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  #561  
Old Posted Jan 14, 2019, 7:06 PM
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photoLith photoLith is offline
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Ewww this building sucks, looks like a modernized version of a generic suburban 80's office park building. Oh well.

On a sidenote, I recently drove past the Longerberger Basket Building and got this photo, its actually a pretty sweet building.

ACV_8469-2 by photolitherland, on Flickr
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  #562  
Old Posted Jan 14, 2019, 7:20 PM
ajaxean ajaxean is offline
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Last edited by ajaxean; Jan 15, 2019 at 2:11 PM.
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  #563  
Old Posted Jan 15, 2019, 12:26 AM
allovertown allovertown is offline
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Originally Posted by ajaxean View Post
Yeah, I already explained this way back in the thread. I went to Penn and am horrified and disgusted by the billions of dollars they've spent putting up hideously ugly buildings which make the campus environment terrible and ruin the skyline of the city. That's my agenda, it's not a secret.


WHAT?! Do you know anything about Philadelphia? This building isn't "deep in Penn's campus". It's at the edge of West Philadelphia, overlooking the Schuylkill River. It's massive and can be seen from many parts of the city as well as from I-76. Tens of thousands of people will see this building on a daily basis, and thousands will work in and around it. AND, it's going to be in the skyline for the next 50+ years. That literally means that many, many millions of people will interact with this building over its lifetime. It's worth caring about.


It's an obsession because they're spending $1.5 BILLION dollars on this hulking piece of crap. And they spent over $700 million on the Frankenstein-looking Perelman Center. Penn Medicine just keeps dumping hundreds of millions of dollars into buildings which are both ugly on the outside and confusing on the inside. I find it genuinely outrageous that Penn can keep making the same terrible billion-dollar mistakes over and over while everyone else just shrugs their shoulders.

You seem... unhinged.

There have been plenty of shit buildings that have gone up or have been proposed in philly since you started your rants here. Why no complaints regarding them? Your focus on this building seems to go way beyond being a former Penn student and caring about Philadelphia's skyline. Your focus on the expense also seems odd considering you must understand that considering this is designed to be a world class hospital, the amount of that expense dedicated to design is a tiny fraction.
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  #564  
Old Posted Jan 15, 2019, 1:08 AM
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Urbanthusiat Urbanthusiat is offline
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I heard a cool thing the other day that a big reason the way it's shaped the way it is is to maximize the amount of daylight in patient rooms. Apparently that really helps people who have to be in there for a long period of time. It makes sense. I thought that was pretty cool.
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  #565  
Old Posted Jan 15, 2019, 1:28 AM
City Wide City Wide is offline
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Originally Posted by Urbanthusiat View Post
I heard a cool thing the other day that a big reason the way it's shaped the way it is is to maximize the amount of daylight in patient rooms. Apparently that really helps people who have to be in there for a long period of time. It makes sense. I thought that was pretty cool.

The theory of daylight helping patients (and staff) is probably solid, but with the cost and insurance these days spending more then a couple days in the hospital is fairly unusual these days. I'm sure there are cases where somebody is in hospital for a couple weeks, but that's not the norm. Many years ago I had knee surgery and was in one day before surgery and many four after; now a similar surgery is either done as a out patient or maybe you'll be in for one night. Even with something as complex as open heart surgery in moved onto a rehab setting after a couple days.
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  #566  
Old Posted Jan 15, 2019, 1:44 AM
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^
healing is healing on all levels. more natural light is good. also, there was an extensive article about the interior design of this project. A lot of lessons learned from patients to provider team provided an exhaustive lists of improvements to makes a better experience for the sick and to make the staff more efficient and comfortable to do their job. win-win for everyone, except the people that don't like the exterior looking design. This one is more about the good that it is doing from the inside than a futile critique of bad design of the outside (in some people's eyes).
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  #567  
Old Posted Jan 15, 2019, 6:36 AM
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Last edited by ajaxean; Jan 15, 2019 at 2:11 PM.
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  #568  
Old Posted Jan 15, 2019, 1:21 PM
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I mean, the Penn room render looks FAR nicer than Hopkins. And I have been to Hopkins. What happens on the inside of this building IS far more important than its exterior. That is just logic and common sense and has nothing to do with press releases. Whether the building demands necessitate this exterior or whether they could have chosen a better design and still accomplished the same function is a different issue. I would think they could have. Nothing wrong with calling on Penn to make better designed buildings. But it still seems to me you need a serious attitude adjustment axajean.
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  #569  
Old Posted Jan 15, 2019, 2:17 PM
Justin7 Justin7 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ajaxean View Post
Yeah, I already explained this way back in the thread. I went to Penn and am horrified and disgusted by the billions of dollars they've spent putting up hideously ugly buildings which make the campus environment terrible and ruin the skyline of the city. That's my agenda, it's not a secret.

WHAT?! Do you know anything about Philadelphia? This building isn't "deep in Penn's campus". It's at the edge of West Philadelphia, overlooking the Schuylkill River. It's massive and can be seen from many parts of the city as well as from I-76. Tens of thousands of people will see this building on a daily basis, and thousands will work in and around it. AND, it's going to be in the skyline for the next 50+ years. That literally means that many, many millions of people will interact with this building over its lifetime. It's worth caring about.

It's an obsession because they're spending $1.5 BILLION dollars on this hulking piece of crap. And they spent over $700 million on the Frankenstein-looking Perelman Center. Penn Medicine just keeps dumping hundreds of millions of dollars into buildings which are both ugly on the outside and confusing on the inside. I find it genuinely outrageous that Penn can keep making the same terrible billion-dollar mistakes over and over while everyone else just shrugs their shoulders.
OK, but you understand you don't sound like an alumnus who is concerned with design and costs? You sound like a pissy teenager who didn't get the xbox game he wanted for Christmas and can't let go of it. What are you hoping to accomplish? Everyone now knows that ajaxean on skyscraperpage.com is not a fan of this particular project. We get it. You can move on with your life.
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  #570  
Old Posted Jan 15, 2019, 2:20 PM
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Geez ajex...

What facts are you really bringing into the discussion, again? From your last post, I'm not sure I actually saw any facts. It seems more like opinions than facts to us. You provide more of your vanity comparisons to other facilities and you cherry pick your points. Re: sunlight, you have to remember people are sick and in a hospital bed and aren't sunbathing next to the window as the primary therapy, but to get a view of the outside and sun beaming into the room helps out psychologically for those that need it. Also, if patient is recovering and well enough to walk, then they can stand/sit next to window as they wish.Re: interiors, what in the world do you mean when you say standardized floors and room shapes? Where are the facts in your statement here? Standardized is a vague term.

And, finally, what press release are you referring to, when you quote me as regurgitating my opinion about the good that the care facility is providing to the sick in light of a bad looking design from the outside?

Last edited by iheartphilly; Jan 15, 2019 at 2:32 PM.
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  #571  
Old Posted Jan 15, 2019, 3:48 PM
Capsule F Capsule F is offline
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I legit like this building, I think it looks good.

Also, show me one hospital building that is not confusing. They tend to be the most confusing structures (inside) that I have ever experienced.
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  #572  
Old Posted Jan 16, 2019, 7:25 AM
PurpleWhiteOut PurpleWhiteOut is offline
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Originally Posted by City Wide View Post
The theory of daylight helping patients (and staff) is probably solid, but with the cost and insurance these days spending more then a couple days in the hospital is fairly unusual these days. I'm sure there are cases where somebody is in hospital for a couple weeks, but that's not the norm. Many years ago I had knee surgery and was in one day before surgery and many four after; now a similar surgery is either done as a out patient or maybe you'll be in for one night. Even with something as complex as open heart surgery in moved onto a rehab setting after a couple days.
I work in a Philly hospital, and unfortunately, there are a lot of patients who spend many months in the hospital, or come back frequently. Some patients I still recognize from when I started 2 years ago. Small procedures encourage a quick discharge, but there are many patients who are critically ill or with severe chronic disease who spend much of their time in hospitals due to a need for acute care. I know someone who also just passed the 70 day mark due to severe physical injury. A lot of people hover between life and death in hospitals, unfortunately. and the sad reality is that many people ultimately pass away in hosptials. I can see how sunlight and windows would be very important for not only their mental wellbeing but also for their frequent visitors and family.

Also @ajax, I feel like the hate is unwarranted. Imo it looks better than the renders so far, and I think it is a bold design that is leaps and bounds better than either most aging philly hospitals that were mostly built in the 60s or uninspiring glass boxes of present. I'm happy to see something bold and risk taking rather than something stifling, and I think judgements need to wait till after completion, especially after the landscaping and all that. Most importantly, this is a hospital, and their mission first and foremost is to help sick patients. This isn't just another residential tower. You've basically been trolling instead of offering anything constructive. People have different opinions, and many people legitimately like this building and aren't "delusional."

Last edited by PurpleWhiteOut; Jan 16, 2019 at 10:35 AM.
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  #573  
Old Posted Jan 16, 2019, 1:12 PM
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^Completely agree. Sadly, I’ve spent a lot of time in about 6-7 hospitals over the past few years helping family battling cancer, including a recent stay in a brand new Johns Hopkins specialized cancer center. Let me say, the patient room rendering with the gigantic digital board with tv, updates, etc is awesome, I haven’t seen anything even comparable. And the huge windows/sun light really matter. We watched the Eagles-Bears playoff game on a little 12in patient room tv, I was so jealous seeing that rendering. Giving a patient a few hours a day to simply sit next to a window and get some sunlight is usually the highlight of the day for a very ill/terminal patient. Also, family that basically stays for days in the hospital helping can use some visual stimulation as well. I mean you can only watch so much daytime tv.
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  #574  
Old Posted Jan 16, 2019, 7:35 PM
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I don't think there's any reason to think that HUP hasn't put a great degree of care into the design and planning for this new general hospital building, both the inside and into it's exterior look. (and I certainly don't have any problem with it's having sunny patient rooms!) Its obvious that HUP is not doing this on the cheap; I'm sure the cantilevered front and the radiused ends add huge amounts to the total being spent. So to think that HUP is just throwing this building up without much care is just stupid thinking.
But trying to do a good job doesn't guarantee success. Personally I think the outcome of how the building looks and how it fits into it's context is still in up in the air. The mock up of the exterior panel showed real promise, but, IMO, the dark brown that's being used in the actual building doesn't do much for me. Plus there seems to be a lack of much detail in how the windows fit into the façade. It's like a more noticeable window sill could have added a lot to the look.
So, so far I'd say I'm unimpressed with how this building looks. But I'm more then glad to wait until it's complete to see the finish project
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  #575  
Old Posted Jan 16, 2019, 8:20 PM
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Lots of great information in these links for those that are interested. This is NOT a traditional hospital by any measure. The interior is being built so that as technology and needs evolve and/or change, it can and will adapt. Over 100 people worked on the design and people with expertise in building hospitals provided valuable input as well as people that are working for Penn's Health System. If you are short on time, watch the video in the first link. It provides lots of information about the real world simulations, design, mock up, rendering, and insight from those that are on the front line. Not a full detailed report by any means, but also not de minimis either.

https://www.pennmedicine.org/for-pat...vania/pavilion

https://www.pennmedicine.org/news/pu...-of-innovation

https://informedinfrastructure.com/3...penn-medicine/

Fun Fact: Didn't know this: Pavilion Tunnel Construction Across 33rd and 34th Streets

https://www.pennmedicine.org/for-pat...l-construction

Last edited by iheartphilly; Jan 17, 2019 at 12:37 AM.
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  #576  
Old Posted Jan 17, 2019, 7:35 AM
PurpleWhiteOut PurpleWhiteOut is offline
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^Completely agree. Sadly, I’ve spent a lot of time in about 6-7 hospitals over the past few years helping family battling cancer, including a recent stay in a brand new Johns Hopkins specialized cancer center.
Yup, it's easy for healthy people who have limited exposure to hospital stays to think otherwise, but extended stays in intensive care units are common enough that this is very important for the experience of the patient and their families. Hospitals these days realize that the more homey a place is, the more comfortable people will be (a huge change from ththe 50s-70s built hospitals that dominate). Rumor has it at CHOP where I work that they're planning to move the labs to make more patient rooms solely because we have windows. For those unaware, CHOP's main hospital started as a brutalist building and the all glass facade came later, but the layout is from that era. If you look through the glass you can actually see the original building thats encapsulated in the glass. Our building is older, so it makes total sense to me that a brand new building is taking this into account from the start.
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  #577  
Old Posted Jan 21, 2019, 11:20 PM
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  #578  
Old Posted Jan 23, 2019, 4:39 AM
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Sunrise Moon by Tom Ipri, on Flickr
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  #579  
Old Posted Jan 23, 2019, 9:45 PM
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  #580  
Old Posted Jan 26, 2019, 2:28 AM
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