Metro Phoenix Transit/Transportation Developments

[N830MH]

Originally Posted by exit2lef

Looks like Scott Smith will be retiring at the end of June 2022:

https://www.progressiverailroading.c...in-2022--64369

Wow! He will miss everyone. Hope he enjoy for his retirement. He have been working hard. He appreciate for his work. Good luck for his future.

[Obadno]

Originally Posted by N830MH

Wow! He will miss everyone. Hope he enjoy for his retirement. He have been working hard. He appreciate for his work. Good luck for his future.

[CrestedSaguaro]

British Airways resuming Phoenix to London service:

https://.abc15.com/news/business/bri...n-flight-again

[N830MH]

Originally Posted by CrestedSaguaro

British Airways resuming Phoenix to London service:

https://.abc15.com/news/business/bri...n-flight-again

I saw that! I read the news on the aviation related forums. I went on Flyertalk and Airliners.Net. I follow the news very closely.

[N830MH]

New AZDOT north-south corridor would create traffic relief for Southeast Valley

https://www.azfamily.com/traffic/ado...aking%2520News

[combusean]

Man, to be a freeway planner must take an expert level ability to BS the public.

They're not relieving traffic, they're just finally building the freeway before all of the planned sprawl for once.

http://www.superstition-vistas.org/vision/

[biggus diggus]

Originally Posted by combusean

They're not relieving traffic, they're just finally building the freeway before all of the planned sprawl for once.

Exactly. This is a money grab. Build a freeway so they can build houses and charge taxes.

[Classical in Phoenix]

Trying to revive the western portion of LR.

https://twitter.com/UrbanPhxProject/...245961730?s=19

[azsunsurfer]

Originally Posted by Classical in Phoenix

Trying to revive the western portion of LR.

https://twitter.com/UrbanPhxProject/...245961730?s=19

Can someone bring me up to speed on this? I thought there was a planned spur to run to the Capitol and westbound on the I-10. Is this the line that was killed or was it the line that was suppose to run to Downtown Glendale that Glendale passed on because of the costs associated with going over (or under) Grand Ave?

[DesertRay]

Originally Posted by azsunsurfer

Can someone bring me up to speed on this? I thought there was a planned spur to run to the Capitol and westbound on the I-10. Is this the line that was killed or was it the line that was suppose to run to Downtown Glendale that Glendale passed on because of the costs associated with going over (or under) Grand Ave?

The latter. It was supposed to go downtown, and eventually go to ASU West. The reasoning was something along the lines of "driverless cars will save us."

[MMDelon]

It still blows my mind that Glendale did not want the light rail especially with ASU West on 43rd Ave and Thunderbird. I thought it would of been a great opportunity to connect the light rail to Westgate, which is shaping to be everything and more for Glendale. I hope the reconsiders and decides to build the lightrail in Glendale.

[exit2lef]

Originally Posted by DesertRay

The latter. It was supposed to go downtown, and eventually go to ASU West. The reasoning was something along the lines of "driverless cars will save us."

Originally Posted by MMDelon

It still blows my mind that Glendale did not want the light rail especially with ASU West on 43rd Ave and Thunderbird. I thought it would of been a great opportunity to connect the light rail to Westgate, which is shaping to be everything and more for Glendale. I hope the reconsiders and decides to build the lightrail in Glendale.

ASU West is within Phoenix city limits. If light rail ever goes there, it would be via a separate project that would extend the current line beyond its planned terminus at MetroCenter. The Glendale route, a separate project, would have traveled west on Camelback, north on 43rd Ave, and then west on Glendale Avenue into that city's downtown.

One of the major reasons Glendale abandoned its light rail plan was that its city council foolishly insisted on Westgate as a final destination. That idea added to the project cost by requiring a bridge over the freight tracks at 59th Ave / Grand / Glendale. Even if that bridge were feasible, Westgate is not a good destination for a light rail line.

Even though there has been a lot of development out there, the anchor attraction is sports sprawl. The football stadium hosts only about a dozen home games per year, and the hockey team is about to relocate. The entertainment and shopping there attract a lot of customers coming from points farther west who would not take the train.

If Glendale reconsiders light rail, it would be wise to focus not on Westgate, but instead on 59th Avenue, for any route beyond its downtown. That corridor is home to a community college, a hospital, and corporate facilities that are far more durable than a suburban shopping and sports complex.

[N830MH]

I’ll believe when I see it! I doubt they will reconsider it again. I’m sure they will bring LR to Glendale or ASU West.

[MMDelon]

My bad about that, you are right. I think at one point the light rail was suppose to go to GCU but I am not sure if that’s the case now. I did not know they wanted to travel west on Glendale, which does makes sense because of much traffic Glendale going towards GCC and then down to downtown Glendale. I see why they would have to cut the idea of going to the stadium because Westgate is so separate from downtown Glendale and not much in between.

[exit2lef]

Originally Posted by MMDelon

My bad about that, you are right. I think at one point the light rail was suppose to go to GCU but I am not sure if that’s the case now.

Yes, one of the justifications for the proposed West Camelback extension was that it would serve GCU even before it crossed from Phoenix into Glendale. When the Phoenix City Council nixed the project, former council member Michael Johnson, who was there as a lobbyist for auto dealers on Camelback, claimed that GCU didn't want light rail, but offered no backing for his statement. When I've seen actual comments from GCU leadership, they've been either positive or neutral about it.

[combusean]

Westgate is a fine destination for light rail. It's better than PV mall was, Central and Baseline, a mile or so outside of downtown Mesa, and anywhere else the light rail is or was proposed to be extended to.

Every reading of LRT in glendale said it was too expensive. Glendale does not have a large tax base or a transportation tax like Phoenix and Tempe do nor does it prioritize its downtown like Mesa does. There's hardly any bus service in that area as it is.

[exit2lef]

Originally Posted by combusean

Westgate is a fine destination for light rail. It's better than PV mall was, Central and Baseline, a mile or so outside of downtown Mesa, and anywhere else the light rail is or was proposed to be extended to.

Every reading of LRT in glendale said it was too expensive. Glendale does not have a large tax base or a transportation tax like Phoenix and Tempe do nor does it prioritize its downtown like Mesa does. There's hardly any bus service in that area as it is.

Building a bridge over the freight tracks, a necessary step if heading west from downtown Glendale, contributed to the high cost. Ironically, subsidizing the sports sprawl of Westgate helped put Glendale in a precarious financial situation that made it difficult to extend transit to the area. In other words, it was in large measure the existence and location of Westgate itself that made extending the train to Westgate too expensive. PV Mall was a questionable destination, and it didn't break my heart to see that line cancelled. South Phoenix and central Mesa are far more logical destinations, and thankfully they're done deals.

[azsunsurfer]

Originally Posted by exit2lef

Building a bridge over the freight tracks, a necessary step if heading west from downtown Glendale, contributed to the high cost. Ironically, subsidizing the sports sprawl of Westgate helped put Glendale in a precarious financial situation that made it difficult to extend transit to the area. In other words, it was in large measure the existence and location of Westgate itself that made extending the train to Westgate too expensive. PV Mall was a questionable destination, and it didn't break my heart to see that line cancelled. South Phoenix and central Mesa are far more logical destinations, and thankfully they're done deals.

Oh yeah I did say that driverless cars will save us all. I STILL STAND BY MY EARLIER STATEMENT!!! lolol

[TJPHXskyscraperfan]

Originally Posted by exit2lef

ASU West is within Phoenix city limits. If light rail ever goes there, it would be via a separate project that would extend the current line beyond its planned terminus at MetroCenter. The Glendale route, a separate project, would have traveled west on Camelback, north on 43rd Ave, and then west on Glendale Avenue into that city's downtown.

One of the major reasons Glendale abandoned its light rail plan was that its city council foolishly insisted on Westgate as a final destination. That idea added to the project cost by requiring a bridge over the freight tracks at 59th Ave / Grand / Glendale. Even if that bridge were feasible, Westgate is not a good destination for a light rail line.

Even though there has been a lot of development out there, the anchor attraction is sports sprawl. The football stadium hosts only about a dozen home games per year, and the hockey team is about to relocate. The entertainment and shopping there attract a lot of customers coming from points farther west who would not take the train.

If Glendale reconsiders light rail, it would be wise to focus not on Westgate, but instead on 59th Avenue, for any route beyond its downtown. That corridor is home to a community college, a hospital, and corporate facilities that are far more durable than a suburban shopping and sports complex.

We need more bridges with our light rail. Denver, Portland, Seattle, Dallas, San Diego and even Salt Lake City has many bridges with their light rail and even tunnels! I didn’t realize how many cities have underground subway type tunnels around the country until I was doing a little research on light rails recently. I never knew Dallas has a area of their light rail underground and even San Diego goes underground at San Diego State University. Seattle’s is all underground through downtown. I would love to see Phoenix’ light rail to go underground at Roosevelt where it splits and come back out of ground around the I10 and Washington, but I know that will probably never happen,lol. Our ground may be too hard, who knows. But the least we can do is have some bridges, and there are prob too many stops as well. An hour and a half end to end is too much. I’m most excited for the I10 route even though I prob won’t use it much but should be very helpful to people on the Westside going downtown and beyond. They better have bridges at those stops. A preliminary map shows a bridge at the 51 Ave station but not at the 59th and 67th Ave locations. The 35 Ave one will be in the middle of the freeway. I hope they fast track this one, would also love to see it go to Westgate, wish that could of been done before the Super Bowl.

[exit2lef]

Originally Posted by TJPHXskyscraperfan

We need more bridges with our light rail. Denver, Portland, Seattle, Dallas, San Diego and even Salt Lake City has many bridges with their light rail and even tunnels! I didn’t realize how many cities have underground subway type tunnels around the country until I was doing a little research on light rails recently. I never knew Dallas has a area of their light rail underground and even San Diego goes underground at San Diego State University. Seattle’s is all underground through downtown. I would love to see Phoenix’ light rail to go underground at Roosevelt where it splits and come back out of ground around the I10 and Washington, but I know that will probably never happen,lol. Our ground may be too hard, who knows. But the least we can do is have some bridges, and there are prob too many stops as well. An hour and a half end to end is too much. I’m most excited for the I10 route even though I prob won’t use it much but should be very helpful to people on the Westside going downtown and beyond. They better have bridges at those stops. A preliminary map shows a bridge at the 51 Ave station but not at the 59th and 67th Ave locations. The 35 Ave one will be in the middle of the freeway. I hope they fast track this one, would also love to see it go to Westgate, wish that could of been done before the Super Bowl.

The MetroCenter extension will be elevated on its own bridge as it passes over I-17. The platforms at the terminus on the west side of the freeway will also be elevated. It's already under construction, and the piers have been installed. Once it's done, it will be impressive to see trains passing over the traffic on I-17.