PHILADELPHIA | Lowrise/General Developments Thread

[TonyTone]

Originally Posted by mcgrath618

The specs sheet was just sent out earlier this month. So five years, give or take a year.

The wires they're putting up will be compatible with both pans and poles, meaning that the routes can continue running even as modernization is taking place. It also means that trolleys like the K cars and the PCCs can continue running indefinitely.

Re 23 running down 10th/11th:
The 23 will only succeed if it connects with another trolley line (because the trolleys need to be stored and maintained somewhere) and the 15 is the obvious candidate. Run trains from Germantown to the Frankford and Girard loop via Girard ave. You could further extend this down Delaware later.

On Wikipedia it says the 23 started in Center city.... That confused me because where was the barn for the trolleys in Center city when they were active?

[Nanyika]

I operated both PCCs and LRVs in San Francisco for 29 years. Both types of vehicles used the same overhead wires. The PCCs (mostly acquired from Philadelphia) and other historic streetcars are the workhorses on Market Street since they stop at every corner.

But the articulated LRVs, of course, are most efficient — with high-level platforms, center-door boarding, fares on an honor system, ability to change the traffic lights in their favor (changing to green for LRVs approaching intersections), and major portions of the routes underground or on dedicated rights of way. It would be wonderful if Philadelphia could establish a similar system — for example, on the wide cross-town avenues like Washington Ave., Girard, Lehigh, with high-level stations every three blocks or so.

[mcgrath618]

Originally Posted by Busy Bee

How does this work exactly? Also I always thought that pantograph compatible OCS was also attractive because it always a more efficient electric standard. Is this true and if so, how would an improved transmission be compatible with poles, their trolley wheels and the older vehicles motors?

They make compatible systems. The Illinois Railway Museum supports both pan and pole operations, for example.

Pantographs are better, but we can't just rip the band-aid off. It'll be better to slowly transition, line by line.

All that matters insofar as motors is that the overhead lines run at the same 600 V DC.

Originally Posted by TonyTone

On Wikipedia it says the 23 started in Center city.... That confused me because where was the barn for the trolleys in Center city when they were active?

The 23 historically ran from 10th/11th and Oregon to Chestnut Hill West via 10th/11th and Germantown Avenue. At different points in its history it used the Germantown Carhouse (since gone) and the Luzerne Carhouse (not accessible by trolley anymore).

[3rd&Brown]

On another note and my favorite topic (highway cleaning), I was pleasantly surprised when I drove back from the shore on Tuesday morning that there was a highway cleaning crew on 95S somewhere around Academy Road.

The "crew" consisted of 6 vehicles. 5 pick up trucks (presumably for large debris) of course not stopping for anything and 1 street sweeper. All clustered together in line on the shoulder of the road. So when PennDot says it spends a disproportionate amount on street sweeping in this region, remember it's decisions like these that inflate that number and do nothing to improve outcomes.

We don't need a street sweeping crew to consist of 6 trucks. It should be just like the crews I see everytime I'm on the turnpike or in this case, what I passed just minutes prior on the PA/NJ Turnpike Bridge. 1 sweeper, 1 truck.

I swear to god whoever runs on the ground operations in this region probably has a half formed brain.

[summersm343]

A New Approach for a Familiar Lot on the Delaware River

Current site:




Previous plans for the site:


New plans for the site:

709 N. Penn St. juts out onto Pier 35 1/2.

Back in 2015, we wrote about this very lot, as it had changed hands. At the time, plans called for a 50-unit townhome complex, with the homes lining the water, and a drive aisle in the middle, providing access to two-car garages. The plans and land were marketed for sale, and they sold again back in 2018, when 41 townhomes were to be developed by Herrco Builders, according to an article from the Inquirer.

The site has sat untouched for several years, but it seems as if things may soon be afoot for this property. According to a listing, the site is not only available for sale for $15.5M, but plans have been submitted for review to CDR as of early April. What’s coming our way will be 48 unit building on the west end of the site, with 12 townhomes and a separate commercial building filling out the rest of the peninsula. This is a by right project and the listing states that zoning permits should be available soon.

Read/view more here:
https://www.ocfrealty.com/naked-phil...delaware-river

[summersm343]

Festival Pier development update from NakedPhilly

Current progress:


Project rendering:


https://www.ocfrealty.com/naked-phil...delaware-river

[summersm343]

Ex-Merck CEO Ken Frazier and his coalition of business leaders plan to hire or promote 1M Black workers

Read/view more here:
https://www.inquirer.com/business/ke...-20220601.html

[TonyTone]

Originally Posted by summersm343

Ex-Merck CEO Ken Frazier and his coalition of business leaders plan to hire or promote 1M Black workers

Read/view more here:
https://www.inquirer.com/business/ke...-20220601.html

[TonyTone]

Originally Posted by summersm343

A New Approach for a Familiar Lot on the Delaware River

Current site:




Previous plans for the site:


New plans for the site:






Read/view more here:
https://www.ocfrealty.com/naked-phil...delaware-river

That last house on the water Is gonna be the most expensive one.

[TonyTone]

Originally Posted by mcgrath618

The 23 historically ran from 10th/11th and Oregon to Chestnut Hill West via 10th/11th and Germantown Avenue. At different points in its history it used the Germantown Carhouse (since gone) and the Luzerne Carhouse (not accessible by trolley anymore).

Ahh I see, now I guess no one had the foresight to keep any of the land or the buildings that the Trolley Barns previously had.

At least they kept majority of the Track on the street.

Also I always wondered this but on smaller streets like 10th why not run the trolley right up against the curb? Wouldn't this help it run a little better then in the middle of the street?

[TonyTone]

SEE THE FREIGHT TRACKS THAT COULD BECOME THE INTERBOROUGH EXPRESS

https://untappedcities.com/2022/05/3...yn-and-queens/

This is how we need to be thinking in Philly

Top contenders where this could work

23rd St Rail Lines.

Parkway Viaduct.

Lehigh Elevated Lines.

We have plenty of rail lines around the area that could be reused instead of letting sit idle.

[mcgrath618]

The TfL is really who we should be basing our model on. The MTA is still even considering BRT for the Interborough Express (which is lunacy).

An idea I've had that I'm now pushing is to essentially switch the Manayunk/Norristown Line to the PRR ROW from Spring Mill to Center City. The worst curve on SEPTA right now is the curve just west of Ivy Ridge, and it would be completely eliminated. The existing Reading ROW could then become the Schuylkill River Trail from Manayunk to Conshohocken. Norristown bound trains (along with any potential Amtrak from Philly to Reading) now head west from Suburban along the Main Line and then take the Cynwyd (now effectively the Norristown Line) Line to get there.

SEPTA would then have a large stretch of unused ROW from Manayunk to 16th Street Interlocking (where the existing Manayunk/Norristown Line joins the Main). Two things would then be done:

1) The CHW would be completely rerouted at 16th to fill the void left by the Manayunk/Norristown Line. Use the existing bridge (or build a new one) to allow for a flyover for outbound trains. What you've now done is kill two birds with one stone; the CHW is no longer tied to Amtrak and can run with the < 30 Min headways it was meant to support, and now 16th is not nearly as congested as it once was (because of the flyover).

2) Dig 1/4 mile of tunnel from Broad to the existing Manayunk/Norristown ROW under Clearfield Street and run Broad Street Line trains from Manayunk to South Philly via the Broad Street Line. Manayunk and the Northwest finally get a subway/elevated line, and the express tracks of the BSL are finally used to their full potential (in case you're wondering, there is space for a flyover just north of Lehigh).

[Busy Bee]

Originally Posted by mcgrath618

The MTA is still even considering BRT for the Interborough Express (which is lunacy).

To be fair they're only doing that to create the allusion they are doing a thorough alternatives analysis. Don't be fooled, they intend on metro frequency conventional rail (like an Overground, like a Crossrail). I could go into this further but this is a Philly thread.

[DeltaNerd]

We definitely should be separating the CHW line from the NEC regardless of what happens.

To add to the list of reusing rail what about the Delaware Ave trolleys?
Though wouldn't it need to connect to Market, Arch or Spring Garden for best ridership potential

Washington Ave as well

[Urbanthusiat]

Not totally dead... but doesn't seem totally alive either.

Comcast Spectacor’s Fusion Arena in South Philadelphia pivots from esports venue to multi-use facility

[TonyTone]

Originally Posted by DeltaNerd

We definitely should be separating the CHW line from the NEC regardless of what happens.

To add to the list of reusing rail what about the Delaware Ave trolleys?
Though wouldn't it need to connect to Market, Arch or Spring Garden for best ridership potential

Washington Ave as well

It really annoys me how much the city underutilizes Spring Garden.

I think its one of the strips that contends with cities like NYC and the like, just the vibe of SG makes it a good strip.

Don't even get me started on Girard that and Washington Ave should have had a subway since the first one was built.

[Justin7]

Originally Posted by cardeza

What I notice on this forum is that when politicians that fit one profile do something its viewed as visionary, thoughtful and earnest- when politicians who fit a different profile do stuff (these would be categories that cover the bulk of City Council) it is always about stupidity, greed, ignorance or flat out corruption. It's very interesting.

Do you mean the profile of being federally indicted for accepting bribes or is there something else you're trying to say?

I understand this is an anonymous forum, so you obviously don't need to answer, but I've been wondering for some time: Do you have a relationship with anyone on city council, professional or otherwise?

[thoughtcriminal]

Originally Posted by thoughtcriminal

I hate it when people ask about the status of projects that have been seemingly been shelved - if there were any news, we would hear about it, right?
Except I'm going to ask - does anyone know the status of the two buildings that were supposed to be built in the stadium complex - the Pattison Place office building and the Philadelphia Fusion arena? I went on both websites to see if there was any news, but it looked as though the websites hadn't been updated in a while.
https://pattisonplaceoffices.com/
https://fusionarenaphilly.com/
I don't think at this point that you can blame the pandemic for a lack of construction activity, at least not directly. I could see if they decided not to build Pattison Place because the need for offices has softened because companies are letting employees work from home for a lot of the time, but that's different than saying that construction is being held up because of the pandemic.
anyway, just curious if there's any news on these projects.

Update on the Fusion Arena in the Sports Complex. They are apparently "reimagining" it. It will still host the Fusion, but it will mostly function as a multipurpose facility. No timetable on its construction in this article, but at least the project still appears to be on the table.
Article behind paywall.
https://www.bizjournals.com/philadel...Pos=1#cxrecs_s

[mcgrath618]

Originally Posted by Justin7

Do you mean the profile of being federally indicted for accepting bribes or is there something else you're trying to say?

I understand this is an anonymous forum, so you obviously don't need to answer, but I've been wondering for some time: Do you have a relationship with anyone on city council, professional or otherwise?

Maybe he meant the profile of being convicted for corruption along with Johnny Doc.

[cardeza]

Originally Posted by Justin7

Do you mean the profile of being federally indicted for accepting bribes or is there something else you're trying to say?

I understand this is an anonymous forum, so you obviously don't need to answer, but I've been wondering for some time: Do you have a relationship with anyone on city council, professional or otherwise?

No that wasn't what I was saying. Inferences of corruption and stupidity have been leveled at the majority of the members of council on this forum. The few exceptions happen to fit a certain profile. And the determining factor isnt whether or not one has been indicted. In fact, one member of council that was convicted has barely ever been mentioned in an insulting manner, in fact his name isn't mentioned at all. But there has been plenty negative to say about Clarke, Johnson, Sanchez, Gaithier, Brooks, etc. If your ire is truly focused on the criminal element in Council than your # target should have been Henon- who was actually convicted of wrongdoing. It's funny because the guy who was taking bribes was never one of the names accused on here of being on the take.