Completely abandoned city streets

[badrunner]

A street that was abandoned after it fell into the sea, taking a few houses along with it:

https://www.google.com/maps/@33.7057...!7i8704!8i4352

[homebucket]

Originally Posted by hipster duck

This even extends to Italian immigrant neighbourhoods in the new world; you can actually see the pre-war areas where Italian people settled in Toronto in satellite view, since those are the areas where the green colour of the tree canopy is conspicuously missing and all you see is bare roofs.

We live in a formely working class Italian part of town, and the first thing we did when we moved here was plant a tree in the front yard.

North Beach has a decent amount of trees considering SF isn't really a tree city.

https://goo.gl/maps/a2PHWTZZCjuJieYo7
https://goo.gl/maps/J6iw8T2RdG4tSj5W7
https://goo.gl/maps/mkqPnPiNy7WaQGeN6
https://goo.gl/maps/ac3JUS4PFYC5rBBg7
https://goo.gl/maps/r6K96qUkGXYX8vRJ8

[Crawford]

I've heard about this Italian-American aversion to street trees and greenery, anecdotally. Had a coworker with a dispute with Italian-American neighbors about tree coverage and landscaping. Also heard about Italian-American neighbors protesting the city installing street trees.

Just randomly Streetviewing around the most Italian-American parts of Brooklyn and Staten Island, not sure I'm seeing it. There are probably Mediterranean landscaping distinctions, as opposed to WASP norms, but not a huge difference. And these same areas nowadays tend to have lots of Greeks and former Soviets, so not sure what I'm looking at.

[Chisouthside]

Heart of Chicago Little Italy and Armour Square also have pretty decent tree coverage,

Originally Posted by Steely Dan

Chicago's "Little Italy" (what's left of it anyway) has decent tree coverage in places.

https://maps.app.goo.gl/dNQXmcWS6cnUZWnA9

[Crawford]

Are those areas heavily Italian-American in 2022, though?

Probably for Chicago somewhere around O'Hare or thereabouts. Norridge, Harwood Heights, Elmwood Park, maybe.

[Chisouthside]

Originally Posted by Crawford

Are those areas heavily Italian-American in 2022, though?

Probably for Chicago somewhere around O'Hare or thereabouts. Norridge, Harwood Heights, Elmwood Park, maybe.

Not heart of chicago, armour square moreso but also heavily chinese now.

Elmwood park not too sure, but the other two in general the northwest side of the city has pretty decent tree cover,

[3rd&Brown]

Originally Posted by Crawford

I've heard about this Italian-American aversion to street trees and greenery, anecdotally. Had a coworker with a dispute with Italian-American neighbors about tree coverage and landscaping. Also heard about Italian-American neighbors protesting the city installing street trees.

Just randomly Streetviewing around the most Italian-American parts of Brooklyn and Staten Island, not sure I'm seeing it. There are probably Mediterranean landscaping distinctions, as opposed to WASP norms, but not a huge difference. And these same areas nowadays tend to have lots of Greeks and former Soviets, so not sure what I'm looking at.

This is such a weird conversation but it is notable that there are very few street trees in South Philadelphia (a very Italian American neighborhood both historically and today...though it has plenty of other types of people who live there as well).

I know plenty of people who have anecdotally told me stories about their Italian neighbors butchering or removing trees because they're "dirty".

I would have to assume it's a class thing more than anything else. There are plenty of leafy areas in the Philly suburbs where Italians live with lush landscaping. Could also be a wasp versus non-wasp thing...i.e. the preference for types of landscaping.

[lio45]

Originally Posted by Crawford

Are those areas heavily Italian-American in 2022, though?

And even if they are genetically decently Italian-American nowadays, they're certainly not culturally very Italian at this point. People may have Italian surnames and Southern European looks, but their habits are likely thoroughly American by this point (3rd generation or more).

[lio45]

Originally Posted by 3rd&Brown

I know plenty of people who have anecdotally told me stories about their Italian neighbors butchering or removing trees because they're "dirty".

I've had tenants demand trees be removed because the leaves fall on their cars... (I've always said no to that.)

I did eliminate a big live oak, in coastal FL. The only reason to remove trees is in zones where you regularly get hurricanes. One year, I think it was 2016 with Matthew, one huge limb fell and came very close to falling on the house and through the roof.

[whatnext]

As a Canadian I find the shots of abandoned cities fascinating. As far as I know that phenomena doesn't really exist in Canada outside of some small prairie towns (excluding expropriated property but even that seems to be rare).

[Centropolis]

Originally Posted by Crawford

I've heard about this Italian-American aversion to street trees and greenery, anecdotally. Had a coworker with a dispute with Italian-American neighbors about tree coverage and landscaping. Also heard about Italian-American neighbors protesting the city installing street trees.

Just randomly Streetviewing around the most Italian-American parts of Brooklyn and Staten Island, not sure I'm seeing it. There are probably Mediterranean landscaping distinctions, as opposed to WASP norms, but not a huge difference. And these same areas nowadays tend to have lots of Greeks and former Soviets, so not sure what I'm looking at.

The Hill which is still pretty Italian American, more than any one neighborhood in the midwest maybe outside Chicago (or probably not?) has very thin street tree coverage on the street, anyway. Elderly white ethic neighbors of mine in south (st. louis) city HATED street trees.

feastmagazine.com

[edale]

Residential street in Cleveland's Little Italy:
https://www.google.com/maps/@41.5101...7i16384!8i8192

Also pretty barren. And this in the self-proclaimed "Forest City"!

[Centropolis]

residential side street on the hill, same deal. ive been to little italy in cleveland and aside from some architectural differences there were some striking aesthetic similarities. weirdly what remains of little italy in kansas city (columbus square) also has some similarities.

stl - lots of concrete, wild ass powerlines, and screw trees, treelawns, and setbacks ha! https://goo.gl/maps/Cp3m55YTLrxk4edB8

kc - https://goo.gl/maps/dcePDf1m3mNv9B2a8

[Centropolis]

both in kc and stl the little italy areas have their own architectural aesthetic and massing thats a bit different from the rest of the city. the hill in stl even has its own street grid.

[Acajack]

Originally Posted by Crawford

I've heard about this Italian-American aversion to street trees and greenery, anecdotally. Had a coworker with a dispute with Italian-American neighbors about tree coverage and landscaping. Also heard about Italian-American neighbors protesting the city installing street trees.
.

A certain class of Québécois French Canadians seems to be like this as well.

My city requires homeowners to have a tree out front with a minimal trunk diameter, and so many people either ignore it, or cut down mature trees when they buy a house, or plant some rump tree that is just barely compliant with the municipal regulation.

I really like trees (even big ones in front and around a house in general), but when I ask people about this they'll say that they don't want trees because "you can't see the house from the street!"

Some people even subtly "suggest" that I cut mine down for this reason.

[eschaton]

IMHO street trees are not needed everywhere. You don't really need them on zero-setback rowhouse streets (particularly narrow ones) as the street reads a lot more like an "outdoor room" than anything. But if there's any sort of recession from the street (even just for a porch) they make the street much nicer.

[MolsonExport]

Originally Posted by Acajack

A certain class of Québécois French Canadians seems to be like this as well.

My city requires homeowners to have a tree out front with a minimal trunk diameter, and so many people either ignore it, or cut down mature trees when they buy a house, or plant some rump tree that is just barely compliant with the municipal regulation.

I really like trees (even big ones in front and around a house in general), but when I ask people about this they'll say that they don't want trees because "you can't see the house from the street!"

Some people even subtly "suggest" that I cut mine down for this reason.

A lot of Asians (esp. South Asians) have this mindset. They can't understand why you would want "to hide your house".

Conspicuous consumption matters more to newcomers that like to showcase their success in their adopted homelands.

[lio45]

Trees do block the sun, and that's (mostly) a flaw, in Quebec summers. I'm a tree lover but there is that one property I have where I have deliberately always avoided planting anything on the front lawn greater than bushes and flowers, because the facade faces south and it's really nice to have the sunlight coming through the south-facing rooms.

Though my parents' house, which sits in the shade of a giant maple, is always cool in summer, no need for A/C at all thanks to that huge umbrella of a canopy.

[Obadno]

Originally Posted by photoLith

One of the most depressing places Ive been was Cairo, IL.

When I went about 10 years ago a good chunk of the downtown was still there, albeit abandoned. Looks like now nearly all of it is gone.

https://www.google.com/maps/@37.0006...7i13312!8i6656

Cairo may be getting a lifeline, shipping investment (private and gov) and increased river shipping might bring places like Cairo back.

There is a hopeful plan to build a new portage facility https://www.capitolnewsillinois.com/...rt-development

[lio45]

Originally Posted by MolsonExport

A lot of Asians (esp. South Asians) have this mindset. They can't understand why you would want "to hide your house".

Conspicuous consumption matters more to newcomers that like to showcase their success in their adopted homelands.

In WASP culture it's the opposite.

This is the McBain House, one of Sherbrooke's nicest Victorians:

https://www.google.com/maps/@45.4060...7i13312!8i6656



And here's what a peek behind that green curtain would show:

http://www.histoiresherbrooke.ca/sheet.php?uid=23106
http://www.histoiresherbrooke.ca/sheet.php?uid=23105