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  #41  
Old Posted Jun 4, 2008, 8:51 PM
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I don't particularly care if it's one builder, I just wish that Lennar would use multiple firms to design the buildings so that it isn't too "blah".

I'm interested to see what comes of the negotiations with the BOS and Mayor's office. I'm hoping for better transit connections, and to be honest, I would much prefer the 49ers not be a part of the plan. I'd much rather have space for a few thousand more jobs there, and take a trip south a few times a year for football. However, if that happens, I'd like the "Football stadium area" to be a bit more mixed use than they show it. It can be mostly "clean tech office", but the way it is kind of pressed against the water will make the area deader than dead on nights and weekends without something else to maintain activity.
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  #42  
Old Posted Jun 4, 2008, 9:10 PM
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I like the look of this project, it definitely would make it as an independent city/town which is nice. The large number of affordable housing and the desire to keep on par with density to the rest of San Francisco is a nice idea, I think there should be a slight increase in the density to make the area more affordable.

But overall, it will be fun to watch this project play out. We have a spot in Portland just outside of downtown that I would love to see this kind of development to happen in. These kinds of developments are a great way for moving a city forward.
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  #43  
Old Posted Jun 4, 2008, 10:59 PM
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Originally Posted by Gordo View Post
I don't particularly care if it's one builder, I just wish that Lennar would use multiple firms to design the buildings so that it isn't too "blah".
My understanding is it's to be built over quite a few years so I'm guessing they will do that. I wouldn't even be surprised if they sell parts of the land to other developers much like what is being done at Mission Bay, which, if you recall, was a single developer (Catelllus) to begin with.
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  #44  
Old Posted Jun 5, 2008, 3:44 AM
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actually alot of times a developer likes to be the sole developer to have first dibs on anything within the project, then as time goes on, they sometimes sell off to other developers to make more money off the project. It is a typical practice for these big developments.
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  #45  
Old Posted Jun 5, 2008, 5:17 AM
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Originally Posted by BTinSF View Post
My understanding is it's to be built over quite a few years so I'm guessing they will do that. I wouldn't even be surprised if they sell parts of the land to other developers much like what is being done at Mission Bay, which, if you recall, was a single developer (Catelllus) to begin with.
That certainly may end up being the case.

Of course, if I had my way the project would progress much faster
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  #46  
Old Posted Jun 8, 2008, 12:34 PM
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With the cost of gasoline not going down and continuing to go up, wouldn't a location smack in the center of the Bay Area (like, you know, San Francisco) be the only logical spot for a 49er stadium? And that SF has the transportation infrastructure that Santa Clara lacks also adds to the allure of the city.

If you concede East Bay to the Raiders and stick west of the bay in a Marin/SF/Peninsula/Silicon Valley axis, the city comes up smelling like roses for fans who don't want to make a long trek to South Bay by car.

Look, nobody is going to build this thing for quite a while, not with the current economy. No place in the US will be breaking ground for new stadiums for a long time after the Yankees, Mets, Twins, Giants/Jets, and Cowboys have finished up construction.

But my guess is when that time comes when such a project returns to any degree of feasability (and that feasability will from this point forward be dependent on the teams, not tax payers, doing most of the financing), SF will look a helluva lot more inviting than Santa Clara.
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  #47  
Old Posted Jun 9, 2008, 7:39 PM
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the center of the Bay Area (like, you know, San Francisco)
Are there as many people just north of SF as there are just south? NOPE
Are there as many people just west of SF as there are just east? NOPE

I'm not against a stadium there at all, but that's poor justification.
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  #48  
Old Posted Jun 9, 2008, 9:44 PM
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Plus, the Santa Clara site is more transit-friendly than Hunters Point. Can that be changed? Perhaps. But as it is now, the SC site has a light rail line that connects to Caltrain right in front of it - Hunters Point, eh, not so much.

edsg25, the stadium could be built fairly soon - it isn't housing or offices. If Santa Clara decides to fork over a boat load of money to the 49ers (I don't really think they should, but it will be on the ballot) there will be no delay in construction.
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  #49  
Old Posted Jun 10, 2008, 12:44 AM
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Originally Posted by krudmonk View Post
Are there as many people just north of SF as there are just south? NOPE
Are there as many people just west of SF as there are just east? NOPE

I'm not against a stadium there at all, but that's poor justification.
if you went by that literal of a definition, they would have to build the stadium on top of the san mateo bridge.
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  #50  
Old Posted Jun 10, 2008, 2:10 AM
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if you went by that literal of a definition, they would have to build the stadium on top of the san mateo bridge.
So then why not somewhere near that, if centrality is truly a key issue?
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  #51  
Old Posted Jun 10, 2008, 5:31 AM
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available land would be my first assumption.
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  #52  
Old Posted Sep 3, 2008, 2:04 AM
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Lennar Megaproject Survives
By MICHAEL CORKERY
September 2, 2008; Page B11

Lennar Corp.'s multiyear, billion-dollar effort to develop decrepit former military properties on San Francisco's waterfront has tapped a new financing source, underscoring the home builder's success in doing deals to survive the wretched housing market.

Lennar says it has formed a new venture with Ross Perot Jr.'s Hillwood Development Co., and the investment firm Scala Real Estate Partners LP. The venture is taking equity stakes in massive projects at former military properties across San Francisco, including a project at Hunter's Point, which would bring development to one of the city's poorest neighborhoods.

The new venture replaces the 50% stake held by LNR Property Corp., a unit of Cerberus Capital Management, in the Hunter's Point project. It also is taking half of Lennar's 50% stake in another ambitious development project on Treasure Island, home to a former naval barracks and sweeping city views.

The venture is taking half of Lennar's 100% stake in Candlestick Point, the possible new home for the San Francisco 49ers, according to Lennar. The builder will continue to manage the projects. The developments are slated to create thousands of units of housing. The venture also took a stake in land on the New Jersey waterfront across from Manhattan.

As part of the deal, sealed during the weekend, the Lennar-Hillwood-Scala venture paid $145 million in cash to LNR, Lennar and the partner in the New Jersey project. Hillwood and Scala have committed to providing long-term financing to the projects, which could take 10 or more years to complete.

The capstone of Lennar's megaprojects in San Francisco are Hunter's Point and Candlestick Point, which were acquired from the city for a nominal fee. Lennar and its partners have agreed to spend more than $1 billion building thousands of affordable rental and for-sale housing, along with parks and a site for a new stadium for the National Football League's 49ers. The first large phase of the project is to begin in 2010.

"We now have strategic partners committed to 50% of the cost going forward," says Emile Haddad, Lennar's chief investment officer, who negotiated the deal for the builder. "They are committing hundreds of millions of dollars."

The San Francisco venture reflects the strength of the city's housing market, where values have held up amid the national downturn -- and Lennar's ability to close land deals in such an atmosphere.

In March 2007, the builder and LNR turned heads when they reduced their stakes in a venture called LandSource. An investment vehicle for the California Public Employees' Retirement System paid about $920 million for a 68% stake in LandSource, while Lennar and LNR each received $660 million in cash from the deal. LandSource filed for bankruptcy-court protection in June.

In December 2007, Lennar sold 11,000 house lots to a venture mostly owned by Morgan Stanley's real-estate arm for $525 million, which was about 60% less than what Lennar carried the land on its books. Since then, land values in some of the markets where the lots are located have continued to erode.

Hillwood has experience developing big projects such as the Fort Worth Alliance Airport and the American Airlines Center basketball arena in Dallas. Irvine Calif.-based Scala has been focusing on buying land during the real-estate downturn.

Write to Michael Corkery at michael.corkery@wsj.com1
Source: http://online.wsj.com/article/SB122031504873289109.html
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  #53  
Old Posted Sep 3, 2008, 3:20 AM
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There was an article in the Chronicle as well. So, does this mean Lennar is funded to begin construction specifically at Hunter's Point (pending approvals, of course)? Or does this just put Lennar in a stronger financial position overall, which gives it a better chance down the road?
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  #54  
Old Posted Sep 3, 2008, 8:32 AM
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These deals seem to pertain to specific projects. At Hunter's Point, I read this as saying they've replaced partner Cerberus Capital, which is having troubles of its own, with new partners Hillwood Development and Scala Real Estate Partners. These companies are also becoming partners in Candlestick Point and Treasure Island.

What it all means to me is that Lennar has the money to proceed with the projects. Like all the other national home builders, they've had to write down the value of lots they've been holding for future development but that in itself hasn't put them in financial jeopardy--it's paper loses mostly.

Aside from this article (and the one in the Chron), my own assessment has been that the largest public home builders like Lennar (and Toll, Pulte, Horton, KB Home and so on) will come out of this housing situation stronger than ever because they can raise new capital and take advantage of the losses (or bankruptcies) of smaller private builders.
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  #55  
Old Posted Jan 15, 2009, 7:01 PM
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Quote:
THURSDAY, JANUARY 15, 2009

Not Enough Green in Hunters Point Plan, Report Says



A report by two enviro/planning outfits says megadeveloper Lennar's designs on Superfun Superfund site Hunters Point don't give enough priority to the area's natural wildlife and "ecological assets." For one thing, they'd like a bridge connecting two land parcels across Yosemite Slough to be reconsidered because of its potential impact on the environment. Plus, they say, there's not enough space in Lennar's plan for natural habitat, and if that 49ers stadium gets built, there'll be even less. In a perfect world, the two organizations say a rejiggering of the Hunters Point development to have denser housing would provide more open space. The city appears to be more or less meh on the issues raised in the report, though they will seek the authors' endorsements to get the monster project moving along. If all goes well, approval might happen as soon as fall of this year, with completion in 15 years.
Source: http://sf.curbed.com/

Quote:
City's Candlestick plan under fire
Robert Selna, Chronicle Staff Writer
Thursday, January 15, 2009

A plan for turning San Francisco's Candlestick Point and the Hunters Point Shipyard into a neighborhood and business district twice the size of Treasure Island - one that could include a new 49ers stadium - fails to focus enough on the area's natural ecology, according to a report due today from environmental groups.



The 133-page report by ARC Ecology and Bionic, both environmental and planning organizations, suggests that the city and Lennar Corp. have tried to force their development ideas onto an area that includes important wildlife habitat instead of building a project that prioritizes and protects nature.

The result, according to the report, is less parkland, fragmented habitats and a bridge traversing a natural waterway - as well as a large stadium near parkland that will be used only eight to 10 times annually for football and infrequently the rest of the year.

"We are looking at the natural configuration of the land and its ecological assets, and we are interested in having a dialogue with the city about it," said Saul Bloom, executive director of ARC Ecology. "We are using the same ingredients as the city and have a lot of the same objectives, but we see a different way to do it."

The city's complete plan is scheduled to get a public airing before two public advisory groups tonight. The city will seek the groups' endorsement of the plan in the next couple of weeks, a significant step toward completing the massive development that 61 percent of city voters endorsed in June.

City officials say they believe their approach combines the best design with the most public benefits, while also being financially realistic for Lennar and its partners.

"We've done an immense study on all of the opportunities and constraints of this project," said Michael Cohen, director of the city's Office of Workforce and Economic Development. "We've looked at how much retail and housing there should be and how much research and development the market can absorb. The mix of the housing is based on a very sophisticated analysis of the market's ability to absorb the units."

A finance plan released in October showed that Lennar and its partners would invest $618 million in the project. In exchange, the city would provide the land. An additional $1.4 billion would be raised mainly through tax-exempt government bonds.

Approval possible by fall

Some of the plan's details may change before it is presented to the Board of Supervisors and other city commissions for approval, which could happen as soon as fall 2009. Construction could be completed in 15 years.

As it stands, three- and four-story townhomes, midrise buildings and towers would accommodate 10,000 residential units. The housing would be both connected and separate from 900,000 square feet of retail space, and buildings dedicated to research-and development-companies and other businesses would occupy an area equivalent in size to 44 football fields.

A 900-foot roadway

Sixty-two acres of sports fields would sit adjacent to parkland and, possibly, a new 69,000-seat football stadium. If the 49ers move to Santa Clara, additional research and development space would be built in the stadium's place.

The city's vision also calls for building a 900-foot roadway across Yosemite Slough to connect the two major land parcels.

Among other concerns, the ARC report argues that the city's approach takes away 23 percent of existing parkland. If the development were built more densely, not as much parkland would be lost, Bloom said.

And while city officials see a Yosemite Slough bridge as the best way to connect Candlestick and the shipyard, Bloom argues that it cuts people and wildlife off from the waterway. Traversing the slough with a man-made bridge detracts from the environmental experience and could subject wildlife to harmful pollutants, according to Bloom.

Cohen and development adviser Dean Macris acknowledged that the environmental impacts of the bridge needed more study. But they argued that it was the best way to connect the two sites and improve transportation.

Parks to be 'infinitely better'

City officials say their plan for 300 acres of parks and open space is based on the desires of existing neighborhood residents, citywide needs and the interests of the state parks department.

"I think we've made the overwhelming case that the parks will be infinitely better than they were before," Cohen said.

Macris said that if the stadium is built, it makes most sense to place it near the fields that will also serve as parking.

Team spokeswoman Lisa Lang said Wednesday that Santa Clara remains the team's first choice for a new home, even though a stadium deal there is not assured.

The ARC report suggested several alternatives for the stadium, including moving it to a site closer to the bay that is slated for housing.

"I strongly disagree with that," said Macris, the city's former planning chief. "You wouldn't be taking advantage of the bay views, and where would you put the parking?"

Get involved

The city's design plan for the development will be discussed in front of two advisory groups tonight, from 6 p.m. to 8 p.m. at 1800 Oakdale Ave. For more information on the project, go to links.sfgate.com/ZFWG.

E-mail Robert Selna at rselna@sfchronicle.com.
Source: http://sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cg...BA1U15ADDM.DTL
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  #56  
Old Posted Jan 15, 2009, 7:49 PM
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I'm a fan of open space and natural landscape. But this is a superfund site that used to be military shipyards (and Candlestick is landfill, isn't it?). Any new parkland or greenspace is going to be a net gain. I'm not sure what natural state is supposed to be restored here.
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  #57  
Old Posted Jan 15, 2009, 8:02 PM
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What they want is more density in the development leaving more open space. Anybody here really opposed to that?
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  #58  
Old Posted Jan 15, 2009, 8:16 PM
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Of course not. But I've read elsewhere that one of the concerns is that not enough has been done to return it to its natural state. If what they really mean is create more density, then fine.
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  #59  
Old Posted Jan 15, 2009, 8:17 PM
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If the open space is configured to be used, then I'm fine with more open space in exchange for increased density on the remainder. I don't really think that open space that is not parkland of some type is appropriate for this area though.
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  #60  
Old Posted Apr 7, 2009, 2:47 PM
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Hunters Point Redevelopment Architecture To Mimic Mission Bay
via: http://www.socketsite.com/



Quote:
The architectural stylings for the redevelopment of Hunters/Candlestick Point have been revealed. And based on the proposed designs for the "model" blocks, think Mission Bay:

One of the blocks, on the north side of Innes Avenue between Donahue and Friedell streets, will become the site of 63 square-edged, predominantly white-and-gray, for-sale condominiums in a glass-covered, four-story building with covered private parking, a central courtyard and rooftop gathering space, the plans show.
On the other side of Innes Avenue, 25 for-sale townhomes painted with earth-toned colors will line opposite sides of a new alley, which will provide access to nonstreet-fronting ground-floor garages with 36 parking spaces.
Construction on the 88-condos could begin by the end of the year with market-rate price points currenlty expected to range from $400,000 to $700,000.
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