CHICAGO | Highrise Projects & Construction, v7

[k1052]

Originally Posted by ardecila

^ Yeah I'm not sure how the state can "confer" FAR onto a private owner, it may need to be done like some of the big projects in NYC where they create a state-owned "Prairie State Development Corporation" to formally be the developer, with a turnover to the private partner after construction.

I did not intend to imply that it would not be convoluted.

[Jibba]

369 W Grand

[harryc]

^^^ Superb shots Jibba .

[southoftheloop]

Originally Posted by Jibba

369 W Grand

Not a bad glass box!

[Toasty Joe]

Originally Posted by southoftheloop

Not a bad glass box!

I believe they are painting the larger fins dark gray/black, or installing dark siding? At least seemed that way from the rendering (photo 1) in this YIMBY article, and photo 5 looks like they might have been testing paint in the bottom of the left fin? https://chicagoyimby.com/2020/12/the...n-chicago.html

[ardecila]

Originally Posted by k1052

I did not intend to imply that it would not be convoluted.

LOL, of course. I'm not sure this has been done in Chicago before, though. The state has typically shied away from meddling in Chicago development projects, apart from the universities and miscellaneous state gov't offices. Now with Thompson Center and One Central, they seem to be stepping in big-time, and not necessarily in a good way.

[Tom In Chicago]

Originally Posted by ardecila

Jahn's proposal is far too slender for the open-concept offices that tech companies want.

What about casino + hotel? Or casino + hotel + apartments?

. . .

[Bonsai Tree]

Originally Posted by Tom In Chicago

What about casino + hotel? Or casino + hotel + apartments?

. . .

A casino in the loop? No thanks.

Also, there is no way apartments work here unless they have a similar market to block 37. If the Thompson center gets demolished, we are 100% going to see block 37 2.0, except without the massive shopping center. And then in 20 years, we'll all be crying about how we lost an architectural icon for some 40 story pile of garbage buildings.

[chicubs111]

The unfortunate reality is Chicago tends not to rise to the occasion with big blank slate developments...they often get watered down and largely under perform there potential... Thompson center is the Loops last big chance of having something special built... Block 37 was a flop ... High end hotel/apts, with casino or some theatre component could be the what the loop needs!

[LouisVanDerWright]

Originally Posted by ardecila

^ Yeah I'm not sure how the state can "confer" FAR onto a private owner, it may need to be done like some of the big projects in NYC where they create a state-owned "Prairie State Development Corporation" to formally be the developer, with a turnover to the private partner after construction.

You can apply for zoning changes on property you don't own with the consent of the current owner. The buyer will enter into a contract for sale with the state that has a zoning contingency. Once the city approves zoning satisfactory to the buyer, then the sale will close.

[BuildThemTaller]

Originally Posted by chicubs111

The unfortunate reality is Chicago tends not to rise to the occasion with big blank slate developments...they often get watered down and largely under perform there potential... Thompson center is the Loops last big chance of having something special built... Block 37 was a flop ... High end hotel/apts, with casino or some theatre component could be the what the loop needs!

Lakeshore East, Central Station, Old Town Park, the 78, and others beg to differ. I'm not sure what you mean by "big, blank slate development" anyway. This is a city block in the heart of the Loop, but it's just a block.

[ardecila]

Originally Posted by LouisVanDerWright

You can apply for zoning changes on property you don't own with the consent of the current owner. The buyer will enter into a contract for sale with the state that has a zoning contingency. Once the city approves zoning satisfactory to the buyer, then the sale will close.

No, my point is that the city would never approve the kind of zoning that the state envisions for this site. If it were up to Brendan Reilly, he'd force all kinds of design changes and reduce the intensity of use.

The state needs a vast sum of money from the sale, probably well above what the market price would normally be for downtown land. Since the market price already reflects the zoning that a developer could reasonably get, the only way the state can get an above-market price is to flex their state power and override the city's zoning power.

The rub is that private developers don't have state power to override local zoning. Usually in these kinds of state-led redevelopments, there is some legal scheme that makes the state the actual developer on paper until the new building is completed, maybe longer than that if the deal is set up as a ground lease.

Of course, this is all hypothetical and assumes developers will be lining up to get their hands on this site to build Chicago's version of 1WTC or One Vanderbilt. But it may not have as much value as the state thinks it does.

[chicubs111]

a full city block in the heart of loop in the "theatre district" does not come by often so its a pretty big deal as was block 37. Mayor Daley first envisioned block 37 of something ala a smaller Rockefeller center type vibe...he wanted it to be a signature destination that tourists would like to visit and energize the core of the loop... obviously that didn't happen to any degree close to what he expected. Many of the proposals and designs were very weak to begin with... I think after years went by the city just got frustrated and tired of looking at an empty block in center of loop and went with anything that could get shovels in the ground quickest.

[west-town-brad]

Originally Posted by ardecila

No, my point is that the city would never approve the kind of zoning that the state envisions for this site. If it were up to Brendan Reilly, he'd force all kinds of design changes and reduce the intensity of use.

The state needs a vast sum of money from the sale, probably well above what the market price would normally be for downtown land. Since the market price already reflects the zoning that a developer could reasonably get, the only way the state can get an above-market price is to flex their state power and override the city's zoning power.

The rub is that private developers don't have state power to override local zoning. Usually in these kinds of state-led redevelopments, there is some legal scheme that makes the state the actual developer on paper until the new building is completed, maybe longer than that if the deal is set up as a ground lease.

Of course, this is all hypothetical and assumes developers will be lining up to get their hands on this site to build Chicago's version of 1WTC or One Vanderbilt. But it may not have as much value as the state thinks it does.

so the State of IL is subservient to Brendan Reilly's aldermanic prerogative? that's funny.

[mark0]

This being Chicago and Illinois they will probably sell at the absolute bottom of the commercial real estate meltdown and get even less than than what it's worth and the deal will be loaded up with probably all kinds of legal requirements to upgrade the mass transit for the winning developer (which will be some REIT from NYC or Houston) that will cost taxpayers more than the sale nets. The site will languish for years and ultimately become some blue glass boring box and we will lose an invaluable icon of 20th century architecture and our history while all the elderly IIT trained box drafters will cheer the newest box. It might not even be blue, it could even be blue green.

This city and state need new blood, new thinking and a regime change like nowhere else and badly.

[marothisu]

Don't quote me on this yet, but I think a new City Target is going to go into the new Bentham condo building at LaSalle & Erie. Building permit was issued for the buildout of a store there and the architect is the main architect who handles basically all the Targets in the US.

[k1052]

Originally Posted by Bonsai Tree

Also, there is no way apartments work here unless they have a similar market to block 37. If the Thompson center gets demolished, we are 100% going to see block 37 2.0, except without the massive shopping center. And then in 20 years, we'll all be crying about how we lost an architectural icon for some 40 story pile of garbage buildings.

I'm gonna have to disagree with this. The NW corner of the loop has improved in recent years especially since the riverwalk went in. There are a few more bars and restaurants of interest and perhaps most importantly it is a few minute ride into the west loop. Indeed a number of rental projects have gone up in this area and AFAIK they did not have any trouble leasing up. Also the walk into River North and all it has to offer is pretty short.

[Toasty Joe]

The Loop has so much potential to become a more vibrant and residential "neighborhood." Definitely feels like some vibrancy is creeping in from the success of the Riverwalk. Pre-covid my coworkers and I would grab after-work drinks at random bars and restaurants around the Loop quite often, seems like there was always somewhere new to explore. The city needs to definitely figure out a new formula now due to the pandemic, but they've also (hopefully) realized that the Loop deserves better than just the after-work drink crew and tourists who shop at Forever 21 and go to Hamilton. That's why the Thompson Center needs to be a home run residential & entertainment catalyst (however that may come), which is a heavy burden made heavier by fucking up Block 37. Hopeful that the success of West Loop proves there is a huge appetite for an urban living/dining/office scene, and the Loop already has an amazing building stock at the literal center of our transportation system!

[Toasty Joe]

I know we can't really compare to NYC anymore, but Grand Hyatt redevelopment came out with their design today. It looks amazing, something like the Thompson Center location could use, and with a 500-key hotel on top. Wish we had some grander aspirations and more of this instead of 5.5 simultaneous mega-developments trying to get traction and coming up short of inspiring.

https://skyscraperpage.com/forum/sho...&postcount=760

[BVictor1]

23 South Sangamon

-DX 5 Zoning

-The project is now 1 tower instead of two

-Approx 80 Condo units vs 370 rental

-Average unit 2,200 sq ft

-19 stories

-30 to 40% presales

-They'd like to begin construction early 2022 with completion late 2023 or early 2024.