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  #41  
Old Posted Dec 7, 2022, 10:10 PM
CaliNative CaliNative is offline
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Originally Posted by Steely Dan View Post
if cancun's beach is artificial, they did a spectacular job with it. i never would've guessed that.

and i'd never call the irridescent turquoise waters of the caribbean "crappy", but to each their own.


source: https://www.traveloffpath.com/over-7...h-aerial-view/


i totally agree that cancun feels like a very "made-up" place (ie. not a real city), but i get the appeal it has for americans just looking for a warm weather beach to escape to in the cold seaon.

and for those travelers looking for something more "real", at least the nearby yucatan is filled with loads of mayan ruins that do offer something of real experiential substance.
Miami Beach south with higher crime risk.
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  #42  
Old Posted Dec 7, 2022, 10:15 PM
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Hmm, maybe it's just the circles I run in but literally everybody I know is dying to visit Mexico City or have frequented there multiple times, even looking to live there temporarily. It's definitely the rage at the moment.
When visiting Mexico, are you concerned about crime? I am scared to go to Tijuana and I am just an hour away. Plus the time it takes to cross back into the U.S. at the border. You can be in a choking line of car fumes for hours. And a constant line of steet merchants trying to sell you junk while you are stuck in line.
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  #43  
Old Posted Dec 7, 2022, 10:32 PM
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Originally Posted by CaliNative View Post
Miami Beach south with higher crime risk.
What crime do foreigners experience in Cancún? I understand they just stayed trapped in those resorts and then take a shuttle to the airport.

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Originally Posted by CaliNative View Post
When visiting Mexico, are you concerned about crime? I am scared to go to Tijuana and I am just an hour away. Plus the time it takes to cross back into the U.S. at the border. You can be in a choking line of car fumes for hours. And a constant line of steet merchants trying to sell you junk while you are stuck in line.
That's a very generic question. One in Los Angeles might feel terrified walking around Skid Row but completely fine in Beverly Hills. Tourists usually stay in upmarket and safe areas. And if they're more experimented, they can go outside those bubbles but they're usually more street smart and know how to identify dangerous places.
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  #44  
Old Posted Dec 7, 2022, 10:37 PM
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Originally Posted by Crawford View Post
IMO, Americans pick really weird places in Mexico. They love San Miguel, and basically ruined the town, which wasn't that great to begin with, and ignore nearby Guanajuato, which is like 100x better. They go crazy for Cancun, which is just a 1970's govt. project to put hotels on artitifical beaches on the crappy Gulf. Really cool Pacific beaches in Ixtapa-Zihuatanego and tons of unspoiled beach towns in Oaxaca and Chiapas are ignored. Now Mexico City is the New Berlin, when there's basically one neighborhood with that feel, and most of Mexico City is endless functional 1970's concrete blocks and quasi-freeways.
I'm not going to disclose my favorite beach town in Mexico because I don't want any of you to know about it.

But that being said, allegiance or preferences to Mexico's beaches is very regional among Americans. If it were closer, Cabo would be my number 1, but it's incredibly difficult to get to from the East Coast (of the US).

I think West Coast people tend to go to Cabo and Baja California, generally. East Coast people tend to go to the Yucatan Peninsula and Quintana Roo, and folks from the middle of the country can go to either, though they're more likely to than others to go the the non-Baja Pacific beaches (i.e. PV, Sayulita, etc).

It's really just about flight patterns. Everytime I consider trying to go to PV or Cabo, it's just a huge pain in the ass, even from NYC. I'm not connecting to go to a Mexican beach for 4 days.
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  #45  
Old Posted Dec 7, 2022, 11:16 PM
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Originally Posted by 3rd&Brown View Post
I think West Coast people tend to go to Cabo and Baja California, generally. East Coast people tend to go to the Yucatan Peninsula and Quintana Roo, and folks from the middle of the country can go to either, though they're more likely to than others to go the the non-Baja Pacific beaches (i.e. PV, Sayulita, etc).

It's really just about flight patterns. Everytime I consider trying to go to PV or Cabo, it's just a huge pain in the ass, even from NYC. I'm not connecting to go to a Mexican beach for 4 days.
as far as mexican beach towns go, JFK and EWR both have nonstop flights to the 3 mexico biggies: Cancun, Puerto Vallarta, and Cabo, but that's it.

i wonder if bos-wash people are more likely to vacation down on the carribean islands as opposed to mexico because JFK has a shit-ton of nonstop flights to seemingly every last little pissant carribean island.

from a midwest perspective, cancun seems to be destination #1 BY FAR down that way, as i'ts pretty much due south with 8 bazilllion non-stop flights from every major airport in the region.

cabo's airline reach to the midwest/east coasdt is much more limited than cancun's. having been to cabo a number of times, i can fully attest to the fact that a giant share of the gringo tourists there are californians, which makes total sense as it's a pretty short flight for them.
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  #46  
Old Posted Dec 7, 2022, 11:51 PM
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Originally Posted by Crawford View Post
Right. Even now, the average American knows nothing about Mexico City but "huge Mexican city".

Non-Mexicans typically visit Mexico for beaches, rainforests and sun. Mexico City has none of this, and isn't near any of this. There's kind of an urbanite/hipster/foodie recognition of Mexico City, but comparatively niche and recent.

Also, I feel most of the recent recognition of Mexico City is pretty dumb. It's a fascinating city, but most of the alleged appeal is just way off.
My mother/ step-father honeymooned there in 1985 for all the culture, food and history. Totally different experience than going to the beaches which is a mostly cheesy drunken shit show unless you go for the more exclusive resorts. I personally would rather go to DF rather than the beaches (which I've been to in the Yucatan a few times)

But yeah, to most Americans, DF is just a big Mexican city.


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Originally Posted by Steely Dan View Post

i wonder if bos-wash people are more likely to vacation down on the carribean islands as opposed to mexico because JFK has a shit-ton of nonstop flights to seemingly every last little pissant carribean island.
Speaking from my experience from NY, yes. Flying down to FL and cruise down to the islands is very common. Though Cancun is a common destination

Last edited by JManc; Dec 8, 2022 at 12:40 AM.
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  #47  
Old Posted Dec 8, 2022, 12:16 AM
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Originally Posted by Steely Dan View Post

i wonder if bos-wash people are more likely to vacation down on the carribean islands as opposed to mexico because JFK has a shit-ton of nonstop flights to seemingly every last little pissant carribean island.
The NE Corridor has a ton of residents from the Carribean, too. That probably influences flights as much or more than the tourist destinations.
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  #48  
Old Posted Dec 8, 2022, 1:08 AM
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Speaking from my experience from NY, yes. Flying down to FL and cruise down to the islands is very common.
The Caribbean cruise out of Miami is also EXTREMELY common for midwesterners too (and for every other American region too, I imagine), but I was talking more specifically about bos-wash people who fly straight to a beach resort for a week of lazy R&R being more liky to do the Caribbean than either Cancun/Cabo.

All of those mid-range beachside all-inclusive resort compounds are more or less the same; it doesn't much matter if you're in the Caribbean, or the Yucatan, or Baja. Outside of some superficial "theme" differences, the experience will largely be the same, so then you're just looking for the shortest/cheapest/best nonstop flight options.
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Last edited by Steely Dan; Dec 8, 2022 at 1:22 AM.
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  #49  
Old Posted Dec 8, 2022, 2:03 AM
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Sao Paolo feels like it should be the setting for Gotham City, even moreso than New York. It felt like a gritty Tokyo the brief time I was there.
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  #50  
Old Posted Dec 8, 2022, 2:03 AM
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Originally Posted by Yuri View Post
What crime do foreigners experience in Cancún? I understand they just stayed trapped in those resorts and then take a shuttle to the airport.



That's a very generic question. One in Los Angeles might feel terrified walking around Skid Row but completely fine in Beverly Hills. Tourists usually stay in upmarket and safe areas. And if they're more experimented, they can go outside those bubbles but they're usually more street smart and know how to identify dangerous places.

You are generally correct. I love Mexico. The tourist centers in Mexico are generally fairly safe, although Acapulco and Mazatlan are iffy. Mexico City is fairly safe in the tourist areas, although if you stray into the poor areas robbery and even kidnapping for ransom are a concern. You have to be careful about taking taxis, as some are unlicensed and in some cases connected to robberies and kidnappings. The old VW beetle taxis have a bad reputation.

The parts of Mexico controlled by the cartels are unsafe in my opinion, and the U.S. government says that too, and this includes many border areas. Colombia tamed its cartels. News reports say Mexico is having trouble, since corruption unfortunately exists and the money involved is huge. Most politicians and police are honest, and most of the people are against the cartels and violence, but the cartels use fear and bribes to prevent action, much as the Mafia used to do in Sicily, as well as the cartels in Colombia. The U.S. government issues warnings about traveling to these areas of Mexico where cartel activity is high.

Tijuana has many safe areas, where the tourists cluster and enjoy themselves in safety, and the coast down to Ensenada is fairly safe. Avoid straying too far off the beaten path alone, unless part of a tour group. The line to get back into the U.S. can be annoying and long at the border checkpoints.

Police corruption is still a problem in Mexico. Being stopped by police for some traffic issue like alleged speeding is still common, especially outside the major cities, and of course the cop will say a "fine" can be paid on the spot and they let you go. Used to be $20, but now $50 or $100 bribe is more common (inflation). This happened to me several times when travelling in Baja.

Mexico is such a wonderful country, and most of the people are wonderful. If they ever solve their crime and cartel issues, and improve living standards for all, it would be heaven. I might move there. Mexico should consult with Colombia and Italy about how they reduced organized crime.

Of course, you are correct, in the U.S. I would also avoid some areas where crime is high.

Last edited by CaliNative; Dec 8, 2022 at 3:02 AM.
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  #51  
Old Posted Dec 8, 2022, 2:16 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Steely Dan View Post
The Caribbean cruise out of Miami is also EXTREMELY common for midwesterners too (and for every other American region too, I imagine), but I was talking more specifically about bos-wash people who fly straight to a beach resort for a week of lazy R&R being more liky to do the Caribbean than either Cancun/Cabo.

All of those mid-range beachside all-inclusive resort compounds are more or less the same; it doesn't much matter if you're in the Caribbean, or the Yucatan, or Baja. Outside of some superficial "theme" differences, the experience will largely be the same, so then you're just looking for the shortest/cheapest/best nonstop flight options.
My brother and his wife (in NY) did just that on their honeymoon in Cancun. Cabo/ Acapulco are much less common destination because you travel further for the same experience as the Atlantic side of Mexico. At least for the average schulb. Those with money go anywhere.
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  #52  
Old Posted Dec 8, 2022, 2:44 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Steely Dan View Post
if cancun's beach is artificial, they did a spectacular job with it. i never would've guessed that.

and i'd never call the irridescent turquoise waters of the caribbean "crappy", but to each their own.


source: https://www.traveloffpath.com/over-7...h-aerial-view/


i totally agree that cancun feels like a very "made-up" place (ie. not a real city), but i get the appeal it has for americans just looking for a warm weather beach to escape to in the cold seaon.

and for those travelers looking for something more "real", at least the nearby yucatan is filled with loads of mayan ruins that do offer something of real experiential substance.
It's not artificial Steely, as usual Crawford doesn't know what he's talking about. One of the main reasons the Government picked Cancun was because of the beaches.
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  #53  
Old Posted Dec 8, 2022, 2:56 AM
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Originally Posted by atlantaguy View Post
It's not artificial Steely, as usual Crawford doesn't know what he's talking about. One of the main reasons the Government picked Cancun was because of the beaches.
The coral reefs of Cancun, Cozumel and nearby Belize are wonderful.
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  #54  
Old Posted Dec 8, 2022, 2:59 AM
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The coral reefs of Cancun, Cozumel and nearby Belize are wonderful.
Roatan (Honduras) too.
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  #55  
Old Posted Dec 8, 2022, 4:36 AM
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^Yes, to all of these. Imagine, all this beauty in the 'crappy Gulf!'
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  #56  
Old Posted Dec 8, 2022, 5:10 AM
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Originally Posted by CaliNative View Post
You are generally correct. I love Mexico. The tourist centers in Mexico are generally fairly safe, although Acapulco and Mazatlan are iffy. Mexico City is fairly safe in the tourist areas, although if you stray into the poor areas robbery and even kidnapping for ransom are a concern. You have to be careful about taking taxis, as some are unlicensed and in some cases connected to robberies and kidnappings. The old VW beetle taxis have a bad reputation.

The parts of Mexico controlled by the cartels are unsafe in my opinion, and the U.S. government says that too, and this includes many border areas. Colombia tamed its cartels. News reports say Mexico is having trouble, since corruption unfortunately exists and the money involved is huge. Most politicians and police are honest, and most of the people are against the cartels and violence, but the cartels use fear and bribes to prevent action, much as the Mafia used to do in Sicily, as well as the cartels in Colombia. The U.S. government issues warnings about traveling to these areas of Mexico where cartel activity is high.

Tijuana has many safe areas, where the tourists cluster and enjoy themselves in safety, and the coast down to Ensenada is fairly safe. Avoid straying too far off the beaten path alone, unless part of a tour group. The line to get back into the U.S. can be annoying and long at the border checkpoints.
If you're concerned about security stick to Baja. There's long been an American expat community there and is generally perceived as being safer than the mainland Pacific coast resorts (cartel central).
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  #57  
Old Posted Dec 8, 2022, 5:43 AM
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Originally Posted by atlantaguy View Post
It's not artificial Steely, as usual Crawford doesn't know what he's talking about. One of the main reasons the Government picked Cancun was because of the beaches.
Wrong, the Mexican federal govt. trucked in the beaches, built the infrastructure and built the first dozen or so hotels. It was a gigantic project, pretty much the signature economic development project of the postwar era. Also wildly successful. Cancun was built on nothing. There were a few impoverished fishing villages in the area, but nothing else. It was a jungle island.
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  #58  
Old Posted Dec 8, 2022, 6:33 AM
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Originally Posted by Steely Dan View Post
The Caribbean cruise out of Miami is also EXTREMELY common for midwesterners too (and for every other American region too, I imagine), but I was talking more specifically about bos-wash people who fly straight to a beach resort for a week of lazy R&R being more liky to do the Caribbean than either Cancun/Cabo.
I'd say anecdotally this is spot-on, especially if you include Bermuda in the mix. It's only 4 and a half hours from Boston to Aruba. Under 4 to the Bahamas. 4 on the dot to San Juan PR. The Caymans and USVI are popular too. Flights are usually around $300 on the low end, so definitely accessible.

Not as popular, but with the local Portuguese connection, Ponta Delgada and the Azores are also on the "easy-access exotic destination" list for Boston / Southeast New England. That's also about 4 hours, but more expensive.
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  #59  
Old Posted Dec 8, 2022, 12:50 PM
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Compared to Spanish Latin American capitals São Paulo lacks grand baroque architecture and has a comparatively short history as a major city . As a history buff I’d rather go to Mexico City or Lima
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  #60  
Old Posted Dec 8, 2022, 1:18 PM
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Mexico City seems almost as far off the radar as Sao Paulo. As does Jakarta.

None of these cities merit being so far off the radar, but here we are.
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