If the U.S. Collapses, What Would Be The Future of Your State (and City) - Page 7

JManc · #**121** Posted **Dec 19, 2022, 7:39 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by lio45

Makes no sense. Ohio is across Lake Erie. Physically separate.

I say run a Twitter poll of Ontarians to see whether they’d rather be merged with New York, Michigan, or Minnesota, and abide by the results.

Hawaii, Michigan and Newfoundland have entered the chat.

Quote:

Originally Posted by lio45

Toronto would get demoted from the New York of Canada that it currently is, to becoming the new Buffalo (NY State’s #2 city)

The Bills were threatening to move to Toronto anyway so folding Ontario into New York could mitigate them leaving the state.

Steely Dan · #**122** Posted **Dec 19, 2022, 8:13 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by lio45

Toronto would get demoted from the New York of Canada that it currently is, to becoming the new Buffalo (NY State’s #2 city)

or, keeping with the "east coast california" theme, Toronto would be the San Francisco of "New Yorktario", with Hamilton as its San Jose.

iheartthed · #**123** Posted **Dec 19, 2022, 8:18 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by lio45

I say run a Twitter poll of Ontarians to see whether they’d rather be merged with New York, Michigan, or Minnesota, and abide by the results.

Of these, Ontario + Michigan makes most sense to me. That would still create the third largest state/province in the U.S., Canada, and Mexico. Ontarigan could also probably catch Texas in a couple decades.

montréaliste · #**124** Posted **Dec 23, 2022, 3:38 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by lio45

The only redeeming quality of this suggestion would be the ease of finding a name for the merged entity: Ontahio

How ´bout Orio?

lio45 · #**125** Posted **Dec 23, 2022, 6:36 PM**

BTW, it’s pretty obvious that any province that would join the USA would do so by just becoming a state, no territory modification at all.

None of the “Alberta as the 51st state” plans and rants ever included it getting annexed by Montana.

Ontario makes sense as a geographical entity, and would be a top ten state at first sight (haven’t checked but pretty sure), it certainly wouldn’t merge with NY.

JManc · #**126** Posted **Dec 23, 2022, 8:04 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by lio45

BTW, it’s pretty obvious that any province that would join the USA would do so by just becoming a state, no territory modification at all.

None of the “Alberta as the 51st state” plans and rants ever included it getting annexed by Montana.

Ontario makes sense as a geographical entity, and would be a top ten state at first sight (haven’t checked but pretty sure), it certainly wouldn’t merge with NY.

Montana would take it by force. Invasion plans have been in the works for years.

bnk · #**127** Posted **Dec 23, 2022, 8:31 PM**

There have been many plans from both sides for a long time.

• Video Link

iheartthed · #**128** Posted **Dec 23, 2022, 9:25 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by lio45

Ontario makes sense as a geographical entity, and would be a top ten state at first sight (haven’t checked but pretty sure), it certainly wouldn’t merge with NY.

Yes, Ontario as a state would bump Pennsylvania from fifth place.

Quote:

Originally Posted by bnk

There have been many plans from both sides for a long time.

Between the U.S. and Canada, only one of those places has ever burned down the other's executive mansion, and it wasn't the United States.

JManc · #**129** Posted **Dec 24, 2022, 1:10 AM**

Canada wasn't really 'Canada' back then but Snow Brits who wrestled moose and drank maple syrup out of a tree.

mrnyc · #**130** Posted **Dec 24, 2022, 3:50 AM**

^ *cough, cough*

many paid hessian mercenaries have entered the chat.

Acajack · #**131** Posted **Dec 24, 2022, 1:17 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by lio45

BTW, it’s pretty obvious that any province that would join the USA would do so by just becoming a state, no territory modification at all.

None of the “Alberta as the 51st state” plans and rants ever included it getting annexed by Montana.

Ontario makes sense as a geographical entity, and would be a top ten state at first sight (haven’t checked but pretty sure), it certainly wouldn’t merge with NY.

Definitely agree that Canadian provinces would enter as is and not as parts of US states, but Ontario makes sense more as a geopolitical entity due to history and everything that is now set up administratively across its territory.

Not so much geographically.

There is no natural reason for Kenora or Thunder Bay or even Timmins and Sault-Sainte-Marie to be part of the same entity as Toronto, Ottawa and southern Ontario.

lio45 · #**132** Posted **Dec 24, 2022, 3:19 PM**

The Sault and TB make some sense as they are in the same Great Lakes system as Southern Ontario.

(Duluth and Chicago sharing a state makes more sense than Chicago and Cairo sharing a state, right?)

The other limits are arbitrary, I agree. Or at least, were arbitrary when they were set. Now they’re not arbitrary: that north-south line from James Bay has long-settled Québécois living on one side and long-settled Ontarians on the other, and same thing with the Ottawa River.

iheartthed · #**133** Posted **Dec 24, 2022, 6:56 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by JManc

Canada wasn't really 'Canada' back then but Snow Brits who wrestled moose and drank maple syrup out of a tree.

Politically correct wording in US history textbooks has just obscured the fact that it was indeed the Canucks who burned down your White House, lol.

mrnyc · #**134** Posted **Dec 26, 2022, 5:51 AM**

i feel like this thread is russian trollbot brigaded to game how to promote dissention that doesn't really exist.

pepper steak · #**135** Posted **Dec 26, 2022, 6:24 AM**

Canada burned down the White House. The US burned down all of Toronto lmao.

Quote:

Originally Posted by iheartthed

Between the U.S. and Canada, only one of those places has ever burned down the other's executive mansion, and it wasn't the United States.

Between April 28 and 30, American troops carried out many acts of plunder. Some of them set fire to the buildings of the Legislative Assembly, and Government House, home to the Lieutenant Governor of Upper Canada.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_York

If I was you guys I would brag more about 2010 and less about 1812.

iheartthed · #**136** Posted **Dec 26, 2022, 4:29 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by pepper steak

Canada burned down the White House. The US burned down all of Toronto lmao.

Between April 28 and 30, American troops carried out many acts of plunder. Some of them set fire to the buildings of the Legislative Assembly, and Government House, home to the Lieutenant Governor of Upper Canada.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_York

If I was you guys I would brag more about 2010 and less about 1812.

But we didn't burn down your executive's house, you monsters.

Obadno · #**137** Posted **Dec 27, 2022, 4:52 PM**

Canada is only "Independent" of the USA because there is no reason to conquer it. Its already de facto American territory.

SFBruin · #**138** Posted **Dec 28, 2022, 7:33 AM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by pepper steak

If I was you guys I would brag more about 2010

What happened in 2010?

isaidso · #**139** Posted **Dec 28, 2022, 10:40 AM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by Obadno

Canada is only "Independent" of the USA because there is no reason to conquer it. Its already de facto American territory.

Sounds eerily like the Russian mindset regarding Ukraine. The similarities don't stop there either.

It's from Ukraine that the Russian Empire rose and it's from present day Quebec that huge swaths of present day USA were explored, mapped out, and settled. All this yet many Russians view Ukraine as an appendage that should be part of Russia. I realize you were just stirring the pot but there are certainly factions within the US who view Canada in these terms: a US puppet state/Americans in waiting. Ukrainians were naive about their relationship with Russia and Canadians are naive about their relationship with the United States. When/if the US runs out of water/resources, American eyes will gaze north.

For Canada, the key to continued independence/self determination is to grow big enough, fast enough. Would a population of 80 million by 2100 secure our future as a strong sovereign nation? 100 million? 120 million? These are not things that 99% of the population ever think about but foreign policy think tanks absolutely do. Google 'Century Initiative' if you think they don't. Not only do they make strong arguments but they have the ear of the Federal government. Canada grew by 2.3% in 2022 or 866,000 people. Most of the impetus is economic but there's an important geo-political component to it too.

kool maudit · #**140** Posted **Dec 28, 2022, 11:29 AM**

120 million warm bodies does very little to the power relations involved. There are military questions. Canada does not maintain absolute control over its own airspace under the current NORAD structure, for example. If we attempted to change this, whether with 37 million people or 12 million, we'd feel the presence of the leash quite quickly. The realm of liberal democratic soft power in which Canada prefers to operate, population growth schemes included, is essentially that of the US hegemonic structure. The German and British leaders can be brought to heel with little struggle and these are respectively economic and nuclear great powers.

An independently-minded Canada, once it found its chosen point of difference, would find itself awash in Suezes quickly.