Overhauling Amtrak

[Busy Bee]

RDC's!

Can you imagine any country, outside of India maybe, that would propose a new rail service using 60+ year old equipment? Now that they have the FRA waiver couldn't they buy some second hand 80s/90s DMU Sprinter's for like the price of scrap? On what planet is operating something that old in regular service energy efficient?

[jmecklenborg]

I'm guessing that is a trial to see if it makes any sense to introduce a third (or fourth) trainset into daily Downeaster service.

The current timetable for the Downeaster looks like they have two trains operating each day with a 1-hour layover at the two termini.

What's ridiculous about all of this is that the entire state of Maine has a population of 1.37 million, yet the anti-train people in Ohio don't think that a state of 11.78 million can support 5 trains per day between its three major cities.

[DannyP]

Originally Posted by ardecila

I haven't seen any indication that MARC is going electric - if anything, they are abandoning their electric locos and running diesel under wire on the Penn Line.

Supposedly Amtrak charges too much for electricity to commuter operators, but this only seems to affect MARC and MBTA, but not SEPTA/NJT/LIRR/MNRR, all of which use Amtrak's traction system to some extent.

https://www.masstransitmag.com/rail/...erick-douglass

MDOT and Amtrak have agreed on a phased implementation approach for the tunnels with all MARC Penn Line and Amtrak trains initially using the new Frederick Douglass Tunnel, but two additional tunnel tubes could be designed to accommodate freight trains in the future. Maryland Transportation Secretary Slater says MDOT will electrify its MARC commuter trains through the new Frederick Douglass Tunnel to support this plan.

[202_Cyclist]

Speaking of MARC, the Maryland Transit Administration is offering free rides tomorrow on MARC, local buses, and Baltimore's light rail in honor of Rosa Parks' birthday.

MDOT MTA Commemorates the Birthday of Rosa Parks and Transit Equity Day with Free Rides on Saturday, February 4

"BALTIMORE, MD (February 2, 2023) – The Maryland Department of Transportation Maryland Transit Administration (MDOT MTA) will celebrate the life and legacy of Rosa Parks on Saturday, February 4 – Transit Equity Day – with free rides on all service, including Local Bus, Light Rail, Metro Subway, MARC Train, Mobility and, where operating, Commuter Bus. Transit Equity Day is observed annually nationwide on the birthday of Ms. Parks, an iconic figure in the Civil Rights era who refused to give up her seat on a segregated Montgomery, Ala., public transit bus and was arrested in 1955.

“We are proud to celebrate the courage of Rosa Parks and to demonstrate our commitment to equity in public transportation as a core value of MDOT MTA every day of the year,” MDOT MTA Administrator Holly Arnold said. “The freedom for all of us to get around easily and efficiently is fundamental to our personal wellbeing and our success as a region..."

https://www.mta.maryland.gov/article...Select=Spanish

[SFBruin]

Originally Posted by jmecklenborg

What's ridiculous about all of this is that the entire state of Maine has a population of 1.37 million, yet the anti-train people in Ohio don't think that a state of 11.78 million can support 5 trains per day between its three major cities.

I mean, ridership depends on more than just population, right?

It's possible that Maine's population centers are more economically-linked, have better feeder transit, etc.

[TowerDude]

Originally Posted by jmecklenborg

I'm guessing that is a trial to see if it makes any sense to introduce a third (or fourth) trainset into daily Downeaster service.

The current timetable for the Downeaster looks like they have two trains operating each day with a 1-hour layover at the two termini.

What's ridiculous about all of this is that the entire state of Maine has a population of 1.37 million, yet the anti-train people in Ohio don't think that a state of 11.78 million can support 5 trains per day between its three major cities.

Would be awesome to eventually extend that all the way to Bangor and even to Presque Isle.

[ardecila]

Originally Posted by DannyP

https://www.masstransitmag.com/rail/...erick-douglass

MDOT and Amtrak have agreed on a phased implementation approach for the tunnels with all MARC Penn Line and Amtrak trains initially using the new Frederick Douglass Tunnel, but two additional tunnel tubes could be designed to accommodate freight trains in the future. Maryland Transportation Secretary Slater says MDOT will electrify its MARC commuter trains through the new Frederick Douglass Tunnel to support this plan.

That is surprising and a total 180 from what MARC was doing previously. The wording here makes me think they will use dual-modes though, and only run on electricity in the tunnel. Which is bad news for riders when the dual-modes inevitably crap out.

[jmecklenborg]

Originally Posted by TowerDude

Would be awesome to eventually extend that all the way to Bangor and even to Presque Isle.

I was living in Boston when the Downeaster service began. I think it was 2002. It wasn't a huge news story but it was noteworthy because Amtrak had to set up in North Station. This was right after the final decision had been made to not connect the two rail stations as part of the Big Dig, which was still very much a work in progress. I remember going on a walking tour of the Zakim bridge on a Saturday or Sunday with about 5,000 people.

I never ended up taking the Downeaster or in fact crossing the border into Maine, despite living only 60 miles away.

[TowerDude]

Anybody think Amtrak should get Siemens to do a Venture Trainset Observation car? Sorta a Venture version of the Dome Car?

[Busy Bee]

That would be pretty cool

[TowerDude]

Originally Posted by Busy Bee

That would be pretty cool

I think you could make a "taller" Venture-based Observation Car that would still fit in the New York Penn Tunnels ... I think the Viewliners are taller than the Amfleets, and I think the double decker NJ Transit and LIRR trains that go into Penn are taller than most of the Amtrak cars too ... so working out an Observation Car/Lounge for the medium to long distance trains, and for the "officially scenic" routes would be very do-able.

[Paniolo Man]

Originally Posted by TowerDude

Anybody think Amtrak should get Siemens to do a Venture Trainset Observation car? Sorta a Venture version of the Dome Car?

I feel like a minority here and on Amtrak Unlimited in my belief that Venture would be a bad platform for long distance. Single Level cars would make them lengthen heaps of platforms and change the structure of long distance trains. Amtrak's order is big enough for pretty much any rolling stock manufacturer to design a new platform. I'm sure Siemens proposal will have hints of venture in it, but it would likely still be a Superliner like bilevel. Personally I still think Stadler would make a beautiful car with a sightseer lounge variant based on a shorter (vertically) version of the cars they recently made for Rocky Mountaineer.

[TowerDude]

Originally Posted by Paniolo Man

I feel like a minority here and on Amtrak Unlimited in my belief that Venture would be a bad platform for long distance. Single Level cars would make them lengthen heaps of platforms and change the structure of long distance trains. Amtrak's order is big enough for pretty much any rolling stock manufacturer to design a new platform. I'm sure Siemens proposal will have hints of venture in it, but it would likely still be a Superliner like bilevel. Personally I still think Stadler would make a beautiful car with a sightseer lounge variant based on a shorter (vertically) version of the cars they recently made for Rocky Mountaineer.

As long as it could be a common observation deck car for the whole Amtrak network I'd be cool with it ... and the better the livery of the new observation car can be integrated into each route's other trains the nicer the experience would be.

[202_Cyclist]

When we visited Peru a few years ago, we were very fortunate to sit in the very front seat of the observation car from Cusco to Machu Picchu. The scenery and views were some of the most impressive anywhere. It was an experience I won't forget.

[202_Cyclist]

FRA adds $2.2 billion to intercity passenger-rail grant funding

Progressive Railroading
February 15, 2023

"The Federal Railroad Administration yesterday announced an additional $2.2 billion in funding is being made available for the Federal-State Partnership for Intercity Passenger Rail Grant Program.

More than $4.5 billion in funding will now be available for capital projects designed to reduce the state-of-good-repair backlog, improve performance and/or expand or establish new intercity passenger-rail service, FRA officials said in a press release. The projects that qualify for funding must outside of the Northeast Corridor..."

https://www.progressiverailroading.c...funding--68597

[jmecklenborg]

Are the new services going to get the new Siemens trains that are on order? Is any of the retiring Northeast Corridor equipment going to be moved to new or existing services?

I have not been able to find this information.

[Busy Bee]

I would be shocked if the Amfleet's are anything but scrapped after retirement.

[electricron]

Originally Posted by Busy Bee

I would be shocked if the Amfleet's are anything but scrapped after retirement.

I have read somewhere that three ex-Amfleets are in service today as private cars people can book a ride on. https://railexco.com/
Maybe a few more will join them. I do not believe the small airplane sized windows on Amfleets will make a great tourist or historic cars. Never-the-less, some will probably join the private car fleet because they are capable of going 125 mph, as fast as any car can on routes Amtrak allows private cars on.

Tourist or museum related cars running for 20-25 miles do not need the ability to go 125 mph. Most of these operators run at a maximum of 30 mph or slower speeds, Amfleets would be wasted with them. But for the private car market, apparantly Amfleets are okay.

[electricron]

Originally Posted by Paniolo Man

I feel like a minority here and on Amtrak Unlimited in my belief that Venture would be a bad platform for long distance. Single Level cars would make them lengthen heaps of platforms and change the structure of long distance trains. Amtrak's order is big enough for pretty much any rolling stock manufacturer to design a new platform. I'm sure Siemens proposal will have hints of venture in it, but it would likely still be a Superliner like bilevel. Personally I still think Stadler would make a beautiful car with a sightseer lounge variant based on a shorter (vertically) version of the cars they recently made for Rocky Mountaineer.

The ex-Colorado Rail Car design Stadler built for the Rocky Mountaineer is too tall for entering Chicago's Union Station, where all but three Amtrak Superliner trains visit (Auto Train, Sunset Limited, Coast Starlight). But Colorado Railcar did build similar single level dome cars, in service with Alaska RR and VIA. It would be nice to see similar dome cars built and operated by Amtrak in the future with the eventual retirement of Superliner cars a decade or two from now.
Apparently Siemens is not building any dome cars for the State subsidized or Amtrak's NEC trains. Hopefully dome cars will be included with any Superliner replacement orders, whether they will be single or double level cars. I missed having a Sightseer Lounge on the Texas Eagle the last time I rode it.

[jmecklenborg]

Originally Posted by electricron

I have read somewhere that three ex-Amfleets are in service today as private cars people can book a ride on. https://railexco.com/
Maybe a few more will join them. I do not believe the small airplane sized windows on Amfleets will make a great tourist or historic cars. Never-the-less, some will probably join the private car fleet because they are capable of going 125 mph, as fast as any car can on routes Amtrak allows private cars on.

Tourist or museum related cars running for 20-25 miles do not need the ability to go 125 mph. Most of these operators run at a maximum of 30 mph or slower speeds, Amfleets would be wasted with them. But for the private car market, apparantly Amfleets are okay.

Someone will probably keep one around for private charters. I know that the east coast symphonies sometimes travel by chartered train to play concerts in other cities.