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  #7461  
Old Posted May 16, 2015, 9:45 PM
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Originally Posted by PHXFlyer11 View Post
I found this article from 2012. I don't know if these were ever approved or not... If so, we may be close to one of these perhaps moving forward?

http://azbex.com/gplets-sought-for-t...wntown-towers/

Anyone know anything on these?
211 Monroe completely fell apart and thank god it did. It was a horrendous proposal with setbacks, nearly a half block sized parking garage and about 1/4 of the block (I believe facing Van Buren?) that was nothing but grass between the garage and the sidewalk.

With the current boom that's happening in Central Phoenix, I cannot believe that the Colliers lot has not seen at least a new proposal by now. I mean what the heck are they waiting for? Another real estate crash?
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  #7462  
Old Posted May 17, 2015, 12:39 AM
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Originally Posted by RonnieFoos View Post
211 Monroe completely fell apart and thank god it did.
Agreed

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Originally Posted by RonnieFoos View Post
With the current boom that's happening in Central Phoenix, I cannot believe that the Colliers lot has not seen at least a new proposal by now. I mean what the heck are they waiting for? Another real estate crash?
The current projects are mostly low and midrise apartments. The Colliers lot is prime for a high rise office. There's not much demand for class A office space in downtown. I can see it sitting empty for a while unless a hotel or high rise condo gets built. Maybe if Portland on the Park sells out fast a developer will put up condos.
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  #7463  
Old Posted May 17, 2015, 12:45 AM
PHXFlyer11 PHXFlyer11 is offline
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A few observations from today...

I decided to take a good look around today. A lot of this is not new, but some visual confirmations and observations...
  • Edison Midtown - Indeed I was able to read the sign I referenced yesteday, this is scheduled for a zoning review on May 21. Great project, hope it moves quickly.
  • Portland on the Park - Able to confirm tower crane is now up!
  • Switch & DeSoto - Looked packed, nice weather, so not surprising, tons of people out.
  • Luhrs - Work continues below ground, didn't seem to be any heavy cranes or machinery. Seems to be, below ground work is wrapping up. I am expecting to see a tower crane in the next 30 days.
  • Union - Still excavating
  • Muse - No movement. No signs.
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  #7464  
Old Posted May 17, 2015, 1:16 AM
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there are also signs up for the construction company doing illuminate and the scientology apartments, so it appears those ones are actually the real deal, instead of just a demo/empty lot like I was afraid they would become.
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  #7465  
Old Posted May 17, 2015, 2:38 AM
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I was down there today was going to report same thing. Portland place is moving fast Union just a big hole same as two months ago.
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  #7466  
Old Posted May 17, 2015, 2:44 AM
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I have a bunch of pictures I'm not sure how to post it? It's on my phone
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  #7467  
Old Posted May 17, 2015, 4:15 PM
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The current projects are mostly low and midrise apartments. The Colliers lot is prime for a high rise office. There's not much demand for class A office space in downtown. I can see it sitting empty for a while unless a hotel or high rise condo gets built. Maybe if Portland on the Park sells out fast a developer will put up condos.
I understand the need is not there (although I have heard others state that Phoenix is short on Class A space?). But there's not really any reason why a phased development could not be done. I'm not really sure what Colliers has planned, but I would imagine it would probably be a mix of retail, office and condo space? So build the retail/condo space and build the tower later when the need is there.
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  #7468  
Old Posted May 17, 2015, 4:27 PM
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Originally Posted by RonnieFoos View Post
I understand the need is not there (although I have heard others state that Phoenix is short on Class A space?). But there's not really any reason why a phased development could not be done. I'm not really sure what Colliers has planned, but I would imagine it would probably be a mix of retail, office and condo space? So build the retail/condo space and build the tower later when the need is there.
I would definitely love to see something like that to start. Maybe on 1/3 of the parcel. I think it's time somebody try condos again, this time right in the heart of downtown.

It would be great to see a tower with ground level retail. Small upscale hotel on a couple lower floors and then 20 stories of condos.
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  #7469  
Old Posted May 18, 2015, 5:03 AM
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It isn't too bad to have...some place around midtown people just think its a waste of prime real-estate... which it is.

the only good thing about it is 1 less dirt lot and a big bump in local population.
That's important. Five stories would have been even better. But to be honest, I feel like going from three stories to Four Stories is the critical difference.
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  #7470  
Old Posted May 18, 2015, 7:22 AM
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Im really excited for downtown right now. Last time this happened 7 years ago they were far to ambitious the scale of these projects is much more reasonable.

If all of these get completed Downtown-Roosevelt-Midtown will have a massive influx of people, that means more Bars and Restaurants, more people wanting to live there hopefully we have finally kicked off an engine for downtown.
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No that lot is now reserved for football block parties, we best leave it undeveloped for 25 more years
Aside from the lot reserved for football block parties, over the next couple of decades I see the area between light rail and Camelback Road, from downtown to Scottsdale Road as being an area for continued densification, development, redevelopment, gentrification and renovation.

The blocks closest to light rail, to Camelback and to downtown are the most natural for this. Not everywhere of course but clusters of development are very likely wherever the opportunity is easiest or sets root.
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  #7471  
Old Posted May 18, 2015, 1:57 PM
PHXFlyer11 PHXFlyer11 is offline
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Aside from the lot reserved for football block parties, over the next couple of decades I see the area between light rail and Camelback Road, from downtown to Scottsdale Road as being an area for continued densification, development, redevelopment, gentrification and renovation.

The blocks closest to light rail, to Camelback and to downtown are the most natural for this. Not everywhere of course but clusters of development are very likely wherever the opportunity is easiest or sets root.
Interesting thought. I had a similar one this weekend.

Phoenix's skyline will never be tall, or wide. BUT, it could be impressively long. Hang with me here for a minute...

Phoenix has one thing on its side. Growth in population. Lately, that population wants to be downtown, midtown and Arcadia. If this pace of development is sustained for the next 25 years, I could see a scenario where the skyline stretches from downtown, through midtown, then makes a turn East between Indian School and Camelback to reach the Biltmore.

We've already seen a flurry of 4-6 story developments near Roosevelt. Now we are seeing some 4-8 story developments in midtown. Over time I think we see more 15-20 story apartments/condos downtown, and more 8-12 story apartments/condos in midtown.

We have also seen development along Indian School and Camelback begin to hit 4-5 stories in places. It's scattered, and not necessarily urban, but it's headed in the right direction. Over time, I think we could see even more of this is the 5-7 story range, then 8-12 stories around the Biltmore.

Of course, most of the development would be 5-10 stories, which hardly makes for an impressive skyline, however, there are always outliers. I think you'd see sporadic 8-15 story development all over.

This would make for a really impressive dense city feel. Not wide, but long, and winding. You combine this with the continued growth of Tempe's skyline and the Valley is looking pretty damn cool.

This would really be boosted if Scottsdale ever got on the Light Rail boat and took light rail to Camelback, then swung it West to meet the existing line at Camelback in Central.
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  #7472  
Old Posted May 18, 2015, 3:07 PM
poconoboy61 poconoboy61 is offline
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Originally Posted by PHXFlyer11 View Post
Interesting thought. I had a similar one this weekend.

Phoenix's skyline will never be tall, or wide. BUT, it could be impressively long. Hang with me here for a minute...

Phoenix has one thing on its side. Growth in population. Lately, that population wants to be downtown, midtown and Arcadia. If this pace of development is sustained for the next 25 years, I could see a scenario where the skyline stretches from downtown, through midtown, then makes a turn East between Indian School and Camelback to reach the Biltmore.

We've already seen a flurry of 4-6 story developments near Roosevelt. Now we are seeing some 4-8 story developments in midtown. Over time I think we see more 15-20 story apartments/condos downtown, and more 8-12 story apartments/condos in midtown.

We have also seen development along Indian School and Camelback begin to hit 4-5 stories in places. It's scattered, and not necessarily urban, but it's headed in the right direction. Over time, I think we could see even more of this is the 5-7 story range, then 8-12 stories around the Biltmore.

Of course, most of the development would be 5-10 stories, which hardly makes for an impressive skyline, however, there are always outliers. I think you'd see sporadic 8-15 story development all over.

This would make for a really impressive dense city feel. Not wide, but long, and winding. You combine this with the continued growth of Tempe's skyline and the Valley is looking pretty damn cool.

This would really be boosted if Scottsdale ever got on the Light Rail boat and took light rail to Camelback, then swung it West to meet the existing line at Camelback in Central.
It would be nice to see some mid-rise development outside of the traditional areas. Not everyone in metro Phoenix wants to live or can afford to live downtown, midtown, in the Biltmore area, Scottsdale, or Tempe. It would be nice to some urban districts develop west of the 17, in South Phoenix, and in the far East Valley. Many larger metro areas have multi family options scattered all over. I would like to see areas like Maryvale, the older downtown areas of Avondale, Peoria, Surprise, Glendale, and Buckeye with some mid-rises too. Maybe that'll come in the next 20-30 years. Who knows? Add some transit connecting these hubs and I will truly feel like metro Phoenix is starting to take shape as a large metro area.

Rent levels in the "urban" parts of metro Phoenix have started to break through the ceiling of what many middle income people consider "affordable." Giving people an affordable urban option in historically suburban places would at least give many who might want to live in a dense, walkable area a chance to do so.
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  #7473  
Old Posted May 18, 2015, 3:28 PM
PHXFlyer11 PHXFlyer11 is offline
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Not Again!

http://www.azcentral.com/story/news/...mpus/27516691/

Good to see the investment, but my guess is this is just as shitty as the rest of the bio campus from an urban standpoint.
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  #7474  
Old Posted May 18, 2015, 3:33 PM
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Good article on the "why build tall?" argument...

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  #7475  
Old Posted May 18, 2015, 3:56 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PHXFlyer11 View Post
http://www.azcentral.com/story/news/...mpus/27516691/

Good to see the investment, but my guess is this is just as shitty as the rest of the bio campus from an urban standpoint.
This Dr. Patrick Soon-Shiong guy has been around PHX for a while. He was trying to bilk Phil Gordon and the city into free land deals all the time, now he's back again. These 'super computers' he wants to build sound curiously like data centers to me, which are absolute killers for urban areas. I'm not at all excited by this announcement.
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  #7476  
Old Posted May 18, 2015, 4:29 PM
phoenixwillrise phoenixwillrise is offline
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ASU and the Doc.

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This Dr. Patrick Soon-Shiong guy has been around PHX for a while. He was trying to bilk Phil Gordon and the city into free land deals all the time, now he's back again. These 'super computers' he wants to build sound curiously like data centers to me, which are absolute killers for urban areas. I'm not at all excited by this announcement.
If Michael Crow is involved I am all in. The guy knows what he is doing and has proven it time and again and runs a hard bargain just ask Jerry C. on the USA Basketball Deal in Tempe. He is not and will not be buffaloed by anyone.
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  #7477  
Old Posted May 18, 2015, 4:37 PM
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If Michael Crow is involved I am all in. The guy knows what he is doing and has proven it time and again and runs a hard bargain just ask Jerry C. on the USA Basketball Deal in Tempe. He is not and will not be buffaloed by anyone.
I'm bummed those three lots (if its the ones im thinking) between Roosevelt point and 7th street. Are Prime for midrise housing.
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  #7478  
Old Posted May 18, 2015, 5:22 PM
PHXFlyer11 PHXFlyer11 is offline
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I'm bummed those three lots (if its the ones im thinking) between Roosevelt point and 7th street. Are Prime for midrise housing.
I agree. This will suck if it creates a big blank wall and doesn't further leverage the momentum going on 4th st & Roosevelt.
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  #7479  
Old Posted May 18, 2015, 9:28 PM
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If Michael Crow is involved I am all in. The guy knows what he is doing and has proven it time and again and runs a hard bargain just ask Jerry C. on the USA Basketball Deal in Tempe. He is not and will not be buffaloed by anyone.
Crow is good at the big picture, but let's not kid ourselves into thinking he knows anything about urbanism or how to build a city. ASU downtown, while it's been a huge positive for downtown, is pretty campus like an insular. Vintage buildings that could have been repurposed were demolished as well. We need a combination of power users like ASU with people who have the know-how to make a city that isn't miserable to actual be in. ASU has yet to show much skill in the latter category.
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  #7480  
Old Posted May 18, 2015, 10:19 PM
phoenixwillrise phoenixwillrise is offline
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Asu

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Crow is good at the big picture, but let's not kid ourselves into thinking he knows anything about urbanism or how to build a city. ASU downtown, while it's been a huge positive for downtown, is pretty campus like an insular. Vintage buildings that could have been repurposed were demolished as well. We need a combination of power users like ASU with people who have the know-how to make a city that isn't miserable to actual be in. ASU has yet to show much skill in the latter category.
Totally disagree. It's college buildings downtown I really don't care if it's insular it's there and it's alive and it brings students downtown. It is achieving it's goal. One of the main goals right now for downtown Phoenix is to get bodies down there working, studying, living, eating, attending performing arts, sporting events, conventions, seminars, governing etc. The sleeping giant needs to wake up first. As long as the architecture is decent I don't really give a rip about every single last building being insular at this point. Similar to that guy who always rants about parking garages. It's Phoenix it's 120% in the shade cars still dominate and because of that stinking heat so what is so bad about parking near what you plan on walking to?
Hell Seattle is an incredible live downtown and there are parking garages everywhere.
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