Regina - Downtown Catalyst Projects Discussion

[Newstart]

Originally Posted by djforsberg

Public housing was something that all levels of government used to do. And then in the 90s, once market fundamentalism took hold, for some reason we decided to introduce private investment and the profit-motive into affordable housing, which serves no practical purpose. As other things like low interest rates and low supply drive up prices, all prices rise and “affordable” housing eventually becomes very profitable but not affordable. We need public housing that provides decent homes to families like mine when I was growing up in the Regina Housing townhouses on the west end of Rochdale Blvd. Countries in Europe didn’t go as hard as us, the US, and the UK did, but most western countries going in the neoliberal, market fundamentalist direction doesn’t mean it was a moral or sustainable endeavor.

In Canada? not really. between the 1940s and the 1980s there was less than 250,000 Public Housing doors built across Canada. Almost ALL housing in the 60s, 70s, 80s of apartments etc were built by the Private Sector with funding/insurance from CMHC and its predecessors. There is no reason why that shouldn't be or couldn't be done now.

[djforsberg]

Originally Posted by Newstart

In Canada? not really. between the 1940s and the 1980s there was less than 250,000 Public Housing doors built across Canada. Almost ALL housing in the 60s, 70s, 80s of apartments etc were built by the Private Sector with funding/insurance from CMHC and its predecessors. There is no reason why that shouldn't be or couldn't be done now.

Haha are seriously asking why it couldn’t be done now? Have you seen how much rent is? Family housing should not be something that the wealthy (or anyone) uses to pad their portfolios. What you get is the insane prices we have today.

[Newstart]

Originally Posted by djforsberg

Haha are seriously asking why it couldn’t be done now? Have you seen how much rent is? Family housing should not be something that the wealthy (or anyone) uses to pad their portfolios. What you get is the insane prices we have today.

keenly aware. a 3 bedroom in a new apartment is can go for nearly 2,500/mth in a market building.

If the government partners with the private sector to build out affordable housing, it can be done. It was done previously where the private sector got a profit for building and small amount to maintain the buildings, meanwhile they had no risk on loans etc. (programs that spurred rental housing in the 70s and 80s). It is very much possible.

[djforsberg]

Originally Posted by Newstart

keenly aware. a 3 bedroom in a new apartment is can go for nearly 2,500/mth in a market building.

If the government partners with the private sector to build out affordable housing, it can be done. It was done previously where the private sector got a profit for building and small amount to maintain the buildings, meanwhile they had no risk on loans etc. (programs that spurred rental housing in the 70s and 80s). It is very much possible.

You are not listening. If there’s a private component involved, there’s always going to be an incentive to grow those profits, especially since neoliberalism took hold in the 80s. Tying rent to profits instead of incomes is one of the reasons we got into having some of the highest housing costs in the world. We need to stop thinking every single things needs to make a profit. This market fundamentalism is rotting our society and it will be our undoing.

[Newstart]

Originally Posted by djforsberg

You are not listening. If there’s a private component involved, there’s always going to be an incentive to grow those profits, especially since neoliberalism took hold in the 80s. Tying rent to profits instead of incomes is one of the reasons we got into having some of the highest housing costs in the world. We need to stop thinking every single things needs to make a profit. This market fundamentalism is rotting our society and it will be our undoing.

Holy Communist Batman...good grief. Who do you think builds the buildings? non-profit trades? If you want non-profit to build things I'd suggest a relocation to perhaps Siberia? Cuba? Whenever the Public Sector builds something the prices get inflated and budgets lose control because there is no care of how much it costs...Private Sector can, will, and historically has built some great housing in the 70s and 80s with public money.

I also said NOTHING about tying rent to profit only that Public Housing is a general myth in Canada, 250,000 Units over 40 yrs...where by in some years the country was building 225,000 units a year...

[WhipperSnapper]

Originally Posted by Newstart

keenly aware. a 3 bedroom in a new apartment is can go for nearly 2,500/mth in a market building.

If the government partners with the private sector to build out affordable housing, it can be done. It was done previously where the private sector got a profit for building and small amount to maintain the buildings, meanwhile they had no risk on loans etc. (programs that spurred rental housing in the 70s and 80s). It is very much possible.

This is happening now. Hundreds of apartments are being built all over Canada right now through secured loans from CMHC.

[djforsberg]

Originally Posted by Newstart

Holy Communist Batman...good grief. Who do you think builds the buildings? non-profit trades? If you want non-profit to build things I'd suggest a relocation to perhaps Siberia? Cuba? Whenever the Public Sector builds something the prices get inflated and budgets lose control because there is no care of how much it costs...Private Sector can, will, and historically has built some great housing in the 70s and 80s with public money.

I also said NOTHING about tying rent to profit only that Public Housing is a general myth in Canada, 250,000 Units over 40 yrs...where by in some years the country was building 225,000 units a year...

Grow up. The world isn't black or white. You clearly aren't mature enough to discuss these kind of matters so this is the last time I reply to you. Btw I'm talking about ownership and financing of the buildings, not who builds them. Canada is well short of appropriate supply of housing and we cannot, we shall not, rely on the private sector (with or without public funding) to fix it.

[djforsberg]

Originally Posted by WhipperSnapper

This is happening now. Hundreds of apartments are being built all over Canada right now through secured loans from CMHC.

This still doesn't address the problem, which is the pressure of profit growth when private investment is involved with "affordable" housing. It completely changes market incentives, and you get an economy like Canada's that relies so much on housing instead of actually something productive.

For anyone with an open mind who doesn't think anything but market fundamentalism is some evil communist plot, here is a great article about public housing.

Guess what, capitalism isn't perfect. It is clear that it isn't solving many of the problems humans face, especially when it comes to creating sustainable societies for humans. Thinking capital (private investment in housing) will solve the problems capital has created (exponentially-rising housing costs) is absolutely insane. I have an old friend who is building a real estate empire in Regina, with most of his units in North Central. He is not doing this out of the goodness of his heart. Companies like Avana Homes isn't either. These people are greedy and want to grow their wealth any way they can and don't care who they have to step on to get there. We as a democratic society need to decide where we want individuals to focus their investing efforts and I think "affordable" housing should not be one of them. Especially if it takes public funding to do so, in which case, we the taxpayer might as well be the full owners of such assets instead of gifting them to wealthy leeches.

[one_brick_at_a_time]

Should I make a Regina Housing Thread?

[pappcam]

Originally Posted by one_brick_at_a_time

Should I make a Regina Housing Thread?

Or a fucking politics thread...

[one_brick_at_a_time]

We can now move all the housing discussion to this THREAD, as this forum will specifically be for the Catalyst projects, which doesn’t include housing at this time.

[djforsberg]

Originally Posted by one_brick_at_a_time

We can now move all the housing discussion to this THREAD, as this forum will specifically be for the Catalyst projects, which doesn’t include housing at this time.

Thanks!

[djforsberg]

Originally Posted by pappcam

Or a fucking politics thread...

[Newstart]

Here is a novel idea...

Why not a private/public partnership whereby the arena has housing attached too it and a private operating agreement that funds most of the Arena...

[CCF]

Originally Posted by Newstart

Here is a novel idea...

Why not a private/public partnership whereby the arena has housing attached too it and a private operating agreement that funds most of the Arena...

I do wonder if, the arena is to be on the block north of the library, that the Namerind housing project might be rolled into it. Perhaps housing above the arena? I'm probably too optimistic in my thinking about motivations.

[Stormer]

Originally Posted by CCF

I do wonder if, the arena is to be on the block north of the library, that the Namerind housing project might be rolled into it. Perhaps housing above the arena? I'm probably too optimistic in my thinking about motivations.

I don't think that makes sense. Land is not so valuable in Regina that you need to pile things on top of each other. I also think any substantial private funding of an arena is a pipe dream in a city the size of Regina with no pro team. There will be sponsorships and naming rights sold. Semples might pay for the Pat's facilities, the scoreboard and suites, but only if they control the revenue.

I would add that arena rooves are hard enough to engineer without putting a 15 story building on top.

[djforsberg]

Originally Posted by Stormer

I don't think that makes sense. Land is not so valuable in Regina that you need to pile things on top of each other. I also think any substantial private funding of an arena is a pipe dream in a city the size of Regina with no pro team. There will be sponsorships and naming rights sold. Semples might pay for the Pat's facilities, the scoreboard and suites, but only if they control the revenue.

I would add that arena rooves are hard enough to engineer without putting a 15 story building on top.

No thinking needed. It makes absolutely no sense. It’s a worse idea than those apartments in the middle of the Grasslands paved paradise.

[CCF]

Originally Posted by djforsberg

No thinking needed. It makes absolutely no sense. It’s a worse idea than those apartments in the middle of the Grasslands paved paradise.

oof.

How is mixed-use development in Harbour Landing a bad idea? That's exactly what Regina's suburban neighbourhoods need more of.

[CCF]

Originally Posted by Stormer

I don't think that makes sense. Land is not so valuable in Regina that you need to pile things on top of each other. I also think any substantial private funding of an arena is a pipe dream in a city the size of Regina with no pro team. There will be sponsorships and naming rights sold. Semples might pay for the Pat's facilities, the scoreboard and suites, but only if they control the revenue.

I would add that arena rooves are hard enough to engineer without putting a 15 story building on top.

Yes, unlikely.
Wasn't proposing so much on top of the arena but speculating on whether the footprint of an arena would take up the whole block - and whether housing might be directed towards a corner of the site.

They're going to have a tough story to navigate if that ends up being the proposed location - "City squashes affordable housing project for arena!"

[djforsberg]

Originally Posted by CCF

oof.

How is mixed-use development in Harbour Landing a bad idea? That's exactly what Regina's suburban neighbourhoods need more of.

Not surrounded by parking lots in an otherwise big box development.