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  #3881  
Old Posted Feb 8, 2022, 6:05 PM
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Changing City Changing City is offline
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Originally Posted by mcj View Post
Is there any reason at this location to not max out the FSR though? Seems like there's plenty of demand for the Brentwood area, wouldn't opting for a lower FSR just be going against the developers best interests?
I'm not a property developer, just an observer of what gets developed. As I understand it, development is a complex calculation between risk and reward. To achieve the maximum FAR means a developer has to be willing, and able, to take on a significant chunk of either commercial or non-market rental, (or both). Up to now, we know there has been a strong market in Brentwood for condos, and for market rental. The office market is less clear. Appia obviously think there's potential, as they added more office to SoLo 4, (but they haven't actually built it yet). They did put a 230,000 office component under tower 2, but only 0.8 FAR under the tower currently being built. Shape haven't built their office tower, and there aren't any other new office buildings under development, suggesting the market isn't terribly strong. To quote Avison Young on the Burnaby office market: "With just 113,478 sf of new space set for delivery in 2022 (38% preleased), there is virtually no more new supply scheduled to be delivered until mid-2024." When they first inquired about developing here in 2019 Bosa indicated an office/hotel tower as part of the project - but that's not the case any more.

The new policy pretty much guarantees the residential 8.3 FAR, but some of that has to be rental, and some has to have rents set to 20% below CMHC market median rents. To add the other 6 FAR at least half must be commercial (so 3 FAR) and the other half can be rental, not condo.

The bigger the building, the longer it takes to develop, the more the borrowing costs are, and the greater the risk that there's only a limited market for what gets built (rental office, or rental housing). The condos are effectively pre-sold to cover their costs, but the parts the developer is still responsible for carry greater risk, and so far nobody has actually maxed out the permitted density, although it's 2 years since the policy was adopted.

Having said that Bosa, with a dedicated rental business, and a commercial leasing arm, might well be the developer to try, but they'd also have to persuade the bank covering their construction costs it makes sense. Overall, at 14.3 FAR, this would be over 2 million sq. ft. of construction, which would cost over $1 billion to construct (although obviously it's likely to be phased)

With this site they would have to be willing to build 450,000 sq. ft. of commercial and even more residential rental space, some of it at below-market rents. Building at around 12 FAR would reduce some of the risk, cut down on some of the commercial and market and below-market rental units. It'll be interesting to see how it develops.
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  #3882  
Old Posted Feb 19, 2022, 8:50 AM
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Strata windup at 3925 Kingsway ... if this lot can be combined with the Old Church site next door ... it would be pretty sizable.



https://www.collierscanada.com/en-ca...ada/can2005987
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Last edited by hollywoodnorth; Feb 20, 2022 at 6:07 AM.
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  #3883  
Old Posted Feb 19, 2022, 3:47 PM
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Originally Posted by hollywoodnorth View Post
Strata windup at 3925 Kingsway ... if this lot can be combined with the Old Church site next door ... it would be pretty sizable.

https://www.collierscanada.com/en-ca...ada/can2005987
Oooh, right near where I live. If they could put a little street level retail - a nice coffee shop or bakery is all I'm asking for - I'll get pretty excited. I see lots of potential to densify this area but just want a touch of street level retail/walkability to be added.
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  #3884  
Old Posted Feb 19, 2022, 6:40 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ecbin View Post
Oooh, right near where I live. If they could put a little street level retail - a nice coffee shop or bakery is all I'm asking for - I'll get pretty excited. I see lots of potential to densify this area but just want a touch of street level retail/walkability to be added.
It's also in the one area of Burnaby that has a viewcone so don't expect too much height here.
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  #3885  
Old Posted Feb 20, 2022, 2:28 AM
Spr0ckets Spr0ckets is offline
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Originally Posted by Sheba View Post
It's also in the one area of Burnaby that has a viewcone so don't expect too much height here.
Is this on account of where its located relative to Central Park?
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  #3886  
Old Posted Feb 20, 2022, 4:09 AM
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Originally Posted by Spr0ckets View Post
Is this on account of where its located relative to Central Park?
So Central Park can be seen from Brentwood (and vice versa). Thankfully most of the area between the two is in a bowl and most of it is unlikely to be redeveloped into anything tall for a very long time.
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  #3887  
Old Posted Feb 21, 2022, 5:50 AM
ecbin ecbin is offline
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Originally Posted by Sheba View Post
So Central Park can be seen from Brentwood (and vice versa). Thankfully most of the area between the two is in a bowl and most of it is unlikely to be redeveloped into anything tall for a very long time.
That's a bit of a bizarre view cone, neither spot merits that kind of consideration. It's not like the top of QE park and the North Shore.
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  #3888  
Old Posted Feb 21, 2022, 6:00 AM
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can someone post a link with more info on that View Cone as noting come sup on google.

maybe its a urban legend.
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  #3889  
Old Posted Feb 21, 2022, 4:39 PM
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FWIW, it's maxed out at 400,000sf with 100k of that designated for retail which I imagine will take the form of a retail building on Kingsway (215 feet of frontage) so maybe a 4-6 storey retail building up front? I'm assuming it'll be the same kind of retail as the neighbouring area - medical offices, maybe a coffee shop, a daycare, hair salon. Would be great to see a walkable grocery store even if it's small.

The remaining 300k of residential works out to about 40 floors of housing if we're assuming 8000sf floor plates so two 20 story towers if allowed (I'm a know nothing with this kind of development so feel free to critique). I'd guess this is a great opportunity for some townhouse style development along the north side of the lot but the view cone might for the towers to be built at the low points of the lot. Maybe there's an opportunity here for a rental program or affordable housing program in exchange for a bit more FAR - the area already has some lower income housing so the NIMBY's won't be out in force to fight this.
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  #3890  
Old Posted Feb 21, 2022, 4:55 PM
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I don't believe there being any views cones in Burnaby but above are may be outside of the SR5 high-rise area, limiting its potential.
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  #3891  
Old Posted Feb 21, 2022, 6:40 PM
jollyburger jollyburger is offline
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It just says this in the Metrotown Downtown Plan

Quote:
Sites along Kingsway, east of Smith
Avenue and west of Barker Avenue,
are intended to be mixed-use with
commercial and/or residential podiums
and high-rise residential apartment
buildings above that relate to Kingsway
and Central Park. The mixed-use
designations fronting the north side
of Kingsway require a consolidated
site that fronts Kingsway to access the
commercial density. The commercial
component of the development must
be orientated towards Kingsway. Where
possible, views from Central Park
looking north should be considered.
and

Quote:
Burnaby’s spectacular views are an asset to be shared
between a proposed project and existing and future
developments on surrounding sites. The orientation,
massing, and siting of buildings should be respectful of
desirable public view corridors. New developments should
be designed and landscaped to provide visual interest and
a visual terminus, where appropriate.
https://www.burnaby.ca/our-city/stra...ommunity-plans
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  #3892  
Old Posted Feb 21, 2022, 6:57 PM
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Posted in 2018

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sheba View Post
Prepare yourself - Burnaby has a *gasp* viewcone. From the Metrotown Downtown Plan: Phase II Consultation and Finalized Plan (it's a pdf under Council Reports if anyone wants to look at it).

Central Park North Neighbourhood: (pg 14)

Quote:
...concerns were raised related to sightlines toward Central Park from north Burnaby, and of the North Shore Mountains from Swanguard Stadium. The loss of views to and from the public landmark were felt to detract from the use and enjoyment of the park.
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  #3893  
Old Posted Feb 22, 2022, 3:32 AM
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I really don't know what views they are talking about. Central Park is not very interesting looking even from high up (just a dark patch of trees) and there is no view of the North Shore to mention from there. There are much better views when driving northbound on Boundary, Willingdon and especially Royal Oak than anywhere near the park.

I personally wouldn't want to see high-rises at this location. As it is already, towers are being spread out all over Metrotown perimeter.
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  #3894  
Old Posted Feb 22, 2022, 8:59 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ecbin View Post
Oooh, right near where I live. If they could put a little street level retail - a nice coffee shop or bakery is all I'm asking for - I'll get pretty excited. I see lots of potential to densify this area but just want a touch of street level retail/walkability to be added.
Lol, so it's not just me who fancies more retail/commercial/mixed use streets in Metrotown.
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  #3895  
Old Posted Feb 22, 2022, 9:03 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Klazu View Post
I really don't know what views they are talking about. Central Park is not very interesting looking even from high up (just a dark patch of trees) and there is no view of the North Shore to mention from there. There are much better views when driving northbound on Boundary, Willingdon and especially Royal Oak than anywhere near the park.

I personally wouldn't want to see high-rises at this location. As it is already, towers are being spread out all over Metrotown perimeter.
It would just be a continuation of towers from Joyce-Collingwood all the way to Royal Oak. Hence it's A OK!
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  #3896  
Old Posted Feb 22, 2022, 9:40 PM
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Here's the view from January 2020:
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lexus View Post
My pics today from Skytrain 2020/01/15

Untitled by Lexus, on Flickr
Untitled by Lexus, on Flickr
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  #3897  
Old Posted Feb 23, 2022, 5:18 AM
Spr0ckets Spr0ckets is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sheba View Post
So Central Park can be seen from Brentwood (and vice versa). Thankfully most of the area between the two is in a bowl and most of it is unlikely to be redeveloped into anything tall for a very long time.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sheba View Post
Posted in 2018
Thanks for that

I mean,....I love Central Park as much as the next guy, but I don't really see the view to it that needs preserving more than any other natural sites and views in Burnaby.

I guess I'll never get it.
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  #3898  
Old Posted Feb 23, 2022, 8:14 AM
VarBreStr18 VarBreStr18 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Spr0ckets View Post
Thanks for that

I mean,....I love Central Park as much as the next guy, but I don't really see the view to it that needs preserving more than any other natural sites and views in Burnaby.

I guess I'll never get it.
I don't get it either. I never thought looking south to the metrotown skyline is considered "view", to me it is just one great big open non stop space. Mountains and water makes relaxing "view" ,hence Coal Harbour view so expensive. Looking south east is "view" because at least Mt Baker is sometimes visible. Anyway mho.
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  #3899  
Old Posted Mar 2, 2022, 3:09 PM
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Brentwood West will have four towers ranging from 39 to 64 floors. Perfect height for the center part of Brentwood and I love how close to each other these towers will be compared to everything else in the area being so sparsely spaced.

https://www.burnabynow.com/local-new...t-plan-5113994

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  #3900  
Old Posted Mar 2, 2022, 4:12 PM
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That’s a lot of office and market rental. Is this density that is being transferred from another site? Looks like it.
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