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  #101  
Old Posted Jun 15, 2024, 1:49 AM
homebucket homebucket is offline
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Originally Posted by Steely Dan View Post
So we got F500 HQs listed MSA, but how about by CBDs?

15 of Chicagoland's 30 F500 HQs are located in downtown. Chicago.

Obviously no one is coming close to touching Manhattan on this score, but it'd still be cool to see how others stack up.
This one was a bit difficult to answer, because of the SF/SJ MSA being split up, and there being three CBDs in the Bay Area. So here's the breakdown:

43 total F500 HQs in the Bay Area.

- 23 of the 43 are in the SF MSA
- 11 of the 23 are in SF's suburbs (Chevron, Concentrix, Electronic Arts, Equinix, Franklin Resources, Gilead, Lam Research, Meta, Ross, TD Synnex, Workday)
- 6 of the 23 are in SF's CBD (DoorDash, Gap, Prologis, Salesforce, Visa, Wells Fargo)
- 3 of the 23 are in SF proper but not its CBD (Airbnb, Uber, Williams-Sonoma)
- 3 of the 23 are in Oakland's CBD (Block, Clorox, PG&E)
- 20 of the 43 are in the SJ MSA
- 13 of the 20 are in SJ's suburbs (Advanced Micro Devices, Alphabet, Apple, Applied Materials, Broadcom, HP, Intel, Intuit, Intuitive Surgical, KLA, Netflix, Nvidia, ServiceNow)
- 6 of the 20 are in SJ proper but not its CBD (Cisco, Ebay, Paypal, Sanmina, Super Micro Computer, Western Digital)
- 1 of the 20 is in SJ's CBD (Adobe)
A total of 10 out of the Bay Area's 43 F500 HQs are located in a downtown. Out of those 10, 6 are in downtown SF, 3 are in downtown Oakland, and 1 is in downtown San Jose. If you consider SF the primary CBD of the Bay Area, then you could say that basically, the Bay Area has 6 of its 43 F500 HQs in downtown SF.

And if you're a visual person as I suspect most of you are, here's a nice map I put together of all the HQs. Orange for SF MSA (Go Giants!) and blue for SJ MSA (Go Sharks!).

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  #102  
Old Posted Jun 15, 2024, 3:44 PM
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^ cool! Thanks for all of that.

Chicagoland is a little simpler.

30 F500 HQs:

15 in downtown
4 in cook county burbs
8 in lake county (northern burbs)
3 in dupage/will counties (western burbs)

The 15 out in the burbs are all in forgettable coroporate sprawl wastelands primarily strung along various expressway corridors. Chicagoland never developed any serious secondary urban-format business centers (Evanston sort of, but it's pretty minor, relatively speaking).


And there are only 2 other F500 HQs in the state of Illinois:

- John Deere in Moline
- State Farm in Bloomington
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  #103  
Old Posted Jun 15, 2024, 4:52 PM
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In the OP, it says that the Los Angeles MSA has nine F500 headquarters. I didn't wanna navigate the article, but what/where are they?

I counted 8, according to another source, none of them in downtown LA, and only one in Los Angeles proper, but in the San Fernando Valley:

The Walt Disney Company - Burbank
Molina Healthcare, Inc. - Long Beach
Edison International - Rosemead (the oldest public corporation headquartered in LA County, going back to 1886; they originally were located in downtown LA)
Live Nation Entertainment, Inc. - Beverly Hills
Farmers Insurance Exchange - Woodland Hills neighborhood of Los Angeles (though for decades they used to be in Art Moderne building on Wilshire Boulevard in the Mid-Wilshire neighborhood... the building still exists)
A-Mark Precious Metals, Inc. - El Segundo
Activision Blizzard, Inc. - Santa Monica
Skechers USA, Inc. - Manhattan Beach
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  #104  
Old Posted Jun 15, 2024, 4:56 PM
N90 N90 is offline
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I thought Activision Blizzard was bought out by Microsoft and is no longer a F500 company because it’s a subsidiary now?
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  #105  
Old Posted Jun 15, 2024, 6:11 PM
homebucket homebucket is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sopas ej View Post
In the OP, it says that the Los Angeles MSA has nine F500 headquarters. I didn't wanna navigate the article, but what/where are they?

I counted 8, according to another source, none of them in downtown LA, and only one in Los Angeles proper, but in the San Fernando Valley:

The Walt Disney Company - Burbank
Molina Healthcare, Inc. - Long Beach
Edison International - Rosemead (the oldest public corporation headquartered in LA County, going back to 1886; they originally were located in downtown LA)
Live Nation Entertainment, Inc. - Beverly Hills
Farmers Insurance Exchange - Woodland Hills neighborhood of Los Angeles (though for decades they used to be in Art Moderne building on Wilshire Boulevard in the Mid-Wilshire neighborhood... the building still exists)
A-Mark Precious Metals, Inc. - El Segundo
Activision Blizzard, Inc. - Santa Monica
Skechers USA, Inc. - Manhattan Beach
According to this link I didn't see Activision listed, but I did see Chipotle listed as being HQ'd in Newport Beach. Anyways, here is the breakdown:

9 total F500 HQs in the LA MSA.
- 7 of the 9 are in LA's suburbs (A-Mark Precious Metals, Chipotle Mexican Grill, Edison International, Live Nation Entertainment, Pacific Life, Skechers USA, Walt Disney)
- 1 of the 9 is in LA proper but not its CBD (Farmers Insurance Exchange)
- 1 of the 9 is in Long Beach's CBD (Molina Healthcare)
A total of 1 out of the LA's 9 F500 HQs is located in a downtown, which is in downtown Long Beach. If you consider DTLA the primary CBD of the LA MSA, then you could say that basically, the LA MSA has 0 of its 9 F500 HQs in downtown LA.

And here's a map that I did for LA MSA:

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  #106  
Old Posted Jun 15, 2024, 6:13 PM
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Side note, it's interesting how Woodland Hills is considered part of LA proper, but Beverly Hills, Burbank, Culver City, and Glendale are not, when they're much closer and physically connected to the core.
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  #107  
Old Posted Jun 15, 2024, 6:31 PM
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Michigan is down to 17 with the loss of Kellogg’s and Lansing based Jackson Financial dropping down into the 800’s due to high interest rates after making Fortune 500 in 2023. Grand Rapids based UFP Industries made it into the Fortune 500 in 2023 as well.

Kellogg being split up stings for Battle Creek though the retention and investment into its manufacturing plants instead of moving to Ontario softens the blow keeping 1/3 of its NA workforce there. The retention of corporate presence in downtown BC & the investment in the production lines has kept this from being an unmitigated disaster for the city. Which has been struggling to capture some of the momentum of its western neighbor Kalamazoo while avoiding the fate irrelevance its eastern Jackson.

All and all MI went from having 30 Fortune 500 hq’s pre Covid to 17 today though Jackson Financial’s drop at least hasn’t lead to any job cuts which is what matters. Introspectively the economic headwinds the international situation has put on the US economy has translated to a less solid Covid recovery can’t argue there’s much of any silver lining here. Though I still do see a renewed focus on US and Western tech and manufacturing domestically specifically and in a broader sense working closer with like minded countries has the potential to put us on a firmer footing if the policy is continued.
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Last edited by Velvet_Highground; Jun 15, 2024 at 6:41 PM. Reason: Looking introspectively
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  #108  
Old Posted Jun 15, 2024, 6:36 PM
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I didn't do a map, but I think I was able to parse out all of NY's MSA and CSA.

NY-NNJ-CT CSA total: 70
NY-NNJ MSA total: 60

New York City
Manhattan: 41
Queens: 2

Long Island, NY
Hicksville (Nassau): 1
Melville (Suffolk): 1

Westchester County, NY
Armonk: 1
Purchase: 2
Tarrytown: 1

Bergen County, NJ
Franklin Lakes: 1
Teaneck: 1

Essex County, NJ
Newark: 2
Roseland: 1

Hudson County, NJ
Secaucus: 1

Mercer County, NJ (CSA)
Princeton: 1

Middlesex County, NJ
New Brunswick: 1

Morris County, NJ
Parsippany: 3

Union County, NJ
Rahway: 1

Fairfield County, CT (CSA)
Greenwich: 3
Norwalk: 2
Stamford: 4
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  #109  
Old Posted Jun 15, 2024, 6:47 PM
ChiND ChiND is offline
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Great job with the allocation, but I’m curious what exactly CSA means. Greenwich and Stamford are clear suburbs of NY and are served by commuter trains that are full every morning.
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  #110  
Old Posted Jun 15, 2024, 6:56 PM
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Originally Posted by ChiND View Post
Great job with the allocation, but I’m curious what exactly CSA means. Greenwich and Stamford are clear suburbs of NY and are served by commuter trains that are full every morning.
Fairfield County isn't considered part of the NYC MSA by the US Census Bureau, for whatever reason, and it's a well discussed issue on this board. I'm just highlighting what is attributable to the core MSA versus the CSA.
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  #111  
Old Posted Jun 15, 2024, 10:58 PM
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Thanks. That’s kind of crazy because Greenwich, Stamford, Darien, and New Canaan are core New York suburbs. They’re more integrated into the NYC metro than places in Duchess and Orange Counties are.
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  #112  
Old Posted Jun 16, 2024, 12:33 AM
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Wait …Kansas City has no F500 companies ?! News to me.
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  #113  
Old Posted Jun 16, 2024, 6:18 AM
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Originally Posted by edale View Post
6 out of 7 of Cincinnati's are downtown. The only one that isn't is Cintas, which is in the northern suburb of Mason.
Cincinnati also had Macy's until 3-4 years ago (building is now being renovated into apartments) and Chiquita Bananas (1980s tower looks sad) until about 7 years ago. The downtown had a truly ridiculous number of Fortune 500 companies for its size, plus Ashland Oil and Omnicare within walking distance across the bridge in Kentucky. I just looked it up and somehow the entire state of Kentucky is now down to just a single Fortune 500 company.

All of the remaining Fortune 500 HQ's have their secondary offices and research operations at various I-71 exit ramps, stretching from the 5/3 office at Red Bank up to P&G in Blue Ash and Mason. This has done far more to economically segregate the suburbs than any conceivable public policy. Professionals have slowly abandoned the entire west side of the county as the professional jobs have increasingly concentrated along I-71.
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  #114  
Old Posted Jun 16, 2024, 12:46 PM
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Fortune 500 head offices is a staple in city discussion out surviving skylines and skyscraper lists and I haven't the foggiest idea. Does it really make a difference?
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  #115  
Old Posted Jun 16, 2024, 2:58 PM
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Originally Posted by WhipperSnapper View Post
Fortune 500 head offices is a staple in city discussion out surviving skylines and skyscraper lists and I haven't the foggiest idea. Does it really make a difference?
It makes a huge difference. Consider all of the massive towers being built in NY.
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  #116  
Old Posted Jun 16, 2024, 3:57 PM
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Originally Posted by ChiND View Post
It makes a huge difference. Consider all of the massive towers being built in NY.
Yes and all the massive towers being built in San Jose! It would never manage to have a bigger skyline than Seattle, Atlanta, and Boston otherwise.

But seriously, pretty sure NYC would still have large towers either way. Not only since there's a lot of residential including hotel, but if you have a large number of office workers you need a lot of office space whether it's a smaller number of very large corporations or a larger number of smaller companies or subsidiaries.
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  #117  
Old Posted Jun 16, 2024, 4:26 PM
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Originally Posted by ChiND View Post
It makes a huge difference. Consider all of the massive towers being built in NY.
I'm more familiar with Canada than the US. First a few ( and being Canada there aren't all that many) have meaningless heritage head office locations. Moving on, most head offices have the offices for the 1% while the other 90% are peons paid the same or less than other peons in the city. The rest are sales staff that generate all the revenues for the corporation and make bank in kind. The size of the sales staff has nothing to do with the location of the head office. It has to do with the size of the market. So, in this Canadian specific case, NYC is going to be home to large offices with above average earners whether it's the head office for the national corporation or not.
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  #118  
Old Posted Jun 16, 2024, 4:40 PM
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I don't really think it makes a difference. SJ has the world's most valuable companies and while there are some impressive HQ (Apple), there's almost no contribution to urbanity or any real civic presence. Is core SJ really more interesting than, say, core Providence or Richmond or even Albany?

NY would have giant towers and large headcounts in an urban setting regardless.
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  #119  
Old Posted Jun 17, 2024, 5:09 PM
iheartthed iheartthed is offline
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Originally Posted by Crawford View Post
I don't really think it makes a difference. SJ has the world's most valuable companies and while there are some impressive HQ (Apple), there's almost no contribution to urbanity or any real civic presence. Is core SJ really more interesting than, say, core Providence or Richmond or even Albany?

NY would have giant towers and large headcounts in an urban setting regardless.
It probably matters over time. Will San Jose rank that high in 50 years? 100 years? Probably not. Will Manhattan? Probably.
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  #120  
Old Posted Jun 17, 2024, 5:48 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jmecklenborg View Post
Cincinnati also had Macy's until 3-4 years ago (building is now being renovated into apartments) and Chiquita Bananas (1980s tower looks sad) until about 7 years ago. The downtown had a truly ridiculous number of Fortune 500 companies for its size, plus Ashland Oil and Omnicare within walking distance across the bridge in Kentucky. I just looked it up and somehow the entire state of Kentucky is now down to just a single Fortune 500 company.

All of the remaining Fortune 500 HQ's have their secondary offices and research operations at various I-71 exit ramps, stretching from the 5/3 office at Red Bank up to P&G in Blue Ash and Mason. This has done far more to economically segregate the suburbs than any conceivable public policy. Professionals have slowly abandoned the entire west side of the county as the professional jobs have increasingly concentrated along I-71.
Macy's is the classic example of an HQ that was really meaningless, though. Cincinnati was the official HQ, sure, but all of the C-Suite, creatives, etc. were based out of NYC. I think maybe some HR, accounting, and back office type of operations were in Cincy. When they moved the HQ, it wasn't a big deal to the economy because there were minimal jobs there to begin with, and Macy's wasn't exactly a pillar of the community when it came to investing in local institutions and what not.

Quite a different scenario than if P&G or Kroger was to leave the city. The departure of either of those giants would devastate Cincinnati. Those companies have giant local workforces, including many very high-income earners that in turn support local causes. Plus, both companies prop up scores of other businesses, so there's a multiplier effect. I don't believe Macy's did much of anything for Cincy other than have a couple hundred jobs, if that. Hell, having the HQ downtown wasn't even enough for them to keep their downtown store open! Housing is probably a more productive use for the Macy's HQ building compared to how the company was using it, tbh.
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