Phoenix Development News (3)

[Jjs5056]

Originally Posted by Arquitect

As I have mentioned multiple times before, student housing is not dorms. It is just your typical market rate apartments marketed towards students. In fact, you don't even have to be a student to live in one of these. The reason they are popping up all over the place is because there is a huge demand across the country for student housing. Even though universities like ASU have continued to grow, they have really reduced or eliminated the construction of dorms, and because of this the private sector began to exploit this demand. The big demand has made it a lot easier for developers to secure funding for these apartment buildings. Neither Tempe nor Phoenix have to worry about these popping up. As the market evolves, they could shift their marketing towards a broader range (Roosevelt Point is already deemphasizing the student housing part of its marketing).

As for low income housing, it is not as the place is being flooded by low income and age restricted housing. Yes, there are some projects going up, but for how much land is available, it is not anything to worry about. The reason that these are being built rather than market rate apartments also has everything to do with funding. It is really difficult to get funding for market rate projects in downtown right now (trust me, I've tried with multiple different projects). So developers are going to where the money is. And it is not because they are horrible people who only care about money, but rather because most of these developers can't afford to build an entire project without financing. Therefore they do what they can.

Even if some might not think these groups of people are not the ideal mix, just having more people around downtown is helpful. As more and more people move here, the services and retail that they require will continue to grow, which will incentivize other projects to be developed. Eventually, banks and investors won't be as tight with financing in the core.

Call them dorms, or call them market rate apartments marketed toward students- at the end of the day, these projects will be almost 100% filled with students as no real professional wants to live down the all from a frat house. So, we see all of these projects coming on board and yet no retail following because everyone knows this is just a transient population and the areas will be desolate come summer.

I'd be fine with the amount of low income projects if market rate ones balanced them out; as you mentioned, having people in general on our streets is great, and downtown should have a nice mix in population. But, there's a huge gap between the CityScapes and the Lofts at Fillmore. And, I wish the city would say time out until the other markets catch up.

On that front, I got in touch with MetroWest since I am going to be pissed if Union falls through. His response:

"Full construction documents for the project will be submitted to the City building department for review and permit within the next week or two. Construction still set to commence soon after receipt of permits. You can follow the progress of this project as well as our other townhouse project and view the updated renderings on our website. The project website and preleasing will launch following construction starting."

I'll let you guys with the degrees take it from here.

[Arquitect]

Originally Posted by Jjs5056

Call them dorms, or call them market rate apartments marketed toward students- at the end of the day, these projects will be almost 100% filled with students as no real professional wants to live down the all from a frat house. So, we see all of these projects coming on board and yet no retail following because everyone knows this is just a transient population and the areas will be desolate come summer.

I'd be fine with the amount of low income projects if market rate ones balanced them out; as you mentioned, having people in general on our streets is great, and downtown should have a nice mix in population. But, there's a huge gap between the CityScapes and the Lofts at Fillmore. And, I wish the city would say time out until the other markets catch up.

On that front, I got in touch with MetroWest since I am going to be pissed if Union falls through. His response:

"Full construction documents for the project will be submitted to the City building department for review and permit within the next week or two. Construction still set to commence soon after receipt of permits. You can follow the progress of this project as well as our other townhouse project and view the updated renderings on our website. The project website and preleasing will launch following construction starting."

I'll let you guys with the degrees take it from here.

There is a big difference from dorms, and the reason why the city shouldn't be worried about these projects popping up. Why? Because even though students are the only way to make these project viable at the moment, as the market evolves they will open up. In the end, when they can make as much money and have the base to be profitable without the student campaign, they will do it.

Cities don't develop over night. You are looking at this in very short time frames. Yes, a better mix would be good. But for the city to halt low-income development now, just because there isn't any market-rate stuff going up is plain dumb. Having people around full time is the only thing that will help downtown grow. Yes, right now it is students and low income families, with some young professionals. But that is where the funding is at now. We already see a few market-rate projects popping up, so the process is definitely going in the right direction. Slowly but surely, people are coming, and as more people come, there will be greater demand.

Patience young grasshopper.

As for MetroWest, if drawings are indeed already being sent to the city for permits, we will probably be seeing construction starting up no later than this summer.

[Phxguy]

On the subject of apartments for downtown...here comes another update.
http://roselawgroupreporter.com/2014...wntown-phoenix

[nickw252]

Originally Posted by Phxguy

On the subject of apartments for downtown...here comes another update.
http://roselawgroupreporter.com/2014...wntown-phoenix

Good to hear progress on The Blue on Washington. As far as I know these are slated to be market rate apartments.

[Wizened Variations]

Originally Posted by Arquitect

There is a big difference from dorms, and the reason why the city shouldn't be worried about these projects popping up. Why? Because even though students are the only way to make these project viable at the moment, as the market evolves they will open up. In the end, when they can make as much money and have the base to be profitable without the student campaign, they will do it.

Cities don't develop over night. You are looking at this in very short time frames. Yes, a better mix would be good. But for the city to halt low-income development now, just because there isn't any market-rate stuff going up is plain dumb. Having people around full time is the only thing that will help downtown grow. Yes, right now it is students and low income families, with some young professionals. But that is where the funding is at now. We already see a few market-rate projects popping up, so the process is definitely going in the right direction. Slowly but surely, people are coming, and as more people come, there will be greater demand.

As long as urban ambience can be packaged, the young professionals will be attracted to student residences, particularly if such rentals are placed above boutique retail and are not huge.

I think careful placement is the key, and, the urban "public housing look" should be avoided at all costs.

(See "Brownsville, Brooklyn" in Wikipedia.)

[nickw252]

More on The Blue on Washington.

Phoenix - Epoch Properties Inc. in Winter Park, Fla. (Kyle Riva, pres.) plans to develop 292 apartments in a $50 million project that should bring about 400 residents to downtown Phoenix. A 1.92-acre parcel located along the south side of Washington Street at 12th Street is targeted for 152 units and a 1.87-acre site located along the north side of Washington Street at 11th Street (alignment) is planned for 140 units. A company formed by Epoch paid a combined $8.1 million to buy the properties from a trust and company formed by Michael Lafferty in Phoenix. The deal was negotiated by Mark Forrester an Ric Holway of Hendricks Berkadia in Phoenix. The downtown apartment projects will be the first in the Valley for Epoch Properties. Since 1970, the privately-held firm has developed more than 32,000 multi-family units in 55 cities located from Florida to California. While the upscale apartments on Washington Street will be the first for Epoch in the Phoenix market, Riva says hopefully it will not be the last. The company is now investing from its Epoch Multi-family Opportunity Fund II and is looking for sites in the Valley to develop more apartments. The two apartment communities in Phoenix, being called 11 Capital Place and 12 Capital Place, are being designed by Archicon. Plans call for two, four-story structures each on top of one-level of podium parking. Riva says construction slated to start second quarter 2014, with opening to follow in early 2015. Build out expected third quarter 2015. Contractor still to be selected. Studio, one-, two- and three-bedroom units to range from 890 sq. ft. to 1,500 sq. ft. Monthly rental rates projected to run from $1,200 to $2,400. Development cost (land and buildings) estimated to be approaching $50 million. Construction financing yet to be arranged. Epoch may decide to develop the Phoenix apartments in a joint venture and is likely to hold the assets for investment after completion of construction and lease up. Epoch will manage the multi-family projects, which will both be adjacent to light rail stops at 12th Street. There is a light rail station on Jefferson Street going east and on Washington Street going west. Riva says typical tenants will be young professionals with ties to the legal industry, the downtown campus of Arizona State University and the nearby Phoenix Sky Harbor International Airport. The sites for the newly planned apartments are about one block apart on opposite sides of Washington Street. The 12th Street parcel, which is bordered on the south by Jefferson Street, has a roughly 35,000-square-foot structure in place that once was headquarters for Lafferty Electric. That building, which Lafferty has been using as a warehouse, will be razed for the new apartments. Records show Epoch Downtown Phoenix Apartments LLC paid $4.292 million to buy the site for 12 Capital Place, which is at 1209 E. Washington Street. The seller in the cash sale was Michael J. Lafferty Revocable Trust. In the other property sale, Epoch Downtown Phoenix Apartments LLC paid $3.808 million to acquire the site for 11 Capital Place. The seller in that cash sale was 1100 East Washington LLC (Lafferty's company). That parcel, which is at 1012 E. Washington Street, has a 31,000-square-foot retail building that will be razed. In June 2012, Lafferty's company paid just under $2.219 million to buy that property from Azteca Wedding Enterprises Inc. in Phoenix. The long time bridal business owned by the Torrez family still operates from a 25,771-square-foot building it owns next door at 1010 E. Washington Street. That commercial structure will remain in place. After moving Lafferty Electric from the 1209 E. Washington Street property in 2004 and then selling the business in 2006, Lafferty has been pursuing opportunities in solar technology. He also took the two Washington Street parcels through the entitlement process, paving the way for the multi-family projects. Lafferty says he is involved with the “urban movement” in downtown Phoenix and is exploring opportunities to bring amenities to the area that will support the residents that Epoch Properties will attract. Get more from Riva at (407) 644-9055. Call Lafferty at (602) 220-9696, ext. 202. Forrester and Holway are at (602) 955-1122.

[poconoboy61]

$1200-$2400 to live on 12th Street and Washington?? Wow. That's about the same price as Cityscape. I guess the light rail really does add a premium onto rental prices.

[nickw252]

Originally Posted by poconoboy61

$1200-$2400 to live on 12th Street and Washington?? Wow. That's about the same price as Cityscape. I guess the light rail really does add a premium onto rental prices.

I thought it seemed a little high also. I'll take a high-rise in the heart of downtown any day over a midrise a few blocks away. Although inflation is currently low, keep in mind the time value of money and these prices are for when the project opens, not today.

[Leo the Dog]

The article calls 12th/Washington, "Downtown Phoenix"...not exactly.

[Jjs5056]

Sounds like financing is still in limbo; I doubt these will get built. Even though this is the type of project that should be being built along the line, I can't help but wish we'd get more residents in the actual core before trying to revitalize areas along Washington. I know a lot with the perfect price tag at the perfect location downtown can't just magically appear in developer's hands, but there has to be someone banking land that's ready to move.

And, I'm ready to start seeing some real residential projects. 10+ story projects. It seems like we are maxing out at 6-8, but it would he awesome to get a 20-story apartment on Adams and Central, or for 2nd-7th avenues between Roosevelt and Van Buren to start filling up with a mix of different high rises.

In other news, I did some digging and it seems Ballpark Apartments has already gone through review and their abandonment request for Buchanan was approved. Congrats to those who feel the 240 units are worth what was sacrificed.

[azliam]

Originally Posted by Jjs5056

Sounds like financing is still in limbo; I doubt these will get built. Even though this is the type of project that should be being built along the line, I can't help but wish we'd get more residents in the actual core before trying to revitalize areas along Washington. I know a lot with the perfect price tag at the perfect location downtown can't just magically appear in developer's hands, but there has to be someone banking land that's ready to move.

And, I'm ready to start seeing some real residential projects. 10+ story projects. It seems like we are maxing out at 6-8, but it would he awesome to get a 20-story apartment on Adams and Central, or for 2nd-7th avenues between Roosevelt and Van Buren to start filling up with a mix of different high rises.

In other news, I did some digging and it seems Ballpark Apartments has already gone through review and their abandonment request for Buchanan was approved. Congrats to those who feel the 240 units are worth what was sacrificed.

Hmm...Buchanan. I think I went to a rave in that area around 1992...I think it was called Liquid Rave. That was the last time I was in that very specific area. What have they used those buildings south of Buchanan for since then?

[pbenjamin]

Here's something you don't hear about every day: A developer is at looking building single family homes on the empty parcel that is between Cambridge and Virginia, west of 1st Ave., behind 2600 N. Central. They are meeting with the Willo board to discuss their plans before they take them to the city. The zoning is currently CO and the homes are likely to be two story. There was a proposal a few years ago that Willo successfully opposed that wanted to build a parking structure hidden behind townhomes. I am guessing that they will support this one unless it has some major flaw. The empty lot is not good for anybody. The lot is within Willo's boundaries.

[nickw252]

Originally Posted by pbenjamin

Here's something you don't hear about every day: A developer is at looking building single family homes on the empty parcel that is between Cambridge and Virginia, west of 1st Ave., behind 2600 N. Central. They are meeting with the Willo board to discuss their plans before they take them to the city. The zoning is currently CO and the homes are likely to be two story. There was a proposal a few years ago that Willo successfully opposed that wanted to build a parking structure hidden behind townhomes. I am guessing that they will support this one unless it has some major flaw. The empty lot is not good for anybody. The lot is within Willo's boundaries.

That's welcome and unexpected news. I hope the architectural designs compliment the surrounding historic neighborhoods, i.e. no McMansions or Snout-Houses.

[pbenjamin]

Originally Posted by nickw252

That's welcome and unexpected news. I hope the architectural designs compliment the surrounding historic neighborhoods, i.e. no McMansions or Snout-Houses.

My understanding is that the rules for historic neighborhoods forbid immitative (e.e. faux tudor revival, etc.) but encourage complimentary/compatible designs.

[poconoboy61]

A group called Project Rising, a non-profit self-described "infill accelerator," has come up with three conceptual proposals for some high profile vacant lots around downtown. The first is dubbed as Luhrs Marketplace on Jefferson between 1st Avenue and Central. This concept would feature three local food "concepts" and a bar. The second concept is PHX Commons on Jefferson between Central and 1st Street. The PHX Commons would be a mix of a coffee shop/wine bar, newsstand, coffee shop, and tech and student workspace. The last concept is on the SE corner of Central and Adams, dubbed Central Adams, which would serve as a an event space, commercial space, and affordable apartment and condos.



More information can be found here:

http://www.prlog.org/12267328-projec...nt-spaces.html

Interesting concepts, especially for Luhrs, but I personally think the Central Adams concept is horrid. It looks like something you would find in Bangladesh. I can't understand what that orange thing is on top of the conceptual rendering. PHX Commons is also a pretty odd and vague concept.

[Jjs5056]

Originally Posted by azliam

Hmm...Buchanan. I think I went to a rave in that area around 1992...I think it was called Liquid Rave. That was the last time I was in that very specific area. What have they used those buildings south of Buchanan for since then?

You can see the numerous strcutures that will be demolished in this aerial view: http://www.graniteci.com/Portfolio/D...20Ballpark.htm

The structures furthest north weren't worth saving, but everything south ranged from salvageable to historic gem. The two historic gems will be spared; however, one will be used as an office, and the other will function as the fitness center for the complex, rendering neither building accessible to the public.

Ironically, you can find 2 of the structures worth being adaptively reused on this website:
http://goodbyewarehousedistrict.blogspot.com/
Gerardo's will necome the fitness center, and El Fresnal Grocery Store will become an office.

The abandonment will actually prevent the public from even getting near the one structure, as the complex will be gated off at Buchanan. It's disheartening to see a developer knocking down the little history we have left and creating a superblock to boot. While the warehouse district has a ways to go and may never get there, actions like this and the wreckage of the Madison hotels continue to strip the area of the bones needed for it to one day revitalize.

[combusean]

Jjs, that third structure is a block west of this project. The Buchanan apartments aren't proposing to demolish anything historic or otherwise worthy of saving.

[nickw252]

Originally Posted by nickw252

That's welcome and unexpected news. I hope the architectural designs compliment the surrounding historic neighborhoods, i.e. no McMansions or Snout-Houses.

Any idea how many homes? It appears to have room for about 6 Willo sized lots/homes. Filling in empty lots like this is great news for the neighborhood. I really wish the empty lots between 13th And 15th Ave on McDowell would be built on. Ideally nice market rate apartments or condos.

[combusean]

Originally Posted by poconoboy61

A group called Project Rising, a non-profit self-described "infill accelerator," has come up with three conceptual proposals for some high profile vacant lots around downtown. The first is dubbed as Luhrs Marketplace on Jefferson between 1st Avenue and Central. This concept would feature three local food "concepts" and a bar. The second concept is PHX Commons on Jefferson between Central and 1st Street. The PHX Commons would be a mix of a coffee shop/wine bar, newsstand, coffee shop, and tech and student workspace. The last concept is on the SE corner of Central and Adams, dubbed Central Adams, which would serve as a an event space, commercial space, and affordable apartment and condos.



More information can be found here:

http://www.prlog.org/12267328-projec...nt-spaces.html
Interesting concepts, especially for Luhrs, but I personally think the Central Adams concept is horrid. It looks like something you would find in Bangladesh. I can't understand what that orange thing is on top of the conceptual rendering. PHX Commons is also a pretty odd and vague concept.

I have no idea why these folks are putting *incredible* amounts of effort into designing buildings for sites they don't own for money that's not there. It sounds like an enormous waste of effort.

Moreover, there's a 56' height limit on Central and Adams, and putting a 4? story building on Jefferson St with the design inspired by an ASU monolith is the worst idea ever.

[nickw252]

Originally Posted by combusean

I have no idea why these folks are putting *incredible* amounts of effort into designing buildings for sites they don't own for money that's not there. It sounds like an enormous waste of effort.

Hah, I often times wonder the same thing. Maybe they're class projects?