GO Transit

[DHLawrence]

Assuming they make it a park-and-ride. It would be stupid to have the only Cambridge stop *not* be a park-and-ride, but stupider things have happened.

[plam]

Originally Posted by mpd618

There's a hell of a lot of students who live in Mississauga, and there are many commuters in both directions between that area and Waterloo Region. So I think GO is going to be pretty successful with this. Access to downtown Toronto via a GO train connection is just icing on the cake.

They can't all take the UW FedBus either. Indeed I'd even like to go to Mississauga from time to time, and basically I have to drive now. (Or bike, but that's a bit of a more serious endeavour).

[mpd618]

Originally Posted by DHLawrence

Assuming they make it a park-and-ride. It would be stupid to have the only Cambridge stop *not* be a park-and-ride, but stupider things have happened.

I was thinking that maybe park-and-ride isn't a given, but then I took a look at the surroundings (tons of parking lots) and realized it'd be silly to pretend it's not a park-and-ride.

So, to recap the GO bus service: we're getting moderate all-day service to Mississauga Square One (Route 25), from which there are:

• Weekday peak buses every 10-20 minutes to Yorkdale, Sheppard, and Finch.
• Weekday 15-20 minute service (and some Sunday service) to Bramalea and York University.
• Buses every half-hour to Pearson Airport, with half of those continuing to Richmond Hill. This is all-day every day save 1am to 4am.
• Buses every half-hour (every hour Sundays) to Union Station. This is all-day service except weekday peak.

During that weekday peak there are two buses (Route 25A) that connect with the GO train at Milton instead.

The interesting thing in all this is the relatively small number of "commuter" trips. The current schedule gives a pretty even distribution of buses throughout the day, which is good for intercity transit use. I'm willing to bet, though, that GO will have to quickly add service during the peak commute hours in both directions to keep up with demand.

[dunkalunk]

I have a friend who lives in Mimico, so this GO bus will save me probably 45 minutes in backtracking from Toronto Union.

[yyzman]

This is a pretty good schedule for a start up, i think when they started U of Guelph trips nearly 3yrs ago, they were only a few and now look at that schedule, hourly and something half hour.
I am sure over the next 2-8 months you will see an increase in service, additional buses, possibly new stops or routes.
Take into consideration, GO just expanded to Peterborough and Niagra 6 weeks ago, so remember drivers and equipemnt don't grow on trees.

There is supposed to be 4 new park and ride stops on this route, one being Hwy 25/401, the other being Hwy 24/401, so possibly down the road they may service Townline rd in Cambridge? who knows.

mpd618, well pointed out on the connections at SQ1.
you can add to that Union St, the Waterloo service arrives at 10 after the hour and the Union St bus leaves on the 20 /25 after the hour.

What i would like GO to do and maybe get others to suggest this to them is have the service run out to the Airport (YYZ).
As it is now, the bus arrives at SQ1 at the time the airport bus leaves.
I truly feel a service from Waterloo to Toronto Airport would be huge for year round traffic, teh students only fill buses for several months of the year and i know that there are a lot of commutrer to the airport form this region, this is easily noticed by all the airport parking tags hanging in car windows.

[taylortbb]

I really wish the bus to Union from SQ1 made a stop at say Kipling or Islington subway stations though. Right now I go to Toronto by VIA (yes it's inconvenient, but it's so much nicer than Greyhound) and backtrack significantly because VIA doesn't stop at the Bloor GO station, which is only a couple stops from my parent's house. It takes me 2 GRT rides + 1 train + 1 subway (subway-subway transfers don't increase count, they're sufficiently convenient).

With the new GO bus service, I'd have to take the bus to SQ1, then transfer to a bus to Union, then backtrack on the subway. It means I'd be doing 1 GRT ride + 2 GO Bus + 1 subway. Alternatively, I could take Mississauga transit and do 1 GRT ride + 1 GO bus + 1 Mississauga Transit + 1 subway.

Considering the fact that cost is sufficiently similar (generally buy VIA tickets on sale), I'm not really seeing why I'd take the GO bus. If I have to do that much backtracking, then GO is probably going to be slower than VIA. VIA is only 10 minutes slower than Greyhound, and the Greyhound has far fewer stops and no transfer compared to GO.

If GO offered a faster connection such as what I suggested above, the travel time savings would probably be significant. The backtracking adds about 40-45 minutes to my trip.

But as I've noticed with GO, they don't realize the ridership potential in targeting more than commuters to downtown Toronto. Considering that overall the number of commuters to downtown Toronto from Waterloo Region is small, I'm not sure how big a market that will be for GO here. I do believe the service will be very successful, just not with commuters. Waterloo Region only sends 10,000 commuters to the entire GTA, half at best work in downtown Toronto. Most seem to commute to Mississauga, downtown Toronto is just too far.

GO Trains however, I can't wait. I'm certain they'll be far more successful. As rapid transit expands into Toronto's suburbs the Georgetown line will have a very good selection of connections to cover the different places people work. Not that I want to encourage commuting to the GTA, we're not a bedroom community and I don't want us to become one. I moved to Waterloo from what suburbanites call downtown Toronto, if Waterloo becomes a suburb I might as well move back.

[yyzman]

The full schedule is now on the GO Transit website
http://www.gotransit.com/publicroot/...station=&new=Y

[gghtransit]

Originally Posted by taylortbb

I really wish the bus to Union from SQ1 made a stop at say Kipling or Islington subway stations though. Right now I go to Toronto by VIA (yes it's inconvenient, but it's so much nicer than Greyhound) and backtrack significantly because VIA doesn't stop at the Bloor GO station, which is only a couple stops from my parent's house. It takes me 2 GRT rides + 1 train + 1 subway (subway-subway transfers don't increase count, they're sufficiently convenient).

With the new GO bus service, I'd have to take the bus to SQ1, then transfer to a bus to Union, then backtrack on the subway. It means I'd be doing 1 GRT ride + 2 GO Bus + 1 subway. Alternatively, I could take Mississauga transit and do 1 GRT ride + 1 GO bus + 1 Mississauga Transit + 1 subway.

Considering the fact that cost is sufficiently similar (generally buy VIA tickets on sale), I'm not really seeing why I'd take the GO bus. If I have to do that much backtracking, then GO is probably going to be slower than VIA. VIA is only 10 minutes slower than Greyhound, and the Greyhound has far fewer stops and no transfer compared to GO.

If GO offered a faster connection such as what I suggested above, the travel time savings would probably be significant. The backtracking adds about 40-45 minutes to my trip.

But as I've noticed with GO, they don't realize the ridership potential in targeting more than commuters to downtown Toronto. Considering that overall the number of commuters to downtown Toronto from Waterloo Region is small, I'm not sure how big a market that will be for GO here. I do believe the service will be very successful, just not with commuters. Waterloo Region only sends 10,000 commuters to the entire GTA, half at best work in downtown Toronto. Most seem to commute to Mississauga, downtown Toronto is just too far.

GO Trains however, I can't wait. I'm certain they'll be far more successful. As rapid transit expands into Toronto's suburbs the Georgetown line will have a very good selection of connections to cover the different places people work. Not that I want to encourage commuting to the GTA, we're not a bedroom community and I don't want us to become one. I moved to Waterloo from what suburbanites call downtown Toronto, if Waterloo becomes a suburb I might as well move back.

Another travel option is transfer to a GO Bus to Yorkdale from either Square One or the Milton GO Station (depending on which Route 25 bus you get on) and grab the Subway at Yorkdale.

[taylortbb]

Originally Posted by gghtransit

Another travel option is transfer to a GO Bus to Yorkdale from either Square One or the Milton GO Station (depending on which Route 25 bus you get on) and grab the Subway at Yorkdale.

Thanks, I didn't know I could go to Yorkdale.

Unfortunately it doesn't really solve my problem. Yorkdale to St. George will probably take longer than Union to St. George. At best they're equal.

Really the subway should be extended into Mississauga, like they're doing with York Region. Then GO could have their terminal on the subway, which really is the backbone of public transit in the GTA.

[DHLawrence]

Can you say slanted?

Still questions about GO bus
Ray Martin, Times Staff

Reaction to Thursday’s announcement that GO bus service will be launched in Cambridge Oct. 31 is for the most part positive, but it also raises further questions for some.

“This is very positive news,” said John Fagg, a member of Cambridge’s economic development advisory committee (EDAC) and GO Transit subcommittee. “It’s definitely a step in the right direction, but what’s not said is just as interesting as what’s said in the announcement.”

Although the region’s daily newspaper has reported the Cambridge GO station will be located near the Cambridge big box development at the intersection of Highway 401 and Hespeler Road, GO officials say no announcement on where the Cambridge station has been made.

“We expect that the full schedule and bus stop locations will be posted on GO Transit’s website (today),” said GO media relations and issues specialist Vanessa Thomas, Friday.

“GO Transit is working on determining the location of the remaining three park-and-ride locations along the Highway 401 and Highway 8 corridor in the Cambridge/Kitchener-Waterloo area.”

Fagg said the announcement appears to push the concept of getting Waterloo Region riders to Mississauga’s Square One, rather than to the GO train station in Milton.

“They have 11 buses going to Mississauga Square One and only two buses to the train station in Milton, which may not be what’s needed,” he said.

Fagg said more information is required to clarify how the new service will work, but “it’s still great news for Cambridge”.

“It will make the city a more appealing place,” he said.

EDAC chair Miles Lauzon concurs.

“This is great news, but there are still a lot of questions that need to be answered,” he said. “It will lead to bigger things if people support it.”

Lee Palvetzian, who has pushed to have passenger rail service reinstated in Cambridge for more than 20 years, was “ecstatic” over the announcement.

“This will be a stepping stone to rail service if it gets the support we anticipate,” he said. “If the numbers are there, GO will expedite the introduction of rail service here. I’m very excited.”

Palvetzian said there has been a complete turnaround in thinking by government when it comes to passenger rail service.

“When we first started this thing, they weren’t very interested, but that has changed in the last few years. Government now wants to find ways to take cars off the road and help the environment,” he said.

While it may have taken years for government and GO Transit to recognize the potential of bringing GO service to Cambridge and Waterloo Region, Palvetzian said this area “is definitely on their radar now”.

He said the study prepared for Waterloo Region, which city and regional councils endorsed last week, clinched GO Transit’s decision.

“GO is now planning for service here. It’s no longer a matter of if, but when,” said Palvetzian. “I’d expect we’ll see rail service here within five years.”

Sure, why not send all the buses to Milton GO? The folks on the later buses can sit on the platform and watch the CP freight trains go by all day.

Get a clue!

[waterloowarrior]

They could hook up with some of the other Milton GO trains that arrive in Toronto around 9 am... I guess it depends how things GO for the first couple of month.

[DHLawrence]

It could hook up with all of them (and probably will eventually), but it has to go somewhere in the meantime, and Aldershot (though logical) is a bit out of the way.

[yyzman]

There is a reason only 2 buses.
My theory would be that all the trains leave within a 2 hr window and GO look like they have choosen two trains that in the event of a delay on the Hwy the delay for the next train would be minimal.

Secondly, why put a load of buses on if no one take it??
Lets wait and see and if demand is high i am sure GO would add more.
Once again everyone is hellbent on the train.
Remember folks, the train only runs at Rush hour.
The Bus to Mississuaga meets up with the Union St Bus.

[jcollins]

GO Bus coming to Waterloo

By Greg MacDonald, Chronicle Staff

Oct 14, 2009

GO Bus service is coming to Waterloo at the end of the month.

Starting Oct. 31, the bus will have stops at Wilfrid Laurier University and the University of Waterloo, as well as in Kitchener and Cambridge.

Buses will head to and from the Milton GO Station and Mississauga’s Square One.

Riders will be able to get on the bus at one of the two universities and travel into Union Station in downtown Toronto.

The cost of a one-way ride from Waterloo to Union will be $14.35, while a fare to Milton will be $8.75.

The ride to Milton will take just over an hour, while the trip to Mississauga is estimated at an hour and half.

From either of those stations, passengers can hop onto trains and continue on the GO system.

Regional chair Ken Seiling was pleased with the news, saying it will boost the region’s connections to the GTA.

“It’s great news, especially in Waterloo,” Seiling said. “I think university students, as well other people looking to commute, will be quite happy.”

The move also fits in with two of the region’s long-term goals — rapid transit to get riders around locally and GO Trains to get them in and out of the city.

“We see it all as part of a larger picture,” Seiling said. We want intermodal connections for (LRT) and the buses will start to build the ridership we need for GO Trains.”

Kitchener Centre MPP John Milloy also sees the GO Bus as a positive, but the move doesn’t mean that GO Trains are necessarily coming to the region.

“We’re building up ridership and components, but I always try to manage expectations,” Milloy said. “It’s a step forward but we still have a lot of steps to go.”

GO buses in Waterloo will run weekdays, with limited weekend service.

For more information, visit www.gotransit.com .

[mpd618]

Originally Posted by jcollins

From either of those stations, passengers can hop onto trains and continue on the GO system.

...

Kitchener Centre MPP John Milloy also sees the GO Bus as a positive, but the move doesn’t mean that GO Trains are necessarily coming to the region.

“We’re building up ridership and components, but I always try to manage expectations,” Milloy said. “It’s a step forward but we still have a lot of steps to go.”

I'm sure passengers' expectations of trains at Square One are going to be totally met.

[DHLawrence]

It *is* up the road from Cooksville and Port Credit, it must be acknowledged. Port Credit is the only one with all-day service right now, but I would imagine you can take a bus between them (an MT or GO shuttle bus directly to Port Credit might not hurt). One day they'll be connected by light rail, but I expect all-day Milton line service straight to Cambridge will happen first.

[mpd618]

Originally Posted by DHLawrence

Port Credit is the only one with all-day service right now, but I would imagine you can take a bus between them (an MT or GO shuttle bus directly to Port Credit might not hurt).

I checked earlier, and there are Mississauga Transit buses going down Hurontario Street at a good frequency. But a transfer is a transfer. (Why couldn't that GO bus just go a bit further and make the Port Credit stop itself?)

[yyzman]

From SQ1, the number 19 MT bus runs very frequently up and down Hwy 10.
There is a reason why they don't meet up with a train at Port Credit, my thinking is that it maybe seen as direct unfair competition to Greyhound, that could be a possible reason, or another reason could be to do with total journey time and distance
GO Drivers don't complete log books like Greyhound, so i guess distance of each trip and time of each trip has to be kept under a certain limit as GO's operating proceedure is different than that of Greyhound.....
Just my theory btw! I could be wrong.

My concern with all this is the total time and all the stops.
A couple of years ago we all thought the trips would start in Cambridge, stopping alond a couple a major streets, then Kitchener and Waterloo kind of pushed there way to the front and now Cambridge gets the one stop and for those coming from KW it's going to be close to a 2hr ride with traffic.

I think most GTA commuters live in the Cambridge area or Doon in Kitchener, which the bus goes no where near.
Really all we are getting is a University to University link up, the commuters really have been given a bad ride here.
Students come first at GO right now, even though they only fill up buses for less than a total of 6 months a year.

My 2cents

Originally Posted by yyzman

I think most GTA commuters live in the Cambridge area or Doon in Kitchener, which the bus goes no where near.
Really all we are getting is a University to University link up, the commuters really have been given a bad ride here.
Students come first at GO right now, even though they only fill up buses for less than a total of 6 months a year.

My 2cents

If I recall, about half lived in Cambridge...so they're disproportionately in the south end of the region, but there's still a fair number in the upper part of Kitchener and Waterloo (and really, how much further is it in the big scheme of things?...when you're going that far to begin with).

No worries though, they have a park and ride station at Bridgecam Power Centre if you look at the schedule. And there's more than enough parking there to accomodate everyone. That's right at Hespeler Road and the 401, pretty central to where the highest concentrations of commuters are.

[taylortbb]

I was reading Regional staff report P-09-078 which comments on various transportation upgrades throughout southern Ontario when I noticed this on page 4:

Rail-based alternatives are
particularly important, and are achievable in light of the recently-approved expansion of GO Rail on
the Georgetown line and the findings of the Cambridge to GTA GO Transit Rail Passenger
Feasibility Study, which was presented in Report P-09-077 (October 6, 2009).

I'm not certain if it's referring to GO trains to KW, but I don't think the other Georgetown expansions qualify as "recently-approved". Certainly big news if GO trains have been approved, though it would have been exceptionally fast.

At the very least the document does have:

Regional staff
recently participated in a Municipal Advisory Group meeting discussing alternatives to construction
of a new highway corridor.

Which suggests the Region opposes/is considering opposing, the construction of that new north highway corridor. I certainly think the 401 is plenty for our road needs, if we need more capacity then rail is the answer.