Africa's Rising Cities: How Africa will become the center of the world’s urban future

[iheartthed]

Originally Posted by JManc

The US was blossoming into a major global economic power. Nigeria's economy is quite limited. If Lagos/ Nigeria do modernize, it won't be in our lifetimes as the vast majority of the city is underdeveloped and it would take a monumental amount of money, political will and resources just to pave the entire city and install sewage.

It is a pretty standard path in economies mature. The act of modernizing itself will create industry and jobs.

[eschaton]

Originally Posted by BG918

If you’re looking for a model African city look no further than Cape Town. Yes it has it slums but overall functions extremely well and is in a beautiful setting.

It's pretty goddamned segregated still though.

White area - could pass for Australia/New Zealand

Coloured area - Nice for Africa

Black area - Only a slight step up from elsewhere in Africa. And sometimes, not even a step up - other than paved roads I guess.

[niwell]

Originally Posted by BG918

If you’re looking for a model African city look no further than Cape Town. Yes it has it slums but overall functions extremely well and is in a beautiful setting.

It's a beautiful setting and has some great areas but not sure you can say that unless you ignore the entirety of the Cape Flats. Personally found it to be a fairly unfriendly and segregated city too - the saying "Cape Town turns it's back on Africa" has a lot of truth to it. Also happens to be the only place in SA I personally experienced crime despite living in "scary" Joburg.

All of South Africa's major cities have a leg up on the rest of the (sub-Saharan) continent in terms of infrastructure, though a lot of systemic cracks are rearing their head. Particularly during COVID as the economy has struggled badly. Rural towns are in pretty bad shape in a lot of areas.

[sopas ej]

It's funny how some of you think that these African cities somehow won't evolve for the better, if not in terms of how some of us like "urbanism," at least in the living conditions of the people, once their economies get richer... hopefully their governments won't turn their backs on their people.

Originally Posted by homebucket

Once the Chinese fully get their hands on these African cities, they’ll be the next Shanghai, Beijing, Guangzhou, Shenzhen, Chongqing, and Chengdus.

Yes; hopefully these investments will be good for the people of Africa. Western powers have long exploited Africa's resources and its people, and pretty much currently now looks at Africa as a charity case. China has been heavily investing in Africa (and Latin America too)... I just hope China doesn't go the route of just further exploitation.

[edale]

Originally Posted by eschaton

It's pretty goddamned segregated still though.

White area - could pass for Australia/New Zealand

Coloured area - Nice for Africa

Black area - Only a slight step up from elsewhere in Africa. And sometimes, not even a step up - other than paved roads I guess.

To be fair, you could say largely the same thing for many cities in the US.

[Manitopiaaa]

Originally Posted by Steely Dan

i gotta admit, street-viewing around Lagos is eye-opening.

the garbage-strewn open sewers everywhere, the ramshackle housing, the grayed-out smog-filled skies, the random collections of old junk littered about , etc.

sure, it might be very active and mixed-use and "fascinating", but man does it ever look pretty dystopian.

it kinda looks like one big giant cholera outbreak just waiting to happen.

i get that too clean can be "too clean", but Lagos takes things way too far in the other direction IMO.

I really feel for the people who have to live in Lagos. It seems to have so little going for it. Ugly, trash-strewn beaches, extremely overcrowded, high poverty and inequality, dangerous (the State Department warns people not to go outside after 9-10pm), the topography is flat and the ground is mostly dirt, very few trees, the weather is extremely hot and muggy, yet also very cloudy (only 12% chance of having partly sunny weather or better in May). Very little historic architecture, and most culture (art galleries, concerts) is walled-off in elite compounds and inaccessible to 99% of the population.

And yet, it's not even close to the worst place in Nigeria.

Go to the Northeast like Borno State and you have the female mutilation, fundamentalist Islam, Boko Haram kidnapping young girls and murdering farm boys, extreme corruption, climate change quickly expanding the Sahara Desert southward.

For all we complain on this forum about "housing prices are up 10%!!!!11!," there are far worse challenges people are facing in this planet.

[eschaton]

Originally Posted by sopas ej

It's funny how some of you think that these African cities somehow won't evolve for the better, if not in terms of how some of us like "urbanism," at least in the living conditions of the people, once their economies get richer... hopefully their governments won't turn their backs on their people.

I mean, it may happen, but it's really staggering how little progress the four dozen or so countries in Sub-Saharan Africa have had up until now.

In terms of middle-ish income areas, you have the island nations like the Seychelles, Mauritius, and Cape Verde, which don't provide a good development model for the rest of the continent. You have Gabon and Equatorial Guinea, which are rich due to petrodollars, but in practice the ruling class hoards most of the money and the population isn't well off. Then there's Djibouti (by virtue of its strategic port), Botswana (by virtue of diamond mining - and actual decent fiscal management), Namibia, and South Africa (both of which have the highest income inequality in the world, meaning the poor don't live appreciably different from elsewhere in Africa).

Lots of very poor African nations have economies growing at rapid rates. However, they were growing from such a low base that it will take generations to even become middle-income nations. Somewhere like the Congo could see per-capita income increase by 1000%...and still only be at the level of Paraguay or Jamaica.

Things will get better in Sub-Saharan Africa, I'm sure. But there's no sign of anything like the "Asian Tigers" on the horizon.

[Crawford]

I wonder if Somalia has long-term potential for beach tourism. It has the longest oceanfront in Africa and supposedly has nice sugar-sand beaches. I believe the Italians built some (now destroyed) beach resorts in the post WW2 era. But, yeah, it's Somalia.

[eschaton]

Originally Posted by Crawford

I wonder if Somalia has long-term potential for beach tourism. It has the longest oceanfront in Africa and supposedly has nice sugar-sand beaches. I believe the Italians built some (now destroyed) beach resorts in the post WW2 era. But, yeah, it's Somalia.

I would think the issue would be lack of proximity to anywhere high income. Generally popular tourist areas are relatively close to high-income zones (Caribbean for the U.S., the Mediterranean for Europe, etc.). The nearest rich area is the Persian Gulf, but there are plenty of decent beaches closer if people want to go in the water (though it doesn't seem as popular in Muslim nations anyway - probably because of the cultural need for "modest swimwear" for women).

[iheartthed]

Originally Posted by eschaton

I would think the issue would be lack of proximity to anywhere high income. Generally popular tourist areas are relatively close to high-income zones (Caribbean for the U.S., the Mediterranean for Europe, etc.). The nearest rich area is the Persian Gulf, but there are plenty of decent beaches closer if people want to go in the water (though it doesn't seem as popular in Muslim nations anyway - probably because of the cultural need for "modest swimwear" for women).

Seychelles, Madagascar, and Tanzania are tourist hotspots, and Kenya is starting to develop into one as well. They're all farther from Europe than Somalia is.

[Crawford]

Yeah, the Indian Ocean has some popular tourist destinations like Seychelles and Mauritius. It seems like half my office has been to one of the two, usually for a honeymoon, or couples vacation.

That said, I don't think Caribbean- or Med-style mass tourism is likely. It tends to attract a more high-end demographic. And not sure if Somalia could recreate the island paradise vibe of a Mauritius.

My sister has been to Madagascar and Mozambique, for a beach-safari vacation, right before she started having kids, but I don't think that's super common.

[JManc]

Originally Posted by sopas ej

Yes; hopefully these investments will be good for the people of Africa. Western powers have long exploited Africa's resources and its people, and pretty much currently now looks at Africa as a charity case. China has been heavily investing in Africa (and Latin America too)... I just hope China doesn't go the route of just further exploitation.

China isn't pouring tons of money into Africa out of the goodness of their hearts but 'buy' loyalty and pull the continent under their sphere of influence. The west simply conquered or toppled regimes in the past. China is trying a newer/ more subtle approach but they're not going to recreate Shanghai or Shenzhen but invest and redevelop enough to meet their strategic interests.

[mrnyc]

LAGOS BAY BEE!

[homebucket]

Originally Posted by JManc

China isn't pouring tons of money into Africa out of the goodness of their hearts but 'buy' loyalty and pull the continent under their sphere of influence. The west simply conquered or toppled regimes in the past. China is trying a newer/ more subtle approach but they're not going to recreate Shanghai or Shenzhen but invest and redevelop enough to meet their strategic interests.

Key LIB minerals are available in ample quantities in South Africa (manganese, nickel and platinum), Democratic Republic of Congo (DRC) (cobalt), Zimbabwe (lithium), Mozambique (graphite) and Zambia (copper). The Chinese own and operate multiple mining operations in their quest to seize the EV market. If they own these minerals, all future battery production runs through them.

[eschaton]

Originally Posted by JManc

China isn't pouring tons of money into Africa out of the goodness of their hearts but 'buy' loyalty and pull the continent under their sphere of influence. The west simply conquered or toppled regimes in the past. China is trying a newer/ more subtle approach but they're not going to recreate Shanghai or Shenzhen but invest and redevelop enough to meet their strategic interests.

It should also be noted that China is literally "colonizing" Africa insofar as there are somewhere around 500,000 Chinese nationals living across the continent now. They're pretty much evenly split between contract workers (who act as supervisors/managers/skilled workers on the big new Chinese-funded infrastructure projects) and more permanent migrants who move to Africa and set up small businesses.

[MolsonExport]

Originally Posted by mrnyc

LAGOS BAY BEE!

"The most unbounded wealth is the neighbor of the most hideous poverty...the crumbs which fall from the tables of the rich would appear delicious viands to starving millions, and yet these millions obtain them not! In that city there are in all five prominent buildings: the church, in which the pious pray; the gin-palace, to which the wretched poor resort to drown their sorrows; the pawn-broker's, where miserable creatures pledge their raiment, and their children's raiment, even unto the last rag, to obtain the means of purchasing food, and – alas! too often – intoxicating drink; the prison, where the victims of a vitiated condition of society expiate the crimes to which they have been drive by starvation and despair; and the workhouse, to which the destitute, the aged, and the friendless hasten to lay down their aching heads – and die!"[56]

- George W. M. Reynolds, 1844, on London, England.

[JHikka]

Originally Posted by eschaton

It should also be noted that China is literally "colonizing" Africa insofar as there are somewhere around 500,000 Chinese nationals living across the continent now. They're pretty much evenly split between contract workers (who act as supervisors/managers/skilled workers on the big new Chinese-funded infrastructure projects) and more permanent migrants who move to Africa and set up small businesses.

This works in the inverse, as well. There's a good number of African students in Chinese universities. The ICEF reports that number as being 74,011 students from Africa, second only to France. Leading countries of students to China are Ghana, Nigeria, and Ethiopia. Morocco and Algeria make up nearly half of France's cohort. The article points out that it's becoming increasingly common to find African government officials who have been taught in China, and that it's particularly useful for the future as they'll be more adept at understanding and negotiating with China.

[Obadno]

Originally Posted by edale

To be fair, you could say largely the same thing for many cities in the US.

To be fair there is nowhere in north America that looks like an African slum.

You can find a block abandoned rowhouses in Camden and an abandoned factory in Detroit that comes close, but they are abandoned.

There is nothing like the Slums of India, or Africa or South America in the USA and hasn't been for at least a century if truly ever.

[Obadno]

Originally Posted by MolsonExport

- George W. M. Reynolds, 1844, on London, England.

But the mid 1800's were actually a period of economic degradation in England

It was more prosperous before and shortly after this quote.

[eschaton]

Originally Posted by Obadno

To be fair there is nowhere in north America that looks like an African slum.

You can find a block abandoned rowhouses in Camden and an abandoned factory in Detroit that comes close, but they are abandoned.

There is nothing like the Slums of India, or Africa or South America in the USA and hasn't been for at least a century if truly ever.

Building codes worked wonders, though a nation needs to be wealthy enough to build public housing to make up the difference. I think this is beyond even most middle-income countries, TBH.

If we're talking about South Africa though, I don't think the worst housing in the townships is that different from some housing you find on Indian reservations.