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  #1161  
Old Posted Nov 20, 2019, 4:39 PM
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Originally Posted by bhawk66 View Post
I am interested in knowing how you came up with that number. That seems very unrealistic.
I asked last night at the meeting and that's the number stated by the alderman.
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  #1162  
Old Posted Nov 20, 2019, 4:47 PM
Ricochet48 Ricochet48 is offline
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Originally Posted by Steely Dan View Post
i have some bad news for you.

according to the developer, construction is anticipated to start in mid 2022.




and thanks to all of you who attended the meeting last night and reported back here.
Yes, a guy towards the end asked about the specific time frames. They said the phase I for the reno would be done in 4-6 months (seems on point), but then the supertall would not start until 2022. Reilly initially asked Q3-Q4 and the developer pushed back and said realistically 2022.

2020 is just around the corner, so 2022 isn't THAT far away (but I do wish it was sooner just based on all the market risk we can encounter in the meantime...)
     
     
  #1163  
Old Posted Nov 20, 2019, 7:05 PM
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Ricochet, Bvic, thanks so much for sharing your newfound insight - part of what makes this forum so valuable!

All around good news IMO, on track for greatness.. slowly but surly.
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  #1164  
Old Posted Nov 20, 2019, 7:20 PM
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Originally Posted by BVictor1 View Post
^That was me.....I basically asked why the hell do people move downtown only to complain about tall building, traffic and people... Kind if the wrong place to be... Didn't realize I was animated... I was frustrated as hell after a lady complained about the height and the alderman pointed that Trump Tower was two blocks away and she was being stupid.

BTW people, the project when completed in its entirety will probably bring in about $25,000,000 in property taxes annually.
Who complains about the height of a building in the middle of Chicago? But yea well done.


Quote:
Highlight of the night was the animated dude that knew his stuff explaining that we lived in a large city designed for this. He asked if there would be a water element in the court (nope too expensive) and why it wasn't 30ft taller (great question!).
Was there ever an answer to this? (why it wasn't 30 feet taller)
     
     
  #1165  
Old Posted Nov 20, 2019, 8:43 PM
bhawk66 bhawk66 is offline
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Originally Posted by BVictor1 View Post
I asked last night at the meeting and that's the number stated by the alderman.
Gotcha. Makes more sense now coming from a politician.

Kidding aside, every single unit would have to be sold and occupied and each paying through the nose for that number to equate, imo.
     
     
  #1166  
Old Posted Nov 20, 2019, 8:50 PM
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Originally Posted by bhawk66 View Post
every single unit would have to be sold and occupied and each paying through the nose for that number to equate, imo.
if built, the individual owners of the 125 7-figure condo units will certainly be paying "through the nose" property taxes on them.

and whatever entity ends up owning the 439 rental units will also be paying a large multi-million dollar annual property tax bill.

you're also neglecting to consider the hotel component of the project. the city slaps a hefty tax on hotel rooms (much more per SF per year than a residential unit), so a very significant percentage of that $25M annual figure would be coming from the 200 hotel rooms.

and then there's the 11,000 SF of retail space that will also generate property and sales taxes.



the $25M figure is just a very rough ballpark projection subject to all kinds of unknowable variables at the present, but in a massive mixed-use project like this, the various taxes really do add up to very real money.

on the surface, it seems rosy to me, but it's not a totally inconceivable number or anything like that.
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Last edited by Steely Dan; Nov 20, 2019 at 9:19 PM.
     
     
  #1167  
Old Posted Nov 20, 2019, 9:32 PM
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^ Property tax rate in that zip code is 2.2% assessed value. So a 1.5 mil spread is approx 30K per year. Multiple by 100 units = 3 mil

Only 22 mil to go

Originally he said property tax, not Hotel or sales. But I'm sure they could spin the numbers anyway to come up with the largest possible figure.

Maybe the Alderman just did quick math on the entire building...Construction cost 1 billion, so 25 mil prop tax

Fairly out of my depth here, so I concede before we get bumped. lol

Last edited by bhawk66; Nov 20, 2019 at 9:49 PM.
     
     
  #1168  
Old Posted Nov 20, 2019, 10:54 PM
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Originally Posted by BVictor1 View Post
^That was me.....I basically asked why the hell do people move downtown only to complain about tall building, traffic and people... Kind if the wrong place to be... Didn't realize I was animated... I was frustrated as hell after a lady complained about the height and the alderman pointed that Trump Tower was two blocks away and she was being stupid.

BTW people, the project when completed in its entirety will probably bring in about $25,000,000 in property taxes annually.
$25,000,000 is very realistic. The owners of the Sears have been paying more than that every year since 2015. Granted this is a fully commercial property- but I wasn't about to examine every unit's PIN for something like Trump or the Hancock

     
     
  #1169  
Old Posted Nov 20, 2019, 11:30 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Steely Dan View Post
if built, the individual owners of the 125 7-figure condo units will certainly be paying "through the nose" property taxes on them.

and whatever entity ends up owning the 439 rental units will also be paying a large multi-million dollar annual property tax bill.

you're also neglecting to consider the hotel component of the project. the city slaps a hefty tax on hotel rooms (much more per SF per year than a residential unit), so a very significant percentage of that $25M annual figure would be coming from the 200 hotel rooms.

and then there's the 11,000 SF of retail space that will also generate property and sales taxes.



the $25M figure is just a very rough ballpark projection subject to all kinds of unknowable variables at the present, but in a massive mixed-use project like this, the various taxes really do add up to very real money.

on the surface, it seems rosy to me, but it's not a totally inconceivable number or anything like that.

Looking back through meeting notes over the years, I was told back on 04/13/15 that when completed Vista would generate approx $19,000,000 in property tax revenue annually... when Parcel O in LSE is completed, it'll generate about $4,750,000 annually...
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  #1170  
Old Posted Nov 21, 2019, 4:49 AM
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Originally Posted by BVictor1 View Post
Looking back through meeting notes over the years, I was told back on 04/13/15 that when completed Vista would generate approx $19,000,000 in property tax revenue annually... when Parcel O in LSE is completed, it'll generate about $4,750,000 annually...
I would have to dig it up but I recall $20M a year was estimated in tax revenue during the OCS propoasal.
     
     
  #1171  
Old Posted Nov 21, 2019, 1:36 PM
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“The architecture of the supertall didn’t change, but the guts that make it work in the neighborhood did,” said Ald. Brendan Reilly,


The sentiment among attendees at the meeting appeared to be largely positive about the changes, which SOAR president Deborah Gershbein described as “major enhancements.”



I took these quotes from Crain Chicago article about the building. This looks nothing but good it seem like they have a alderman and the neighborhood backing them. I would of loved them to get started on this right away but guess what ? Once OCS and 1000m is done we be seeing this thing start. CHICAGO THE FUTURE HAS ARRIVED !!!!!!
     
     
  #1172  
Old Posted Nov 21, 2019, 2:36 PM
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It will be amazing to have this done, for those of us who remember how windswept and vacant Cityfront Plaza once was.
     
     
  #1173  
Old Posted Nov 21, 2019, 3:16 PM
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Once OCS and 1000m is done we be seeing this thing start. CHICAGO THE FUTURE HAS ARRIVED !!!!!!
Ooo this is a good point I can focus on OCS and by the time it's wrapping up I can turn around and follow this beast.
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  #1174  
Old Posted Nov 21, 2019, 3:37 PM
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Originally Posted by rivernorthlurker View Post
I would have to dig it up but I recall $20M a year was estimated in tax revenue during the OCS propoasal.
$8,000,000 for OCS

$20,000,000 for Site I, J, K, L in LSE

And I've been thinking.... If this tower starts in 2022, it'll probably wrap in about 2025, or 20 years after Trump Tower started construction... That's wild.
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  #1175  
Old Posted Nov 21, 2019, 4:09 PM
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Originally Posted by bhawk66 View Post
Gotcha. Makes more sense now coming from a politician.

Kidding aside, every single unit would have to be sold and occupied and each paying through the nose for that number to equate, imo.
Does that include their cut or not?
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  #1176  
Old Posted Nov 21, 2019, 4:19 PM
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They kind went low on the parking units which is good. I was looking at the schematic and 430 spaces to cover 439 rental, 125 condos, and 200 hotel units.

They should cut the condo units. Might be hard to sell depending on the price. Hopefully it'll stay in a range of 1 to 4 million for the condos, although it would be nice if they increase the amount of market rate rentals and up the hotel units. Seems kinda low, the hotel portion.

In such a prominent location, this could be one of the greats in terms of hotels. Might even compete with Trump International nearby.

I do wonder should the economy change in the next two years, if that will affect the ratio of mixed used functionalities. I kinda see the condo portion as a boon but the hotel as a plus and if they are reasonable on the market rate rentals, that too.
     
     
  #1177  
Old Posted Nov 21, 2019, 7:31 PM
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its a nice design ...but feel like for this size of building could be something a bit more unique...its reminds me of an skinny stretched out symphony tower in atlanta to a degree..I guess been spoiled by vista

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1180_Peachtree
     
     
  #1178  
Old Posted Nov 21, 2019, 7:41 PM
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I keep coming back to this diagram:



I don't know where the second design came from, but I love it. It has a Coruscant feel to it, a very imposing permanence that I think would fit very well here, though maybe not in this PART of the city. I could easily see that making a home for itself in the soon-to-be-former Thompson Center.
     
     
  #1179  
Old Posted Nov 22, 2019, 12:45 AM
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Originally Posted by chicubs111 View Post
its a nice design ...but feel like for this size of building could be something a bit more unique...its reminds me of an skinny stretched out symphony tower in atlanta to a degree..I guess been spoiled by vista

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1180_Peachtree
I also made that that comparison in my head but I absolutely love that building. Wouldn't mind seeing something like that in Chicago.
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  #1180  
Old Posted Nov 22, 2019, 1:32 AM
rivernorthlurker rivernorthlurker is offline
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Originally Posted by BVictor1 View Post
$8,000,000 for OCS

$20,000,000 for Site I, J, K, L in LSE

And I've been thinking.... If this tower starts in 2022, it'll probably wrap in about 2025, or 20 years after Trump Tower started construction... That's wild.
Looks like you are right about OCS. No longer trusting my memories. Here's the Tribune article from 2017 - https://www.chicagotribune.com/colum...025-story.html
     
     
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