Stadiums & Arenas of Canada, Part 3

[thurmas]

Originally Posted by J.OT13

No clue. The arena is surrounded by 70 acres of parking and on the route for Stage 3 of the O-Train (unfunded and questionable at this time). The site could become a new Mertotown or just another typical low density suburb.

The Mayor wants to see a vision for the old arena itself, but based on who's involved with the bid, I'm not seeing much vision for something out-of-the-box (for Ottawa).

With housing crisis should be prime land for more homes

[steve61]

Originally Posted by J.OT13

Only issue is, the overall quality of the arena and surrounding development might be sub-par.

Can I ask what this is based on? I'm not from Ottawa so I don't know the local players other than what's been reported

[J.OT13]

Originally Posted by steve61

Can I ask what this is based on? I'm not from Ottawa so I don't know the local players other than what's been reported

https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/ottaw...town-1.6792912[/QUOTE]

Originally Posted by Harley613

Really?????????!!!!!!?????????!!!!

Originally Posted by Harley613

I keep forgetting we are getting the dumbed down Claridge'd bait & switch version of this project.

Originally Posted by Harley613

Photo by me
June 18, 2014[/QUOTE]


https://twitter.com/mchkzn/status/1350894241468309508

Originally Posted by rocketphish

On a grey day...



Nov 13, 2022
Photo by me

[thurmas]

Wait when did Ottawa get tall buildings? Its always been the place skylines go to dissappear.

[J.OT13]

Originally Posted by thurmas

Wait when did Ottawa get tall buildings? Its always been the place skylines go to dissappear.

All the tall buildings are the same height and look the same so yeah, skyline kind of disappears in a block of shades of grey, thanks in large part to Claridge.

Oh, and one more example to answer Steve's question, Claridge Icon, an amazing design botched by Claridge.

Originally Posted by Harley613

I took this image on November 18th 2020, nearly two years ago. When I drove by today the front windows of the main floor still have Tyvek taped to them, the entire podium is dirty and partly completed, the streetscape is still a total disaster. Building a 45 story building in Ottawa is like building the Great Pyramid of Giza thousands of years ago apparently.

Originally Posted by Harley613

What, you don't see beauty here?! Just not Iconic enough for you?

Our arena district will likely be surrounded by really crappy looking buildings. But at least, we'll have a Downtown arena district.

Figures crossed that Claridge can surprise us and produce something we can be proud of.

[ScreamingViking]

Originally Posted by thurmas

What will happen to the arena in Kanata once downtown arena opens?

Burn it to the ground and build something better.

[Oilkountry]

Keep in mind, those cheap designs are typical for housing it makes sense to cheap out on the exterior as you are selling the interior and a flashy exterior brings 0 value, if they are building sky scrapers for cooperate sales, hotels, housing ect, i guarantee you the quality of those buildings is advanced significantly. I cant imagine they invest 10 billion into downtown Ottawa just to cheap out to save 1% on building costs and potentially lose interest on buyers. These are smart business men that see an ice district type opportunity.

Also doesn't Ottawa have height restrictions so they don't cast shadows on the water or something like that?

[J.OT13]

Originally Posted by Oilkountry

Keep in mind, those cheap designs are typical for housing it makes sense to cheap out on the exterior as you are selling the interior and a flashy exterior brings 0 value, if they are building sky scrapers for cooperate sales, hotels, housing ect, i guarantee you the quality of those buildings is advanced significantly. I cant imagine they invest 10 billion into downtown Ottawa just to cheap out to save 1% on building costs and potentially lose interest on buyers. These are smart business men that see an ice district type opportunity.

Also doesn't Ottawa have height restrictions so they don't cast shadows on the water or something like that?

Oh really?

I give you the Andaz Hotel, built by Claridge. Image from the Globe and Mail, and this is actually one of the more "flattering" images I've seen.


https://www.theglobeandmail.com/life...ticle33332686/

and from rocketphish:

Originally Posted by rocketphish

I still don't like it.



Photo by me.
December 3, 2016

The second image below even has a random dark panel above the 7th floor, in the middle of the main façade.

Originally Posted by rocketphish

Again, this is not a Holiday Inn, it's an Andaz. These are supposed to be "luxury boutique hotels" under the Hyatt brand. This isn't the only hotel that was dumbed down. Check out the Marriott AC thread in Ottawa's downtown forum. Ottawa is the third most expensive city in the country, but nearly every build is value engineered to death.

I'm less worried about the arena. I don't think Claridge will have much to do with it (though they might build the towers on each corner). It's the rest of the surrounding development.

On height restrictions, they are only in the traditional downtown to preserve dominance of Parliament on the skyline. They don't apply to LeBreton Flats.

[esquire]

I think the Andaz is pretty nice

[J.OT13]

Originally Posted by esquire

I think the Andaz is pretty nice

And you're from Winnipeg where the architecture of modern buildings is actually quite nice.

[esquire]

^ I'd happily take the Andaz over our arena district hotel... the Alt. There is (well, was) another one under construction (Sutton Place) but it has been in a semi-permanent frozen state for a few years now with no signs of restarting.



They even cheaped out on the fin that was supposed to run all the way up the building and just painted a strip yellow instead

[J.OT13]

Originally Posted by esquire

^ I'd happily take the Andaz over our arena district hotel... the Alt. There is (well, was) another one under construction (Sutton Place) but it has been in a semi-permanent frozen state for a few years now with no signs of restarting.



They even cheaped out on the fin that was supposed to run all the way up the building and just painted a strip yellow instead

I was actually thinking of this one when I replied to your previous post. I'm actually a fan of the Alt Winnipeg. Looks better in person (at least, when I saw it in 2019).

Back on topic, the Mayor of Ottawa is muddying the waters by throwing a bunch of site suggestions. He had Bayview (which wouldn't be terrible), Lynx Stadium (very small site, one O-Train station across a narrow bridge), the RCMP HQ (still occupied, poor access to transit along and/or across a major stroad). Now he's proposing the Sens buy a few Federal office buildings in the CBD and tear them down for an arena.

LeBreton is by far the best option, with two O-Train stations, three directions. Potential for a large site with an Ice District. Close to a few traditional main streets, Zibi, Hull. And best of all, the Sens and NCC are already negotiating a deal with the Sens and its multitude of partners (who would likely not take a change in direction lightly after a year and a half of work). Let's see where LeBreton goes, and if it doesn't work out, then we can look at other options.

[Coldrsx]

Agreed in full. The ALT YWG is far superior

[esquire]

I was reading an article about that clown in England who was dealing with punishment for his idiotic jersey referencing the Hillsborough Disaster.

Of course I jumped down the rabbit hole and read the Wikipedia entry on the Hillsborough Disaster in which 97 people died and hundreds were injured as a result of being crushed in overcrowded terraces.

That got me thinking... when I go to Bomber games at IG Field, there is often a sea of humanity standing on the north end zone at the Rum Hut. And unlike "safe standing" areas such as the Pil Country endzone at Mosaic Stadium, it's really a huge swarm with nothing to break up the large number of people in the area. Obviously fan culture at a Bomber game is different from English soccer in the 80s... it is way less aggro, people at the Bomber game are generally having fun and in a celebratory mood. The people standing in the endzones tend to be less focused on watching the game and more focused on socializing. Given the distances involved there are relatively few away fans, and even when there are (Banjo Bowl) they still tend to be on the friendly side of things, e.g. Bomber fans and Rider fans are more likely to be drinking beer together and having a good time than fistfighting.

But what if??? What if something happened and for whatever reason there was a crowd surge. That terrace could become a really nasty place if the mood turned and people started stampeding. I wonder what, if any thought the Bombers have put into this? As it is now the Rum Hut deck is totally uncontrolled in terms of access... anyone in the stadium can stand there. There are no fixed capacity limits.

With the increased popularity of party decks, terraces, standing areas, etc. in all kinds of outdoor stadiums in North America, I wonder what controls are in place to prevent incidents from happening in the future?

[J.OT13]

That overcrowding doesn't look fun. I would not be hanging out there.

We have seen sports related rioting in Montreal and Vancouver. We've seen rioting in Toronto (G7?). So yeah, it's not unheard of in Canada.

Controlling the number of people who could have access to these party decks is one thing, but could cause other issues. Maybe more party decks is a partial solution?

[esquire]

Originally Posted by J.OT13

That overcrowding doesn't look fun. I would not be hanging out there.

We have seen sports related rioting in Montreal and Vancouver. We've seen rioting in Toronto (G7?). So yeah, it's not unheard of in Canada.

Controlling the number of people who could have access to these party decks is one thing, but could cause other issues. Maybe more party decks is a partial solution?

The funny thing is that the Rum Hut's popularity has endured for years. It is a tradition that carried over from the old stadium. But clearly the stadium design did not take into account huge throngs of people milling around in that area. Obviously it gets quite congested for anyone trying to navigate the concourse.

By contrast, Regina (and other cities, Edmonton and Hamilton have variations on this idea, maybe others too) has a "safe standing" area where it is assigned and not just a free for all. The Bombers have added this too, but it hasn't diminished the popularity of the Rum Hut patio.

[Denscity]

BC Place held its first ever sporting event 40 years ago today.
Over 60 000 people saw the Vancouver Whitecaps play soccer against the Seattle Sounders

[elly63]

Originally Posted by Denscity

BC Place held its first ever sporting event 40 years ago today.

And the stadium had a successful interior and exterior renovation. Wish the Big O would do the same (successfully)

[Coldrsx]

https://www.linkedin.com/in/victorcu...3wJbA7Cg%3D%3D

[thurmas]

With Alberta Edmonton-Calgary joint bid for the 2030 Commonwealth Games i think it can work. City of Edmonton was requesting $185 million on upgrades to Commonwealth Stadium. McMahon would likely need around 350 or 400 million in upgrades but I think overall for sports facilities can be done for around $1 billion in Alberta altogether.