Cities that could blend into another region

[iheartthed]

Originally Posted by Docere

St. Louis and Baltimore share some similarities. Crossroads between North and South. Similar sized cities that have both dropped in relative importance since 1900. They even both have the independent city surrounded with a suburban county with the city's name.

Prior to the Civil War, Philadelphia was the crossroads between North and South on the East Coast. Philadelphia, Cincinnati, and St. Louis served that function.

[edale]

Originally Posted by Docere

St. Louis and Baltimore share some similarities. Crossroads between North and South. Similar sized cities that have both dropped in relative importance since 1900. They even both have the independent city surrounded with a suburban county with the city's name.

Also, Maryland and Missouri were both slave states that did not secede in the Civil War. The only other slave state to not secede was Kentucky. Baltimore and St. Louis (and Cincinnati, tbh) still have that border feeling of having one foot in the south, and one foot in the north. IMO, Baltimore feels more southern than DC, despite being north of it. I can totally see the St. Louis/Baltimore comparisons.

[jmecklenborg]

Downtown Chattanooga is only about two miles from the Georgia border. There are plenty of river cities that sprawl into the opposite state, but Chattanooga is probably the only city that is almost a Kansas City.

Originally Posted by BnaBreaker

That is a damn shame about the Cincy funicular.

There were five of them, and were unusual in that the city's streetcars traveled on them:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=druwxoM6u24

While searching for the incline video just saw a link to the following drone video of Cincinnati-area railroad yards. It gives a pretty good sense of the area. In the 21st minute, the drone flies over the Decoursey Yard, which is about five miles south of DT Cincinnati in Kentucky. Here you see how the terrain becomes much hillier pretty much immediately south of the river. This is some of the best road biking close to a major city anywhere in the United States. If you live downtown, you can bike across a bridge in be in a hilly rural area very quickly. I've done tons of great 40-80 mile rides on Decoursey Pike and KY 8. You see a lot of bicycle club riders out there during the summer.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iJHMU7Xgsz0

[Velvet_Highground]

Marquette, MI & Bangor, ME while they aren’t a perfect fit and I can’t speak from first hand experience with Maine. However I would say the Western UP & Costal Maine have a similar feel. Now that I think Duluth, MN & Portland, ME might be an even better fit than Marquette & Bangor, really the Lake Superior region is pretty northern New Englandish just less rugged.

[Centropolis]

Originally Posted by edale

Also, Maryland and Missouri were both slave states that did not secede in the Civil War. The only other slave state to not secede was Kentucky. Baltimore and St. Louis (and Cincinnati, tbh) still have that border feeling of having one foot in the south, and one foot in the north. IMO, Baltimore feels more southern than DC, despite being north of it. I can totally see the St. Louis/Baltimore comparisons.

cincinnati is the prettier, more coherent version of a border city with intact architecture and a river running east-west dividing states, st. louis is like detroit and new orleans had a blackout fistfight and nobody could remember what happened.

[jbermingham123]

Definitely not similar enough to be swapped, but I've always found many neighborhoods of Pittsburgh are like a brick-built version of San Francisco... the victorian architecture, the steep hills with streets that go straight up them, the fog.. its uncanny

[xzmattzx]

Lewes, Delaware, could fit on Cape Cod, or somewhere else in coastal New England like Connecticut or Rhode Island

[BG918]

Originally Posted by wwmiv

I would throw in Asheville, Greenville, Birmingham, Louisville, and Knoxville to this discussion. Austin and KC to a lesser degree as well.

Little Rock on the west side is as hilly as parts of Pittsburgh. Very analogous to Austin with an east-west river, riverfront downtown, centralized State Capitol and contrasting hilly west side with flat east side.

[kool maudit]

Originally Posted by edale

Huh? What does that mean?

NYC feels nothing like Amsterdam, imo. I think London feels the most like NYC, minus the skyscraper canyons and what not. Maybe if London and Hong Kong had a baby, it'd be NYC.

The first time I went to Amsterdam, I got a fleeting but heavy New York impression. It's purely visual, though, and not cultural or in any way related to "feel".

It's the narrow lots. Those were a Dutch legacy to New York. It's just the way the classic vernacular housing is.

Another city pairing where there is some visual legacy but nothing in terms of feel is here on the Baltic: Stockholm and St. Petersburg.

[phone]

Originally Posted by edale

Also, Maryland and Missouri were both slave states that did not secede in the Civil War. The only other slave state to not secede was Kentucky. Baltimore and St. Louis (and Cincinnati, tbh) still have that border feeling of having one foot in the south, and one foot in the north. IMO, Baltimore feels more southern than DC, despite being north of it. I can totally see the St. Louis/Baltimore comparisons.

What about Louisville? Does it share that one foot in the south and one in the north sensibility? Or is it more firmly southern than Baltimore and St. Louis, despite similarly being the major city of a slave state that did not secede. I've never been, but my 20,000 foot impression is that it could have a "Hoosier"-style Midwest sensibility to it, with a strong familial tie to Cincinnati, alongside its more straightforwardly southern influence. But how much of that southern influence is borne of a genuine historical link, and how much of it is a johnny-come-lately Dixie obsession shared with other red parts of the north (acknowledging that Louisville itself is pretty purple)?

[iheartthed]

Originally Posted by phone

What about Louisville? Does it share that one foot in the south and one in the north sensibility? Or is it more firmly southern than Baltimore and St. Louis, despite similarly being the major city of a slave state that did not secede. I've never been, but my 20,000 foot impression is that it has a "Hoosier"-style Midwest sensibility to it, with a strong familial tie to Cincinnati, alongside its more straightforwardly southern influence. But how much of that southern influence is borne of a genuine historical link, and how much of it is a johnny-come-lately Dixie obsession shared with other red parts of the north?

It's actually weird to me that Kentucky now gets lumped in as Midwest. Kentucky seems way more solid South than Maryland or Missouri. I haven't been to Kentucky since I was a kid in the 90s, but being in that state is the first memory I have of recognizing the cultural differences in the South. I guess maybe the Cincinnati burbs would lean northern, but past that it mostly felt like a twin of West Virginia.

I've actually never really thought of Maryland as being that southern, but I can see hints of it in retrospect.

[Docere]

Of the five border states - Delaware, Maryland, West Virginia, Kentucky, Missouri - Kentucky seems far and away the most southern to me.

[edale]

Originally Posted by phone

What about Louisville? Does it share that one foot in the south and one in the north sensibility? Or is it more firmly southern than Baltimore and St. Louis, despite similarly being the major city of a slave state that did not secede. I've never been, but my 20,000 foot impression is that it could have a "Hoosier"-style Midwest sensibility to it, with a strong familial tie to Cincinnati, alongside its more straightforwardly southern influence. But how much of that southern influence is borne of a genuine historical link, and how much of it is a johnny-come-lately Dixie obsession shared with other red parts of the north (acknowledging that Louisville itself is pretty purple)?

To me, Louisville feels pretty southern. People speak with pretty thick southern accents, bourbon and horse culture dominates, with the Derby and all its over the top southern pageantry being the city's claim to fame. It seems to have fewer row houses and less brick than St. Louis or Cincy, and has a bit of a unique vernacular of shotgun style homes that look somewhat southern to me.

It does have northern influences, though. Louisville and Lexington are both pretty Catholic and have large German-American populations, which are both somewhat unique for Southern cities. It's pretty industrial and there's a big union presence. Its closest sister city is undoubtedly Cincinnati, and I think it's influenced by Cincy much more than Indianapolis or Nashville. If Cincinnati is a northern city with one foot in the south, Louisville is a southern city with one foot in the north. My take, at least.

[Steely Dan]

Originally Posted by iheartthed

It's actually weird to me that Kentucky now gets lumped in as Midwest.

Who now lumps Kentucky in as Midwest?

Louisville sometimes gets lumped in as an honorary or nearby "Midwest" city for comparison purposes, much like how Pittsburgh and Buffalo often do, but I don't think most people consider the whole state of Kentucky to be a part of the Midwest.

[iheartthed]

Originally Posted by Steely Dan

Who now lumps Kentucky in as Midwest?

Louisville sometimes gets lumped in as an honorary or nearby "Midwest" city for comparison purposes, much like how Pittsburgh and Buffalo often do, but I don't think most people consider the whole state of Kentucky to be a part of the Midwest.

I've heard Kentucky get lumped into the Midwest in media reporting. I've even heard Oklahoma and Arkansas be referred to as Midwest.

[Acajack]

Agree with everyone about Kentucky but Missouri was way more southern than I thought it would be. Always had the impression it would be more like Ohio or Indiana.

[iheartthed]

Originally Posted by Acajack

Agree with everyone about Kentucky but Missouri was way more southern than I thought it would be. Always had the impression it would be more like Ohio or Indiana.

Out of Maryland, West Virginia, Kentucky, and Missouri, I'd rank them this way from most to least southern:

Kentucky + W. Virginia (tied)
Missouri
Maryland (distant third)

I haven't been to Missouri since the early 2000s, so my memory might be a little faded but I recall detecting elements of the north, south, and west there. Kansas City feels a little western or frontier-ish to me. St. Louis was very much Rust Belt in a way that would be familiar to anyone living east of the Mississippi River and north of the Ohio River.

[Crawford]

Southeast Missouri is Deep South. It feels like Delta Mississippi. It's about as Southern as it gets.

But yeah, Missouri, overall, is more of a hybrid state, and definitely no more southern than Kentucky. SE MO is a relatively small geography.

[Steely Dan]

If America was a groin vault of east-west intersecting north-south, Missouri would be the keystone at the very center of it holding it all together.

No other state blends the 4 national macro-directionalities like MO does.

[Docere]

Originally Posted by iheartthed

Out of Maryland, West Virginia, Kentucky, and Missouri, I'd rank them this way from most to least southern:

Kentucky + W. Virginia (tied)
Missouri
Maryland (distant third)

I haven't been to Missouri since the early 2000s, so my memory might be a little faded but I recall detecting elements of the north, south, and west there. Kansas City feels a little western or frontier-ish to me. St. Louis was very much Rust Belt in a way that would be familiar to anyone living east of the Mississippi River and north of the Ohio River.

Kentucky has a larger Black population than West Virginia (albeit small for the south but not tiny like WV) and is more evangelical-dominated. I would definitely rank Kentucky ahead of WV.