Rate your city's recovery

[pdxtex]

Originally Posted by dc_denizen

How can dc and Ottawa allow federal workers to phone it in 2 years after the pandemic , on the taxpayers dime no less

Most live on transit lines with short commute times . Meanwhile 20 something workers are having to work in horrifying social isolation . Its mind boggling that the feds allow this

I 1000 percent agree however I suspect managers nationwide are still walking on eggshells after the protests and riots. Somehow work from home has emerged as a d.e.i. talking point and I think the ball is still in the workers' court.

[TWAK]

Originally Posted by pdxtex

I don't quite understand the nuances of Portlands city employee situation. I think it might be similar to the dude from Ottawa up above. It a union dispute. Represented employees don't want to go back to the office and their managers want butts in seats. I think in reality it mostly a pay issue. Ppl think if they return to the office they should get paid more. I agree that empty buildings will need to find alternate uses but I'm sure as shit most developers are going to find that cumbersome. I think in reality rents are going to end up dropping and new tenants will take over at some point. Or all of our CBDs are going to look like times sq in the 70s. Anyone here from Des Moines or Omaha? Did everyone go home in states that didn't shut down too?

Well if it's a pay dispute it's different and that would depend on what the bosses of the mangers want (city leaders). The State of CA wants to convert former buildings into apartments and condos for Sacramento, possibly in other CA cities as well. It's cheaper for the state to not rent or own a skyscraper and either sell/rent it out. Developers would still be able to make a buck off the properties so I don't think they would really care. Speaking of that I was in Portland recently and there was a decent amount of construction!
A good argument to get city workers back is their contributions to the tax pool, like a commuter from Gresham spending their money downtown every lunch break. That can be replaced with more people living in downtown, which is what every urbanist would want (I lived in DT Sac, for example).
Santa Rosa and Napa, the two closest "big" cities to me, seem to be doing fine and are active.

Originally Posted by dc_denizen

How can dc and Ottawa allow federal workers to phone it in 2 years after the pandemic , on the taxpayers dime no less

The tax payers will spend less if government workers stay at home, so the taxpayer wins with WFH. Heck, the government could make money renting or selling their buildings that were formerly occupied. Instead of the buildings being occupied 9-5, they would be occupied 24/7. The workers are still working and earning their money.

[Acajack]

Originally Posted by TWAK

The tax payers will spend less if government workers stay at home, so the taxpayer wins with WFH. Heck, the government could make money renting or selling their buildings that were formerly occupied. Instead of the buildings being occupied 9-5, they would be occupied 24/7. The workers are still working and earning their money.

I imagine that the US government in DC (and maybe some other cities) is in the same situation as the Canadian government and that it's locked into to a ton of long-term leases with commercial building owners that it cannot easily break.

So while in theory employees WFH offers massive potential savings on office space rent, cashing in on most of that is probably many, many years if not decades away. Though I assume they are saving a bit on office operational costs like electricity, toilet paper, etc., that WFH employees must bear at home.

The fact that government cost savings are hypothetical and very long term is balanced by political considerations: the government is under pressure not only from local business where their vacant offices are located, but also more generally public opinion (made up massively of people who don't work in government) which is very hostile to fat cats who still get to work at home whereas most every working stiff in the country is back to commuting to their workplace by now. In Canada AFAIK even provincial and municipal employees have been back in the office mostly like before, for quite some itme now.

[Acajack]

Originally Posted by dc_denizen

How can dc and Ottawa allow federal workers to phone it in 2 years after the pandemic , on the taxpayers dime no less

Most live on transit lines with short commute times . Meanwhile 20 something workers are having to work in horrifying social isolation . Its mind boggling that the feds allow this

It's mind-boggling to me as well. Yes, the main federal public service union n Canada is almost certain to go on strike in the new year, but the government here has never been afraid of strikes. And in this case, a strike was a possibility even without this return to the office order. It's just moved the needle from "likely" to "virtually certain".

And I said before: the Canadian public will have no sympathy for them.

As most of us know, strikes actually save the government money. They use the money they saved by not paying the strikers' salaries to partly pay for the pithy pay raises they'll end up awarding when it's settled.

[Yuri]

Ottawa had a very good 2021 Census. Relatively, the best in history, and it's now on the same growth bracket than Calgary and Edmonton. And as capital city, it took long to take off: Washington has been booming since the 1930's; Brasília since it was founded in 1960.

Do you guys think this slow pos-Covid recovery will damage Ottawa?

[Acajack]

Originally Posted by Yuri

Ottawa had a very good 2021 Census. Relatively, the best in history, and it's now on the same growth bracket than Calgary and Edmonton. And as capital city, it took long to take off: Washington has been booming since the 1930's; Brasília since it was founded in 1960.

Do you guys think this slow pos-Covid recovery will damage Ottawa?

Yes, Ottawa's population has continued to grow (like it always has), but this is not necessarily related to the vibrancy of the downtown - especially the CBD.

[kool maudit]

As in other places, working from home or remotely is much more established in Stockholm now. But as the city never locked down and never even made masking a social norm, let alone a law, the whole thing looks pretty similar to 2021, albeit a bit busier in the trains and such.

[chimpskibot]

Philly - downtown vacancies for office/retail/restaurants are still higher than 2019, but retail/restaurants are rebounding as is Hotel bookings and conventions. Some very promising signs is while the daytime worker population is about half if not a little more than half of 2019, the resident population is now >115% of 2019 so our downtown is growing in a more sustainable way. The neighborhoods around the downtown have also seen incomes rise since the last census boding well for future retail/restaurants and consumption. Public transit ridership is still way down and I am not sure if it will ever get back to 2019 levels without serious public safety measures as most new residents can afford a car or rideshare.

There is still a lot of work to do but the pandemic may have been a boon for Philly's population growth and attracting higher income earners who can work remotely and finally afford a house in a hip neighborhood/downtown.

https://centercityphila.org/research...-november-2022
https://centercityphila.org/research-reports

[chris08876]

Originally Posted by pdxtex

Be honest. As cities are finally opening up in earnest how would you rate your own city's performance? Are people returning to work? Do they continue to work from home? Any bright spots?

I'll answer this for NJ and NYC, just based on observations.

NJ has way more traffic and the cities seem way busier. A place like Newark, folks out and about, commuters, but some more evident grime on the street compared to pre-pandemic. I wouldn't say volume is what it was pre-pandemic but its getting there. The remote ability has cut into this but its not what it use to be during the plague. I know many folks that have had their work week split from all remote to going into the office 2 or 3 times a week, so this has aided. NJ even put a Return and Earn program in place, which seeks to get folks back into the office. IDK if its that effective but its a push.

I think with the recent push of many Wall Street firms to get folks back into the office, this will trickle to other places. Traffic though sucks.

On a tangent, I did notice grime in Atlanta when I was there, as with Newark NJ and NYC but its way more visible. A lot more homeless.

NYC streets are packed. A far cry from what it was 2 years ago. Traffic is back to mind numbing levels. Subway ridership and Path ridership is up but still below pre-pandemic levels. I believe 60 percent or so based on last that I've read or heard.

There's been a slight dip in NYC construction filings but plenty of projects in the pipeline. Not what it was pre-2020 but its still very robust. If interest rates go down, I think we are in store for a nice boom. NY was never dead as many proclaimed, still very well and alive.

[Obadno]

Phoenix metro was "closed" for about 3 weeks in April of 2020. We did have to deal with masks and half capacity restaurants for like a year though. But by early 2021 it was mostly lip service outside of Lyft/Uber and Airports.

As for Recovery, since this was a big place for people to come to during Covid we grew right on through and our entertainment/restaurant districts had more venues by the end of Covid than we started with. I know that wasn't the case everywhere. Also we have been major beneficiaries of the reshoring movement ever since covid and now Ukraine has messed up supply chains example TSMC (although that started before covid)

But we are really feeling it now, housing prices almost doubled in three years and local inflation in Phoenix metro is something like 11% annualized.

High growth matched with high inflation.

[Bailey]

Houston has been 100% back to normal for over a year now...closer to two.

[muertecaza]

Originally Posted by Obadno

Phoenix metro was "closed" for about 3 weeks in April of 2020. We did have to deal with masks and half capacity restaurants for like a year though. But by early 2021 it was mostly lip service outside of Lyft/Uber and Airports.

As for Recovery, since this was a big place for people to come to during Covid we grew right on through and our entertainment/restaurant districts had more venues by the end of Covid than we started with. I know that wasn't the case everywhere. Also we have been major beneficiaries of the reshoring movement ever since covid and now Ukraine has messed up supply chains example TSMC (although that started before covid)

But we are really feeling it now, housing prices almost doubled in three years and local inflation in Phoenix metro is something like 11% annualized.

High growth matched with high inflation.

Yeah, I think Tempe is at or near the construction levels of the pre-COVID boom it was experiencing, and construction never really stopped, just thinned out, during 2020-21. Our enduring COVID effect is definitely as you say inflation, last I saw a couple months ago we were still top in the nation.

[pdxtex]

Originally Posted by Obadno

Phoenix metro was "closed" for about 3 weeks in April of 2020. We did have to deal with masks and half capacity restaurants for like a year though. But by early 2021 it was mostly lip service outside of Lyft/Uber and Airports.

As for Recovery, since this was a big place for people to come to during Covid we grew right on through and our entertainment/restaurant districts had more venues by the end of Covid than we started with. I know that wasn't the case everywhere. Also we have been major beneficiaries of the reshoring movement ever since covid and now Ukraine has messed up supply chains example TSMC (although that started before covid)

But we are really feeling it now, housing prices almost doubled in three years and local inflation in Phoenix metro is something like 11% annualized.

High growth matched with high inflation.

I wish Portland had those problems. This place is populated by introvert shut ins. Many people are STILL wearing masks. My girlfriend and I are considering relocating. Her brother already moved to Knoxville and her parents are starting to talk about it too. Im not going to say the west is lost but there is so much civic disarray happening up and down the coast. The mood in the city is edgey as hell too. The mayor keeps losing key staff and he's facing a employees' revolt. Might be time to go back to Ann Arbor.

[dave8721]

Originally Posted by Acajack

I imagine that the US government in DC (and maybe some other cities) is in the same situation as the Canadian government and that it's locked into to a ton of long-term leases with commercial building owners that it cannot easily break.

So while in theory employees WFH offers massive potential savings on office space rent, cashing in on most of that is probably many, many years if not decades away. Though I assume they are saving a bit on office operational costs like electricity, toilet paper, etc., that WFH employees must bear at home.

The fact that government cost savings are hypothetical and very long term is balanced by political considerations: the government is under pressure not only from local business where their vacant offices are located, but also more generally public opinion (made up massively of people who don't work in government) which is very hostile to fat cats who still get to work at home whereas most every working stiff in the country is back to commuting to their workplace by now. In Canada AFAIK even provincial and municipal employees have been back in the office mostly like before, for quite some itme now.

I assume the US government owns most of its DC buildings where federal workings work.

[Acajack]

Originally Posted by dave8721

I assume the US government owns most of its DC buildings where federal workings work.

OK. AFAIK that is not the case for the Canadian government in Ottawa and Gatineau. But even so, those buildings still represent a significant investment for the US government. Assuming they'd want to offload them for money because they don't need as many, that would still take a tremendous amount of time to monetize.

[LA21st]

Originally Posted by dc_denizen

How can dc and Ottawa allow federal workers to phone it in 2 years after the pandemic , on the taxpayers dime no less

Most live on transit lines with short commute times . Meanwhile 20 something workers are having to work in horrifying social isolation . Its mind boggling that the feds allow this

I visited DC 4 times over the holidays.
It is nowhere near what it was.

The only parts of DC I saw with vibrancy were

Georgetown
14th street in Logan Circle
7th Street in Chinatown
18th in Adams Morgan
Pentagon City Mall was alive (crystal city mall is like something out of the walking dead)

Didn't visit the SW area or H street but I'm sure it's fine. DC city center had few pedestrians.

Dupont Circle, Foggy Bottom, Cleveland Park, even Adams Morgan were nothing like I remember and kinda depressing. K street, L street in downtown were ghost towns. There weren;t even that many tourists like before. DC should be worried about the downtown, it's not looking good. Metro wasn't really busy either and Arlington isn't doing much better than DC. I also visited in early November btw.

I'd def favor 14th street over anything else. That's a really cool area.

[LA21st]

Visited chicago in October. The Loop is....better than 2021 but the office corridors aren't doing well.

Michigan Ave looks close to what it was, at least with pedestrians. Most Chicago neighborhoods felt similar to pre covid. But the office stuff....

I think downtown DC is the most hit, but I haven't seen downtown SF yet.

[edale]

Not 100% on topic but....for whatever reason, the people in my office are insisting on wearing masks still, despite them being 'optional' since last summer. It's the only place in LA where I still see widespread mask wearing, and I find it incredibly annoying. It's bad enough we have to commute into the office again (hybrid schedule still, thank god), but to also have to sit at our desks with masks on just adds insult to injury. I don't see many/any people wearing masks at workout classes, hair/nail salons, restaurants/bars, movies, concerts, the theater, sporting events, shopping, grocery stores...and I assume my coworkers aren't masking in those locations either. But when we get to work, the performative BS kicks in, and everyone masks up like it's 2020 still. I resisted for a long time, but our general manager made an announcement at our last big staff meeting saying that 'while masks are optional, they remain HIGHLY ENCOURAGED to make everyone feel comfortable." So, lately, I've gone back to wearing a damn mask at least in meetings or in common areas.

For the portions on Downtown LA I'm regularly in, it feels maybe 70% recovered. There are a ton of retail vacancies around Civic Center and Little Tokyo. The homeless population seems as bad or worse than pre-pandemic, but there are less normal people around so they feel a bit more pronounced. But otherwise, most things seem relatively normal. I haven't used the Metro since the pandemic, but from friends who have, it continues to be a disaster. My coworker was nearly vomited on during his commute Monday morning, and said there was a fully naked man walking around the station where he got off. The Red Line was a shit show well before the pandemic, but it seems to have gotten much worse.

[pdxtex]

Reliance on software focused tech or civil services should now be considered a cautionary tale. Biotech, pharma, general stem and finance cities seem like they are doing the best.

[iheartthed]

Masks have become more visible in NYC again because of the winter wave but they're still a minority. Masks on public transit went from about 5-10% in the summer to about 40-50% recently. And I rarely see a mask in the office. Usually it's being worn by someone who doesn't come in often, or someone exercising caution after a potential exposure.