NEW YORK | Empire Station District | 9 Towers (18-20 msf)| FT | FLOORS

[chris08876]

10 buildings, built on the site. They are looking at residential alternatives for 3 sites.


20 million square feet (just shy of it), double what is as-of-right.

[chris08876]

General questions:


Seqra review: because there isn’t equivalent guidance for environmental aspects.

Farley air rights… they are including those and will extinguish those (will still exist). INCORPERATING THEM into the 20 million square feet. They would do it via “transfer” via extinguishing air right, and creating them in 'site specific" way.

Macys is SEPERATE. Will go through independent zoning process…

Site A and site 2b are on block 780, … 158k sq-ft… footprints are subject to change, right now 2A is 61k , 2b is 65k . Remainder of block is side walk opening. 116k sq ft combined (2 a and 2b)

Not bothering typing for analytical framework (who cares)

[chris08876]

2nd question (15 penn)… with the data being updated, they met with DOT , historical volume data was used to establish baseline, and currently, 2018…2019… most recent data (FEIS). DOT approved methodology.

For pedestrian and projections, they work with DOT to establish baseline for transit and sidewalks. For future, they took acount growth, impact via surrounding projects/transit, transit agency projections.

East West underground corridor it is gimbels passageway. Developing site 7 and 8 would make the passageway part of it. NY transit is exploring other locations for EAST/WEST connection.

1 East west connecting corridor (no additional one) between draft and final.

With design guidelines, the skyplane exposure… design guideline overrides zoning, there are no building height limits as per most of midtown. Massing doesn’t use sky exposure plane. As long as building fits within massing illustrated in massing diagrams.

Waldram analysis used to demonstrate how building complies or fits with midtown zoning massing.

NO SKYPLANE EXPOSURE REGULATIONS with this.

non-program is included in total square feet.

[chris08876]

Masterplan will be public before the public comment period is over (they believe).

[chris08876]

Right now CB5 is like a pack of hungry lions and the Empire State Dev representatives are like folks that fell into the zoo pit.

CB5 is concerned about the increase in subway ridership that this development will result in...

Ridership increases with-action vs no-action.

[NYguy]

Originally Posted by chris08876

Right now CB5 is like a pack of hungry lions and the Empire State Dev representatives are like folks that fell into the zoo pit.

CB5 is concerned about the increase in subway ridership that this development will result in...

Ridership increases with-action vs no-action.

Forgot these yahoos were on tonight. Tuned in just in time to see "Mr. 800 ft" speaking.



• Video Link

[chris08876]

NEW YORK STATE URBAN DEVELOPMENT CORPORATION
d/b/a EMPIRE STATE DEVELOPMENT
MARCH 29, 2021 GPP AND DRAFT EIS HEARING

Meeting Information

Registration Link:

https://us02web.zoom.us/meeting/regi...O_opVtF7dVvp5K

Dial-in Information: +1 646 558 8656
Meeting ID: 847 4720 8684

[mrnyc]

penn casino anyone?

supposedly the state is sending an rfp out for this next month:



BUSINESS EXCLUSIVE
Vegas casinos could be coming to NYC
By Josh Kosman and Carl Campanile March 9, 2021 | 10:30pm


Three large casino companies are jockeying over a rare opportunity to bring a piece of the Las Vegas Strip to the Big Apple, The Post has learned.


more:
https://nypost.com/2021/03/09/vegas-...coming-to-nyc/

[TonyNYC]

penn casino anyone?

supposedly the state is sending an rfp out for this next month:




Location wise.. it would be awesome, but looks mike Manhattan is a "no fly zone" according to the Post article.

Imagine 3 casino/ hotels around Penn Plaza Area.. it would be sick!!

[NYguy]

I don’t think they will put a casino here. A better option would have been the block south of the Javits, but they’ve decided to put affirdable housing there.

Anyway, for the time being, I’ve put the casino discussion here, on one of the prime targets of the new licenses.

https://skyscraperpage.com/forum/sho...139477&page=15

[Submariner]

I sent an email to the agency regarding this project. Thanks for the link NY Guy.

The text is as follows:

"MSG/Penn Station is the structural equivalent of Ebola, AIDS and COVID joining forces and becoming a super disease, the likes of which we have never seen before. It is a disaster on an international scale; like a coverup of a nuclear power plant meltdown, except uglier, more horrifying, more embarrassing and worse for the environment. I've seen tumors more appealing than MSG, and garbage fires more inviting than Penn. 2 Penn Plaza just sits there awkwardly, looking by comparison amazing, but in isolation like a 70 year old meth-addicted hooker. I've been to several Eastern European nations still reeling from the fall of communism and I can say with confidence that every one had a substantially nicer train station. I've been to landfills and I can say with similar certainty that they look (and smell) nicer than the entire area. Why didn't the city just build plop Penn and MSG in the middle of the Fresh Kills dump (before it was capped and turned into a lovely nature sanctuary)? At least the surroundings would have matched the quality of the buildings constructed.

In short, Penn Station, MSG and 2 Penn Plaza should be demolished with prejudice and sent to the fires of Hell where they rightfully belong. In their place, Penn Station should be rebuilt in the style of Moynahan Station, or the old Penn Station that was criminally destroyed to make way for the unholy temple to excrement that was built in its place."

[TonyNYC]

"MSG/Penn Station is the structural equivalent of Ebola, AIDS and COVID joining forces and becoming a super disease, the likes of which we have never seen before. It is a disaster on an international scale; like a coverup of a nuclear power plant meltdown, except uglier, more horrifying, more embarrassing and worse for the environment. I've seen tumors more appealing than MSG, and garbage fires more inviting than Penn. 2 Penn Plaza just sits there awkwardly, looking by comparison amazing, but in isolation like a 70 year old meth-addicted hooker. I've been to several Eastern European nations still reeling from the fall of communism and I can say with confidence that every one had a substantially nicer train station. I've been to landfills and I can say with similar certainty that they look (and smell) nicer than the entire area. Why didn't the city just build plop Penn and MSG in the middle of the Fresh Kills dump (before it was capped and turned into a lovely nature sanctuary)? At least the surroundings would have matched the quality of the buildings constructed.

In short, Penn Station, MSG and 2 Penn Plaza should be demolished with prejudice and sent to the fires of Hell where they rightfully belong. In their place, Penn Station should be rebuilt in the style of Moynahan Station, or the old Penn Station that was criminally destroyed to make way for the unholy temple to excrement that was built in its place."



What exactly are you trying to say here... You don't like Penn Station and MSG?

LOL! (:

[NYguy]

Originally Posted by Submariner

I sent an email to the agency regarding this project. Thanks for the link NY Guy.

The text is as follows:

"MSG/Penn Station is the structural equivalent of Ebola, AIDS and COVID joining forces and becoming a super disease, the likes of which we have never seen before. It is a disaster on an international scale; like a coverup of a nuclear power plant meltdown, except uglier, more horrifying, more embarrassing and worse for the environment. I've seen tumors more appealing than MSG, and garbage fires more inviting than Penn. 2 Penn Plaza just sits there awkwardly, looking by comparison amazing, but in isolation like a 70 year old meth-addicted hooker. I've been to several Eastern European nations still reeling from the fall of communism and I can say with confidence that every one had a substantially nicer train station. I've been to landfills and I can say with similar certainty that they look (and smell) nicer than the entire area. Why didn't the city just build plop Penn and MSG in the middle of the Fresh Kills dump (before it was capped and turned into a lovely nature sanctuary)? At least the surroundings would have matched the quality of the buildings constructed.

In short, Penn Station, MSG and 2 Penn Plaza should be demolished with prejudice and sent to the fires of Hell where they rightfully belong. In their place, Penn Station should be rebuilt in the style of Moynahan Station, or the old Penn Station that was criminally destroyed to make way for the unholy temple to excrement that was built in its place."

I"m sure they'll get a kick of of that. But I'm sure what they would tell you, if they took it seriously, is that this isn't about rebuilding Penn Station, but the expansion of Penn Station south.

[NYguy]

I was having second thoughts about posting this, but I’m hoping the big boys (and girls) here could handle it without getting into politics.


https://nypost.com/2021/03/13/activi...tion-plan/amp/

Activist says she’s been bullied while fighting Cuomo’s ‘disastrous’ Penn Station plan





By Dana Kennedy
March 13, 2021

A longtime community activist says she’s been bullied by Gov. Cuomo’s machine on his multi-billion dollar Penn Station redevelopment, which she says includes a “disastrous” under-the-radar plan for 10 skyscrapers ringing the transit hub.

Layla Law-Gisiko, chair of Community Board 5’s land use, housing and zoning committee, and others told The Post that Cuomo snuck a Trojan horse into his sweeping overhaul of Penn Station.

On June 30, with the city in the throes of the pandemic, state officials quietly unveiled a plan within a plan, called the Empire Station Complex, to allow Vornado Realty and other unnamed developers to build 10 tall towers that would purportedly generate revenues to pay for the Penn Station makeover.

The towers, including five so-called “supertalls” that would rise up to 1,300 feet, and two over 900 feet, would surround the 34th Street train station in a two-block radius.

Opponents say the development is being overseen only by state agencies with no oversight from the city or the state legislature.

When The Post asked a spokesman for the Empire Station complex about oversight, he pointed to a 13-member “Community Advisory Committee” that includes local elected officials, community board members and other stakeholders, and added that the agency is “also working closely with NYC agencies.”

That committee, however, is advisory only and cannot stop the plan, sources told the Post.

Law-Gisiko said that state Empire State Development Corp. officials tried for months to block her from participating in the panel. She’s only been permitted to attend recently, under pressure from her board leadership.

An ESD spokesman confirmed to the Post there would be no ULURP, or Uniform Land Use Review Procedure, a standardized process for public review of projects in the city.

“ Everyone who gets to weigh in on this project was appointed by the governor,” claimed Law-Gisiko.

Cuomo shrewdly used a General Project Plan – or GPP – to override the need for a city review by labeling the Penn station area a “slum,” members of both Community Boards 4 and 5 told the Post.

Cuomo floated a similar plan in 2018 that was shot down by the city. This time, with the GPP, he’s bypassed the city altogether and the project is moving ahead.

Mayor Bill De Blasio called it a “petty power play” in 2018, but offered no response to the latest move when The Post called his press office.

” If you think you hate Penn Station right now, wait until these buildings get built,” the Paris-born Law-Gisiko said. “It’s going to be horrible. It’s going to be very congested, way more than it is now, and very dark. All those buildings will make you feel that you’re in a permanent twilight.

“And if you think you love the Empire State Building give it a hug now, because it’s going to disappear behind all these new bland tall box buildings.”

Lynn Ellsworth, head of the Alliance for a Human Scale City, a network of more than 100 civic and community groups across the five boroughs, said she was furious at what she calls “Hudson Yards 2.0.”

“They sneaked these towers in as part of a sweetheart deal for Vornado,” Ellsworth told the Post. “Cuomo’s big plan is not about fixing Penn Station. This is a deal for Vornado to build speculative office towers. Vornado already has signs up in the area saying ‘Vornado Campus.’ It’s not a campus. It’s our city.”

There are SEVERAL things wrong with this, but I’ll just get into a few things.


- First off, the charade is over. She is, and always has been an “activist” who is just against tall buildings.

- Developers should demand she be removed from her post on the land-use committee, as she obviously cannot be fair.

- This is a general project plan (GPP), not at all unusual for the state, and the process is the same, regardless of whoever is governor at the time.

- The CB is ALWAYS advisory, even in the city run ULURP process. The difference is that the city council can’t use the CB as an excuse to shake down the developers.

- For what reason would they have to “bully” her?

- I can no longer take this woman seriously anymore, regardless of whatever proposal comes through her CB.

[Visionist]

She looks like she hasn't smiled in years, much less experienced an orgasm.

Some people love to wallow in self imposed misery.

[Crawford]

A Manhattan NIMBY doesn't like new development. Truly shocking.

[JMKeynes]

THE FINANCIAL CAPITAL OF THE WORLD!!

[JDRCRASH]

She may live in the area, but her complaints sure do sound like a NIMBY from suburbia.

[NYguy]

Originally Posted by JDRCRASH

She may live in the area, but her complaints sure do sound like a NIMBY from suburbia.

She is the chair of the Land-Use Committee of Community Board 5. She is supposed to judge projects on the merits, and steer the Board in that direction. If she cannot be impartial, she should step down. Obviously, no one joins a CB because they want more development. But this CB covers most of midtown, where most of the tall skyscraper proposals that need approval must come before the board. If you start out being so obviously anti-skyscraper development, you shouldn't be there, advisory or not. Because sometimes there are consequences to these decisions. And yes, she's smart enough to know what the state process is, and why she doesn't get a say.

https://www.cb5.org/cb5m/committees/...ousing-zoning/

And developer that must submit proposals before that committee should ask that she recuse herself, or step down. At least the other NIMBYs use some type of pretense for their objection to development. Whining that you're being bullied because you can't get your way is a step too far.

[chris08876]

^^^^^

Some of those Community Board meetings, IDK why developers even bother making nice slide sets or even trying to present information. It seems like its mostly negative all the time with the Community Boards. They are negative even before the meeting started. Their minds have been made up a long time ago.

Originally Posted by NYguy

I was having second thoughts about posting this, but I’m hoping the big boys (and girls) here could handle it without getting into politics.



- First off, the charade is over. She is, and always has been an “activist” who is just against tall buildings.

- Developers should demand she be removed from her post on the land-use committee, as she obviously cannot be fair.

- This is a general project plan (GPP), not at all unusual for the state, and the process is the same, regardless of whoever is governor at the time.

- The CB is ALWAYS advisory, even in the city run ULURP process. The difference is that the city council can’t use the CB as an excuse to shake down the developers.

- For what reason would they have to “bully” her?

- I can no longer take this woman seriously anymore, regardless of whatever proposal comes through her CB.

Yeah I took a gander at her twitter page. Man... its clear what her agenda is.

And its one thing to be fair, to look at a project in a way that would benefit the area, no doubt... but with a twitter like that, there is no impartial behavior.

Even before proposals are put through.

Did you get a chance to see the mockery of a beautiful RAMSA proposal the other day? Oh... what a sacrilege.

They would rather have this than a RAMSA. At that point, they lose credibility.