down the line, as maximum capacity could possibly exceed 40,000 passengers per hour.

Or, if they increased the passenger capacity per car from the proposed 170 to 175 and added a fifth car, the capacity per hour (35,000) would be similar to a 10-car NYC Subway train operating at 4-minute headways (36,000).
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  #6344  
Old Posted Jun 10, 2023, 8:19 PM
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Just a week away!

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  #6345  
Old Posted Jun 11, 2023, 2:59 PM
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Good news: We don’t have to worry about phase 2 for a while.

Bad news: We don’t have to worry about phase 2 for a while.
It is so disgusting the second phase of the Sepulveda line isn’t scheduled to be done until 2055. Hell by then the Rams and Chargers might need new stadiums.

This line should be the top priority for Metro and no expense should be spared for this line - even if it takes money from other projects. It should start at a Van Nuys station and end at an underground superstation between Intuit and SoFi. I’d even recommend an express track but now I’m really pushing it
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  #6346  
Old Posted Jun 13, 2023, 5:50 PM
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Three more days til the regional connector finally opens!

Metro even put out its new Metro Rail Map, effective noon, 6/16/23! We'll officially have the longest light rail line in the world!

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  #6347  
Old Posted Jun 13, 2023, 6:17 PM
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The regional connector is going to be a huge improvement for the system, but I'm still very disappointed in the scheduled travel times. Metro spent years and $350M on the "New Blue" to improve reliability and decrease travel times. They said they would shave 10 minutes off the then 58 minute trip from Downtown Long Beach to 7th/Metro, but the new schedule shows a 57 minute trip. How did it go from the promised 10 minutes in time savings to just 1 minute? Also the A line doesn't seem to be that reliable despite all the money spent. I don't ride the line but read about reliability issues - someone correct me if that's changed.

Also, the E line signal priority work that the board asked for has not had much effect. Sure, they've shaved a couple minutes off over the years and are now down to a 46 minute DTSM to 7th/Metro time, but the train still sits at tons of red lights. If LADOT were to give full signal preemption everywhere except the couple most pedestrian-heavy intersections, I bet they could get that time to 40 minutes, which would be truly car-competitive.
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  #6348  
Old Posted Jun 13, 2023, 8:21 PM
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Who's going to the opening day?? I certainly am...
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  #6349  
Old Posted Jun 13, 2023, 8:28 PM
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Who's going to the opening day?? I certainly am...
We have to work on opening day, but maybe in the evening, my partner and I might be checking it out, hopping on at the South Pasadena station. Being that the Metro system will be free all weekend, I'm hoping it won't create a mess of crowds. If not, we'll just ride it after they start fare service.
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  #6350  
Old Posted Jun 13, 2023, 8:35 PM
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Originally Posted by SoCalKid View Post
The regional connector is going to be a huge improvement for the system, but I'm still very disappointed in the scheduled travel times. Metro spent years and $350M on the "New Blue" to improve reliability and decrease travel times. They said they would shave 10 minutes off the then 58 minute trip from Downtown Long Beach to 7th/Metro, but the new schedule shows a 57 minute trip. How did it go from the promised 10 minutes in time savings to just 1 minute? Also the A line doesn't seem to be that reliable despite all the money spent. I don't ride the line but read about reliability issues - someone correct me if that's changed.

Also, the E line signal priority work that the board asked for has not had much effect. Sure, they've shaved a couple minutes off over the years and are now down to a 46 minute DTSM to 7th/Metro time, but the train still sits at tons of red lights. If LADOT were to give full signal preemption everywhere except the couple most pedestrian-heavy intersections, I bet they could get that time to 40 minutes, which would be truly car-competitive.
Some help may be on the way.

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Metro refines its 2028 Olympics wish list
Bus-only lanes, first/last mile plans, mobility hubs, and a temporary fix for that pesky Washington/Flower intersection
JUNE 13, 2023, 10:30AMSTEVEN SHARP

Last year, Metro staff set out a list of 209 projects which could prove advantageous when the Olympic games return to Los Angeles in Summer 2028. With that once far-off deadline growing closer each day, transportation officials are have whittled that wish list down to a more manageable number, seeking Federal funding for 15 projects and programs which would help manage the influx of tourists associated with the games.

...

Metro is also expected to use the games as an opportunity to address some of the sluggish street running operations on the A and E Lines, particularly as the new Regional Connector subway begins serving passengers. Most notably, traffic signal improvements have been considered to address the troubling Washington Wye, where the A and E Lines now meet at the intersection of Washington Boulevard and Flower Street in Downtown. A permanent fix involving grade separation for the junction has also been proposed, but could not likely be completed prior to the games.
https://la.urbanize.city/post/metro-...pics-wish-list
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  #6351  
Old Posted Jun 13, 2023, 10:42 PM
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More on that Urbanize article:

Metro refines its 2028 Olympics wish list

Bus-only lanes, first/last mile plans, mobility hubs, and a temporary fix for that pesky Washington/Flower intersection

Steven Sharp
Urbanize Los Angeles
June 13, 2023

Last year, Metro staff set out a list of 209 projects which could prove advantageous when the Olympic games return to Los Angeles in Summer 2028. With that once far-off deadline growing closer each day, transportation officials are have whittled that wish list down to a more manageable number, seeking Federal funding for 15 projects and programs which would help manage the influx of tourists associated with the games.

In a pending report to the Metro Board's 2028 Olympics Committee (h/t @numble), staff members provide details regarding the project list for the 2028 Mobility Concept Plan, which was submitted to the U.S. Department of Transportation for consideration in December 2022. It includes:



To move Angelenos and a temporary influx of visitors during the course of the games, Metro is looking to potentially double its bus fleet to meet demand (the supplemental bus system). The agency has reached out to other transit agencies across the country in the hopes of borrowing vehicles - with the bulk of responses coming from within California. According to the staff report, up to 850 buses and 450 staff may be temporarily made available to Metro for use during the games.

Those extra buses would have greater ease of movement throughout the region through the implementation of a Games Routes Network, which would link event venues with the Athletes Village and Media Village. Metro expects to make uses of existing and planned ExpressLanes and bus-only corridors, largely based on the agency's NextGen Tier 1 network, the BRT Vision and Principles Study, and routes which serve venues. Some bus-only lanes along arterial roads could be retained after the games conclude, serving as a physical legacy to the 2028 Olympics.

An enhanced bus network would be complemented by a series of temporary and permanent mobility hubs, including those located at event venues and Metro rail and bus rapid transit stations, as well as smaller neighborhood hubs with micro-mobility options. Those micro-mobility options would tie into proposed first/last mile connections to the venues, which will allow visitors to walk or bike to the games from transit hubs.

Some of the key hubs near major event venues - including 7th Street/Metro Center Station, Pico Station, and Union Station - are also expected to receiving permanent and temporary enhancements to handle crowds. That could include temporary platforms and overcrossings, portable ramps, or more robust wayfinding and signs. Several of those elements echo a decade-old plan from AEG for augmenting the at-grade Pico Station to handle crowds anticipated in the never-built Farmers Field project.

Metro is also expected to use the games as an opportunity to address some of the sluggish street running operations on the A and E Lines, particularly as the new Regional Connector subway begins serving passengers. Most notably, traffic signal improvements have been considered to address the troubling Washington Wye, where the A and E Lines now meet at the intersection of Washington Boulevard and Flower Street in Downtown. A permanent fix involving grade separation for the junction has also been proposed, but could not likely be completed prior to the games.

Not to be forgotten, though not addressed at length in the staff report, include Inglewood's planned automated people mover system, which would connect the K Line to events at Sofi Stadium, and the initial phase of Metrolink's SCORE program, which would allow for faster and more frequent service on the 500-mile regional rail network.

Moving forward, Metro expects the 15 projects highlighted in the mobility concept plan to move forward under the following schedules:

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  #6352  
Old Posted Jun 13, 2023, 11:49 PM
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Definitely an exciting project! Reece is a little too harsh perhaps but there's some interesting points.



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  #6353  
Old Posted Jun 14, 2023, 3:16 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SoCalKid View Post
The regional connector is going to be a huge improvement for the system, but I'm still very disappointed in the scheduled travel times. Metro spent years and $350M on the "New Blue" to improve reliability and decrease travel times. They said they would shave 10 minutes off the then 58 minute trip from Downtown Long Beach to 7th/Metro, but the new schedule shows a 57 minute trip. How did it go from the promised 10 minutes in time savings to just 1 minute? Also the A line doesn't seem to be that reliable despite all the money spent. I don't ride the line but read about reliability issues - someone correct me if that's changed.

Also, the E line signal priority work that the board asked for has not had much effect. Sure, they've shaved a couple minutes off over the years and are now down to a 46 minute DTSM to 7th/Metro time, but the train still sits at tons of red lights. If LADOT were to give full signal preemption everywhere except the couple most pedestrian-heavy intersections, I bet they could get that time to 40 minutes, which would be truly car-competitive.
The southern section of the A Line (formerly Blue Line) is terrible and needs to be rebuilt. The ROW is wide enough along some stretches to accommodate 4-6 tracks too.

To repeat what jmecklenborg said, I'm sick and tired of all these LRT lines that don't have the capacity (literally and figuratively) to fundamentally change how Angelenos travel.
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  #6354  
Old Posted Jun 14, 2023, 3:46 AM
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Originally Posted by Nouvellecosse View Post
Definitely an exciting project! Reece is a little too harsh perhaps but there's some interesting points.

What's really frustrating is that the 3-car trains aren't going to have the capacity to deal with big events like The Olympics. In the future, when Metrolink is electrified as part of high speed rail, the 3-car trains at the Union Station stop will often have to turn away riders.

In fact, it's conceivable that people getting off a Metrolink or HSR train who want to ride the current Expo Line or Blue Line to Long Beach might take the heavy rail subway to 7th St./Metro Center, then switch there to light rail.

I'd like to know if rebuilding the Flower St. junction underground with a flying crossover will help the network's performance or if both crossovers need to be grade separated to enjoy any sort of improvement.

It's also possible that the at-grade track on Flower St. between the junction and the current tunnel portal could be rebuilt underground as a four-track line, and that a second light rail tunnel could be built across downtown.
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  #6355  
Old Posted Jun 14, 2023, 6:25 AM
hughfb3 hughfb3 is offline
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Originally Posted by sopas ej View Post
We have to work on opening day, but maybe in the evening, my partner and I might be checking it out, hopping on at the South Pasadena station. Being that the Metro system will be free all weekend, I'm hoping it won't create a mess of crowds. If not, we'll just ride it after they start fare service.
Well, these are exciting times. I’m down to meet people from the forum this weekend. Maybe a grand central market meet up on opening day in the evening like 7p? I can create a thread through Instagram if anyone is down. My handle is @superhugh3. Message me if interested.




Also, upcoming action opportunities…
West Santa Ana Branch Transit Corridor Project

Final reminder: Join us for virtual and in-person community update meetings.
Metro’s plan for better transit includes a new light rail transit line connecting southeast LA County to downtown Los Angeles. Join us for virtual and in-person community update meetings that will feature updates on the Slauson/A Line (Blue) to Pioneer Station Locally Preferred Alternative (LPA) that advanced for further analysis as part of the Final Environmental Impact Statement/Environmental Impact Report.

Meeting Details

All meetings will offer the same information; please attend the meeting that best suits your schedule. Spanish interpreters will be present at each meeting.

In-person meetings will offer free ice cream and fun kids activities!
PARAMOUNT
Monday, June 5, 2023
6-8pm
Progress Park
15500 Downey Av, Paramount, CA 90723

BELL
Monday, June 12, 2023
6-8pm
Bell Community Center
6250 Pine Av, Bell, CA 90201
TOMORROW: VIRTUAL SESSION
Wednesday, June 14, 2023
6-7pm
Zoom Link: tinyurl.com/wsab3
Webinar ID: 898 8735 7114
Call-in Number: 669.444.9171

ARTESIA
Thursday, June 15, 2023
6-8pm
Albert O. Little Community Center
18750 Clarkdale Av, Artesia, CA 90701

Last edited by hughfb3; Jun 14, 2023 at 7:12 AM.
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  #6356  
Old Posted Jun 14, 2023, 9:27 PM
SoCalKid SoCalKid is offline
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Originally Posted by Quixote View Post
The southern section of the A Line (formerly Blue Line) is terrible and needs to be rebuilt. The ROW is wide enough along some stretches to accommodate 4-6 tracks too.

To repeat what jmecklenborg said, I'm sick and tired of all these LRT lines that don't have the capacity (literally and figuratively) to fundamentally change how Angelenos travel.

That's what I don't understand - didn't the New Blue project effectively completely rebuild the tracks and catenary? Why didn't it achieve the intended results?
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  #6357  
Old Posted Jun 15, 2023, 2:05 AM
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^ I don't know what the project entailed. Unless they grade-separate the street-running portions in LB, there's no reason to believe they can cut 15 minutes off the end-to-end travel times.

Another thing... It's one thing to make capital improvements, but what often gets lost or not discussed as much is maintaining good service. Crime, homelessness, dirty trains, delays, lackluster frequency are effective ways to lose and not attract riders. I don't think Metro understands this, and that's a huge problem moving forward. You can't reduce headways to 20-minutes starting at 8 p.m. and then act completely puzzled as to why ridership isn't increasing.
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  #6358  
Old Posted Jun 15, 2023, 6:27 AM
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If the MTA & city officials don't get a handle on the cleanness & safety of the transit system, when this line goes further west on Wilshire Blvd, hundreds of millions of $$ are at stake & may go down the drain...

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btw, fare jumping is so bad up north in SF...& apparently involves all types of ppl (from teens to seniors)....that the SF muni system is thinking of making up the difference by increasing transit prices & ticketing more & more cars parked after time limits are reduced in various parts of the city....as though SF isn't already reeling from ppl & businesses abandoning it. If it can happen there, it sure as hell can happen here.
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  #6359  
Old Posted Jun 15, 2023, 8:17 PM
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I know it's been playing catch-up but LA has a pretty impressive rail map now, which will be even more impressive by the time the Olympics arrive in '28.
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  #6360  
Old Posted Jun 15, 2023, 11:31 PM
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I know it's been playing catch-up but LA has a pretty impressive rail map now, which will be even more impressive by the time the Olympics arrive in '28.
I agree. The build-out is quite ambitious, and while the post-pandemic ridership levels are obviously disappointing, I think the city will eventually take to the rails in greater numbers. Future Angelenos will grow up knowing that they have access to a fairly robust rail and bus network, and I think they will take advantage of that more than we do today.
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