Which cities in N.A. are urbanizing and transforming the most?

[Chef]

A lot of Minneapolis' new apartments have come from five story midrises out in the neighborhoods, which has probably done more for improving its built form than getting the same number of units from 20 to 30 story towers downtown (although we've gotten those too). Overall the city population grew around 12% in the last decade, most of that was from new construction built in urban form. I'm not sure where that puts it within the hierarchy of North American cities in terms of growth in the core but it feels significantly more urban than 20 years ago.

I also noticed a lot of new development in Denver when I was there a few years ago. It should definitely be in the discussion.

[the urban politician]

Originally Posted by dc_denizen

^ Sorry, but this is in no way an indication of "urbanizing".

Metro building of multi-unit can range from a downtown skycraper to a suburban apartment complex surrounded by parking off of the local freeway.

The latter does not count, at least in regards to the question of this thread.

[BG918]

Originally Posted by Chef

A lot of Minneapolis' new apartments have come from five story midrises out in the neighborhoods, which has probably done more for improving its built form than getting the same number of units from 20 to 30 story towers downtown (although we've gotten those too). Overall the city population grew around 12% in the last decade, most of that was from new construction built in urban form. I'm not sure where that puts it within the hierarchy of North American cities in terms of growth in the core but it feels significantly more urban than 20 years ago.

I also noticed a lot of new development in Denver when I was there a few years ago. It should definitely be in the discussion.

I would put Denver up there as a city that has rapidly urbanized over the past decade. The increase in residential density in downtown and adjacent neighborhoods has been impressive. Like Mpls it has mostly been low and mid rise lacking the flashy new towers like you've seen in places like Austin and Nashville.

[pj3000]

New York

According to the SSP website:

(6) 1000'+ buildings U/C currently
(8) 1000'+ buildings BUILT 2010-2020
(3) 900'+ buildings U/C currently
(5) 900'+ buildings BUILT 2010-2020
(3) 800+ buildings U/C currently
(4) 800+ buildings BUILT 2010-2020

29 buildings 800 ft or above completed or under construction in the past 10 years. Think about that.

That is urban transformation in North America defined.

[Chef]

I think for all but the densest North American cities adding 20 five story buildings is a bigger net improvement in urban fabric than five 20 story buildings. And that is what is happening in a lot of cities.

The real story of urban development in the last decade wasn't height but density. In the case of Minneapolis it has added almost 1000 ppsm in the last 10 years. I'll take that over new towers every day. A lot of cities are getting new neighborhood fabric that is equivalent to what was built before WWII.

[the urban politician]

Originally Posted by Chef

I think for all but the densest North American cities adding 20 five story buildings is a bigger net improvement in urban fabric than five 20 story buildings. And that is what is happening in a lot of cities.

The real story of urban development in the last decade wasn't height but density. In the case of Minneapolis it has added almost 1000 ppsm in the last 10 years. I'll take that over new towers every day.

^ I agree with this. But what also matters is the design of those 5 story buildings and how they relate to the cityscape.

[pj3000]

Originally Posted by Chef

I think for all but the densest North American cities adding 20 five story buildings is a bigger net improvement in urban fabric than five 20 story buildings. And that is what is happening in a lot of cities.

The real story of urban development in the last decade wasn't height but density. In the case of Minneapolis it has added almost 1000 ppsm in the last 10 years. I'll take that over new towers every day.

That’s true for most any city, save NYC. Adding incredible height is adding density.

And, the insane development I listed actually says more about what I didn’t list... “if they’re putting this up, what else is going on”... that is, namely the “shorter” development in the 700’ range on down to 5 stories. The smaller scale development throughout the area (Brooklyn, Queens, Jersey) in the past decade is voluminous.

[ue]

In Canada: Toronto, Edmonton, Calgary, Saskatoon

In the US: Austin, Houston, Los Angeles, Charlotte, Seattle, Washington, Nashville

[Stay Stoked Brah]

Criteria I would use would be population growth + urban infill. If a city has population decline then they're scratched and that would be these: New York, Chicago, San Francisco, Los Angeles, Cleveland, Detroit, Pittsburgh.
I think Toronto and adjacent environs like Mississauga, maybe Calgary, maybe Atlanta. then Nashville, Denver, Dallas, Austin, Phoenix, Seattle, Washington DC, Monterrey, Mexico City are the leaders in N.A.

[pj3000]

Originally Posted by Stay Stoked Brah

Criteria I would use would be population growth + urban infill.

Well... now there's something that belongs in your introductory post on the topic.

[iheartthed]

Originally Posted by Stay Stoked Brah

Criteria I would use would be population growth + urban infill. If a city has population decline then they're scratched and that would be these: New York, Chicago, San Francisco, Los Angeles, Cleveland, Detroit, Pittsburgh.

What's your definition of population decline? Decline between censuses, ACS, or just over a 2 week span? It's unlikely that NYC, SF, or LA will show population declines between the 2010 census and 2020 census.

[Stay Stoked Brah]

Originally Posted by pj3000

Well... now there's something that belongs in your introductory post on the topic.

That is my own criteria to come up with cities. doesn't mean you or anybody else has to use the same. I don't think New York is transforming the most because it is already uber urban. Manhattan building a 100 story building doesn't transform the city. A city that develops green and brownfields to towers, townhouses, condos is seeing a greater transformation.

[pj3000]

Originally Posted by Stay Stoked Brah

That is my own criteria to come up with cities. doesn't mean you or anybody else has to use the same. I don't think New York is transforming the most because it is already uber urban. Manhattan building a 100 story building doesn't transform the city. A city that develops green and brownfields to towers, townhouses, condos is seeing a greater transformation.

That's fine... but it just helps steer a topic from the get-go to have some criteria, rather than leave it totally undefined and create a free-for-all of responses... and we end up repeating the same stuff in thread after thread in the City Discussions subforum.

As for New York, I understand that it is obviously already very "urban", but that in no way means that it is not continuing to urbanize and transform -- outpacing anywhere in North American by a very, very, very long stretch.

There are very different baselines from which to start such a measurement. So yes, if a place like Charlotte is filling in a 10 square block area of parking lots and warehouses with office buildings, condos, and retail, then it is transforming/urbanizing its core remarkably. New York is simply on a much higher level... a level that does not replace parking lots with condos, but replaces existing multistory buildings with thousand foot towers (14 in the past 10 years). And buildings have certainly been/are being built on brownfields in New York.

This topic is fully up for interpretation due to the relative sizes, densities, and activity occurring in various cities... without some criteria, that is.

[ssiguy]

Toronto, Seattle, Austin, Denver, Montreal, Nashville and Charlotte.

The surprising one I think that should be added is Detroit. Detroit went thru bankruptcy which is a huge event to begin with and now is seeing a to return to more downtown living, more infill and urban agriculture of it's once dying/dead urban neighbourhoods, and a complete restructuring of it's economy away from the automobile.

[Stay Stoked Brah]

Originally Posted by pj3000

This topic is fully up for interpretation due to the relative sizes, densities, and activity occurring in various cities... without some criteria, that is.

Boo ya! There is no right or wrong, thanks for your post. your last post is better than your first "New York" post.

[pj3000]

Originally Posted by Stay Stoked Brah

There is no right or wrong...

If that’s the case, then don’t add any criteria. And don’t reply refuting anyone’s listing of any city.

[Stay Stoked Brah]

Originally Posted by pj3000

If that’s the case, then don’t add any criteria. And don’t reply refuting anyone’s listing of any city.

I didn't add any criteria. I posted my own criteria and left it open for you and others.

You said New York and stated your reason why. Thanks.

[canucklehead2]

Skyscrapers and streetcars/subways... That's my loose definition of urbanization... In Canada? That'd be Edmonton, Calgary, Ottawa, Winnipeg, Quebec City and Hamilton in the process with Montreal, Toronto and Vancouver already there...

[JManc]

A bunch of tall buildings really isn't a barometer for urbanization. Austin gets notice because its urban environment is changed with the rapid development of mid to high rise living mostly downtown and around Rainey St. Here in Houston, the transformation from low density SFH neighborhoods inside the Loop to denser concentrations of townhomes has been staggering.

[LA21st]

Originally Posted by Chef

A lot of Minneapolis' new apartments have come from five story midrises out in the neighborhoods, which has probably done more for improving its built form than getting the same number of units from 20 to 30 story towers downtown (although we've gotten those too). Overall the city population grew around 12% in the last decade, most of that was from new construction built in urban form. I'm not sure where that puts it within the hierarchy of North American cities in terms of growth in the core but it feels significantly more urban than 20 years ago.

I also noticed a lot of new development in Denver when I was there a few years ago. It should definitely be in the discussion.

That's the same for the LA area. 5-7 story mixed use complexes built like crazy the last 10 years. Pre covid, you saw more pedestrians all over because of it.