LED street lights - Page 2

pj3000 · #21 Posted **Jun 8, 2023, 7:29 PM**

^ The thing is, you shouldn't have to live like this because of an inappropriately-colored streetlight that produces significant light trespass into your home.

Austinlee · #22 Posted **Jun 8, 2023, 7:38 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by pj3000

I would contact your city councilperson and make it known that you don't want inappropriately-colored lights.

Like Steely mentions above with Chicago, cities that converted to LED years back... which were bright white (4700K +)... are now replacing them with a warmer color temperature LEDs.

Pittsburgh replaced around 4,000 of its old sodium vapor streetlights with bight-white 5000K LEDs a number of years ago... and then realized the error of its ways.

Now, it will replace ALL of its streetlights with 3000K LEDs.

Hopefully, Kansas City will learn from mistakes other cities (including themselves it sounds like) have made, and will not waste money on bright-white lights that they'll only end up replacing, while irritating the hell out of its citizens in the meantime.

Some resources:

https://www.designlights.org/our-work/luna/

https://www.darksky.org/our-work/lighting/

https://www.darksky.org/our-work/lig...ng-ordinances/

This is interesting to me on a personal anecdotal level right now. I recently replaced my front porch light with an LED motion detecting fixture. I bought LED bulbs that last for 15,000 hours and after installing them I immediately realized that "daylight" was WAY too bright. It took two more trips to the hardware store for me to get ones that were labeled as "soft white" I believe. But yeah, essentially I went from around 5k to 3k lights. 5k would be a nightmare if all streetlights had them. Way too white and way too bright.

hughfb3 · #23 Posted **Jun 8, 2023, 8:10 PM**

I miss driving through San Diego with all their Low Pressure Sodium Lamps. It was one of the only cities with these installed on a massive scale while everywhere else was on High Pressure Sodium. The warm orange glow was soothing and kept the city from being too bright. One could easily determine between the light bouncing from the moon and city light. Now it’s hard to tell the difference between moonlight and anything else. LPS was my favorite and kept city light distinct… now, it’s all a big blob of homogeneous light

Light pollution is a real thing and we have been going crazy with the LEDs creating so much more dependence on artificial light.

pj3000 · #24 Posted **Jun 8, 2023, 9:10 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by hughfb3

Light pollution is a real thing and we have been going crazy with the LEDs creating so much more dependence on artificial light.

Absolutely, but LED technology is not the problem. The problem is with their misuse and overuse.

ilcapo · #25 Posted **Jun 8, 2023, 9:11 PM**

I remember complaining about the yellow lights where i live (Northern europe. It can get really dark). Especially along remote roads where the lights doesnt help at all to see wild animals.
And then going to Miami there was bright white led lights all over the road.

I loved it back then because it made the city feel more alive and alert.

The bright light (4000 k and above) can be quite harmful for eyes. Ct 3000k is recommended.

But as mentioned above, led now does not equal hospital-white. There are more examples of cities that has not done their homework when switching to LED,

badrunner · #26 Posted **Jun 8, 2023, 9:19 PM**

I'm gonna miss those puke-orange sodium vapor lights.

sopas ej · #27 Posted **Jun 8, 2023, 10:19 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by hughfb3

I miss driving through San Diego with all their Low Pressure Sodium Lamps.

Oh I hated those!

Long Beach had them too. I think they were installed in the 1970s during the "energy crisis" because they used less electricity. Many people (myself included) didn't think they were bright enough, especially in the bad neighborhoods of Long Beach. People also argued that the yellow light they gave off also prevented people from giving accurate descriptions of what color a suspect was wearing or what color suspect vehicles were. When the Metro Blue (now A) rail line opened in 1990, along its route through Long Beach, they installed the high pressure sodium lights (the ones that are brighter and give off that pale pinkish light that apparently some people now wish never went away), which made Long Beach residents want them all over the city. By the mid-1990s, Long Beach began replacing the yellow low pressure sodium street lights.

If I recall correctly, I think San Jose also used to have those yellow streetlights. I think parts of Riverside County also had them; I want to say you still see them here and there in Riverside County, like Temecula. It might have something to do with an observatory in the area or something, and they want to cut down on light pollution.

SIGSEGV · #28 Posted **Jun 8, 2023, 10:48 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by Obadno

I've never liked LED lights they are cold and sterile they make you feel like you are in a Walmart or a hospital.

Ive stocked up on the bulbs I like as they continue to become harder and harder to find and I dont want to live in LED nightmare homes.

But I do like when the streetlights bug out and give the city a purple cyberpunk feel.

Speaking of blue and red lights, cpd vehicles have started leaving their strobes on while they're sitting around doing whatever it is they do. Since I live in the loop there's almost always a cpd strobe on outside... Do cops do this in other cities?

Wigs · #29 Posted **Jun 9, 2023, 1:12 AM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by Steely Dan

Right?

Some people in this thread appear to be unaware of the advances in LED lighting over the past 10 years or so.

Yes, the first LED bulbs that became widely available on the market were way too cold, turning many people off to LED, but LED bulbs matching the temperature of the old beloved incandescent are now readily available anywhere.

Same thing happened with streetlights. When Chicago first started testing LED streetlights a decade or so ago, they were way too cold, like 5,000K, upsetting many people, but they're now using a standard 3,000K fixture that is also remotely dimmable for off-peak times/areas where the light is to bright.

It's downright comical to read Americans freak out over things that have been mainstream elsewhere for years. However I agree with pj3000 they don't have to be 6000 kelvin or whatever

My hometown converted the entire city to LED streetlights over a decade ago. My current city completed the conversion in 2016.

iheartthed · #30 Posted **Jun 9, 2023, 2:49 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wigs

It's downright comical to read Americans freak out over things that have been mainstream elsewhere for years. However I agree with pj3000 they don't have to be 6000 kelvin or whatever

My hometown converted the entire city to LED streetlights over a decade ago. My current city completed the conversion in 2016.

Honestly, I'm surprised that there are still places that haven't made the switch. I can't remember when I last saw the old street lights. And I actually prefer the LEDs since they make it far easier to see at night than the sodium lamps.

sopas ej · #31 Posted **Jun 9, 2023, 3:18 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by iheartthed

Honestly, I'm surprised that there are still places that haven't made the switch. I can't remember when I last saw the old street lights. And I actually prefer the LEDs since they make it far easier to see at night than the sodium lamps.

I prefer the LEDs too.

In SoCal, right now it's still a mixed bag of sodium lamps and LEDs, because of all the different jurisdictions. The city of Los Angeles completed its LED switchover in 2013, and in the news they said that LA "completed the world’s largest LED street light replacement project, replacing more than 141,000 streetlights with LEDs." I've noticed though that there are still some neighborhood pockets in the city of LA that still have the sodium lamps.

My home town suburb of Cerritos, where my parents still live, completed their LED changeover in 2019, I think. Prior to the conversion, the city set up a demonstration project at a public park and invited Cerritos residents to go there at night, and vote for which brightness/color they wanted. From what I read, only 127 people showed up, but based on their votes, they settled on a certain brightness for the arterial streets, and slightly dimmer LEDs for the residential streets.

The city of Pasadena for some reason, still has many sodium lamps. My city of South Pasadena is still a mix, and like I posted earlier, my own street didn't get LEDs until maybe 2-ish years ago. Many of the residential areas have them now, but our few arterials still have some sodium lamps.

In many suburban LA cities, SoCal Edison owns/maintains the street lamps. Edison started converting them to LEDs in the mid-late 2010s. Caltrans converted all of our freeways/highways to LED lights several years ago now.

KevinFromTexas · #32 Posted **Jun 10, 2023, 2:04 AM**

The lights and crime thing is silly. Are these neighborhoods that have bad crime really in the dark? I doubt it.

I have curtains that block out the light because my neighbor across the street is also afraid of the dark and apparently thinks his driveway can land a jumbo jet if he only puts in 4 lights to light up his driveway.

It's not that I miss the orange glow, I just dislike how bright and harsh the LEDs are. I also hate the idea of light pollution in general that blocks out the stars and attracts bugs and also bats. Last summer a few times a bat almost buzzed me in our driveway as it's attracted to the street light across the street because of the bugs.

I actually love LEDs. They're incredibly versatile nowadays and can change color, are dimmable now, and can even sync with music and movies, if you're into that. I have them in my bedroom to avoid having to turn the overhead ceiling fan light on to avoid stepping on my dogs. I just leave them on at night before bed. They're also incredibly relaxing, and there are some really neat bulbs you can buy now.

I have these two in some lamps on a shelf over my bed, and they create a nice warm glow, and they look cool up close. There are others, too, that you can't tell they're LED. They even look like 100 year old bulbs. I also have LED strip lights around my LEGO table and under it to light up the storage area under there. I can change the color and turn them on and off with a remote.

• Video Link

Matthew · #33 Posted **Jun 10, 2023, 11:21 PM**

Not only do you have the purple issue... Here in suburban Atlanta, we have strobe LED streetlights. Yes, I've seen some of them flashing on and off, like a strobe light.

I'm not a fan of the orange lights. As others have said, there is a middle-ground between bright Daylight LEDs and dim orange lights.

In my neighborhood (in suburban Atlanta), the original 2005/2006 streetlights were orange. I'm guessing, around maybe 2015 the neighborhood switched to Daylight LEDs. They actually had to replace the inside of the light fixtures to switch and changed the fixtures to reduce light pollution in the night sky (light directed downward). It was possible to see colors at night and see everything happening along the street. I'm sure someone (likely many in the neighborhood) complained about the brightness, because those bright Daylight LEDs didn't last long. I want to say within two or three months, workers returned to replace all of the bright Daylight LEDs with dim yellow LED lights. Those are the lights we have today and everything looks yellowish. The dimness isn't the issue for me. I agree we shouldn't have bright lights next to people's upstairs (bedroom) windows. I just don't like yellow and orange light. I would like to see them find something closer to the middle instead of closer to those old orange lights.

I've also noticed new light standards installed on major commercial roads with yellow-orange LEDs. I'm not sure if the cities, counties, or Georgia DOT are doing this? I really wish they would avoid the yellow/orange colors. I think the new lights under Interstate bridges are the Daylight LEDs, so maybe those yellow-orange lights are from the cities or counties?

SteveD · #34 Posted **Jun 11, 2023, 2:38 PM**

Atlanta converted to LED street lights about 5 years ago. The change is jarring at first but you get used to it, and now I appreciate the brighter lighting.

We've been in our house for 17 years, in a transitioning in-town neighborhood. We saw we had a light pole at the end of our driveway; not sure why it was there, but we called GA Power and they came out and put an additional LED light fixture at the base of our driveway, which we love. The neighbors appreciate it to. Extra $15/month on our electric bill for service maintenance of it.

pj3000 · #35 Posted **Jun 11, 2023, 4:11 PM**

We have zero streetlights (by ordinance) in my municipality.

It’s dark and lovely at night.

Obadno · #36 Posted **Jun 12, 2023, 7:50 PM**

I actually do like the purple malfunction, I think it looks cool even if was a total accident and probably isn't adequate lighting.

dchan · #37 Posted **Jun 12, 2023, 9:35 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by pj3000

Seeing that LEDs have been widespread on the consumer market for a decade now, I'm still kinda amazed that people seem to know so little about them.

You can get them in basically any fucking color temp you want. So, if you grab a 5000k off the shelf without taking 5 secs to look at the package, screw it into your living lamp and you don't like the stark, white light it gives off... well that's your own damn fault. Blame your own ignorance and not the technology.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Steely Dan

Right?

Some people in this thread appear to be unaware of the advances in LED lighting over the past 10 years or so.

Yes, the first LED bulbs that became widely available on the market were way too cold, turning many people off to LED, but LED bulbs matching the temperature of the old beloved incandescent are now readily available anywhere.

Same thing happened with streetlights. When Chicago first started testing LED streetlights a decade or so ago, they were way too cold, like 5,000K, upsetting many people, but they're now using a standard 3,000K fixture that is also remotely dimmable for off-peak times/areas where the light is to bright.

The issue is that the perceived light at 2700K may be "warm white", but even low color temperature LEDs can high amounts of blue light that can disrupt circadian rhythms. Whereas the old incandescent bulbs did not emit any blue light, despite the light looking mostly the same at the same color temperature.

Quote:

Unfortunately even the ‘warm white’ LED products still emit significant amounts of blue light (see figure above) – too much to be safely used at night, especially for those of us who have trouble sleeping.

https://www.sunlightinside.com/light-and-health/light-for-sleep/#:~:text=Unfortunately%20even%20the%20'warm%20white,us%20who%20have%20trouble%20sleeping.

If you have trouble sleeping at night, put away the phone & tablet, and step away from any computer screens, because all emit significant amounts of blue light.

For lighting, look for LEDs that emit little blue light. Again, this is different from color temperature. Do your research on which LED lights will emit the lowest blue light (this one is just an example, not a recommendation: https://www.amazon.com/Blocking-Ligh...17&sr=8-5&th=1).