How Is Your Life Different Now Than When You Joined SSP?

[Architype]

Originally Posted by biguc

I was like 16 when I joined....

When I saw 16, I thought, god that's young, but at least now you are mid 30s. I think I've read a lot of your posts and you seem very intelligent, well informed etc., probably smarter than me, regardless of age. The more smart, informed & pleasantly reasonable people we have here is what makes it worth being a part of.

And I finally realized that Pinkoland is Germany. LOL.

[niwell]

Oh man this is making me feel both nostalgic and older than I normally do.

I started lurking in 2001 during my first year in University, but didn't join for a few more years. Found the site from the diagrams originally. Not sure what prompted me to start posting but could have been that some of the sites I previously frequented had more or less disappeared / my interests changed. At that time I was living in Ottawa and realizing I didn't particularly care for studying engineering or like most engineering students, was in my first long-term relationship and starting to look at options for doing a Master's in planning.

Fast forward almost two decades and I live in Toronto with a permanent career (the pension golden handcuffs), have been married for 3 years with no kids so far but a very large dog that takes up hours of every day. We just bought a house outside the city for use as a secondary residence. Had the chance to travel to a bunch of places and live abroad. Still passionate about urban planning but am a lot more pessimistic realistic about outcomes that can be achieved in Canadian cities. This board definitely helped out with a few life decisions and general insight - including what *not* to do sometimes!

Life is pretty good, really.

Originally Posted by biguc

That was a good time in my life to join this board. I learned that if I expressed myself well and addressed people with respect, they would respond in kind. Even if they were older and smarter than me.
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I think I've finally dialed in an acceptable balance between actively posting, lurking, and logging out in disgust.

Both very astute! While I didn't join SSP till I was a bit older, this style of online forum was generally much more accepting and able to guide younger posters than others. Had the same experience on different ones while I was in high school. Always wondered if there will be a bit of a return to forums (though they never really left) than other forms of online discourse.

I've tried to maintain the same attitude about posting these days. Also with the nostalgia posts going around makes me realize I should have sent a PM as I was just in Berlin for a week including 4 days to myself - though I certainly found enough things to do to pass the time. And enough beer.

[kool maudit]

I think the first time I joined was when I was living in St-Henri in 1999, although this account is probably a few years younger. I didn't really know what I was doing with myself back then, although cities and their aesthetics had a very powerful hold on me. The St-Henri of the late '90s was still a real relic of a place, all abandoned industrial giants and passing trains. Those were ghost years, years spent just taking in scenes, and then came the "Montreal might eat its young" Mile-End phase after an abortive London period. What can you say? It was both a wild and a somewhat limited place and way to be young and then not-so-young.

And now, following a Balkan coda, I am a bourgeois in Scandinavia. It all feels so long and yet so short looking back. Funny to think I have been here for all of it.

[lio45]

I joined this forum because I had a portfolio of mixed use buildings in the heart of my hometown's downtown, and wanted to discuss urban affairs in that city with other interested people (there was an active SSP discussion thread at the time).

Over 15 years later... what's "changed" is that I have a lot more buildings (and the main thing that's "new" is that they're not all in the same city anymore, though still very concentrated).

Very little has changed, actually. Not sure if that's good or bad lol

[lio45]

Originally Posted by niwell

... but am a lot more pessimistic realistic about outcomes that can be achieved in Canadian cities.

Same here.

[Acajack]

My story is completely boring compared to others.

I see I joined in August 2006. I would have been in my mid to late 30s then.

I never lurked on here. Can't remember what the topic was but I think it may have been related to suburbia. Saw something I wanted to comment on, joined and posted right away. I believe I may have responded to long-gone Habsfan33(?). Not the same poster as Habfanman.

Today, I have the same house, same type of job pretty much, same wife, same kids (they were already born back then).

I've never met any SSPer in person though I've come close a few times. I have "private message relationships" with a very small number of SSPers, but even those exchanges are sporadic.

My views on cities have been enriched by my years on SSP, and my visions of Canada and the world have also been greatly influenced by it too.

[kool maudit]

Originally Posted by lio45

Same here.

One of the things that hanging out here for so long has demonstrated is that the lives of cities are much longer than those of men, and so they change much more slowly. The obverse being that in many ways they are what they are, even the very dynamic ones.

Something you used to see a lot of here was the guy who would sign up from someplace, usually a high-growth area, and he would be full of news about the proposed towers, the redevelopment plans and the architectural renderings. The promise was always that in just a few years time, his hometown would be something altogether different, just an entirely different tier of beast.

And this can happen, in some cases, but it takes decades, and while your city moves, all the others do too.

The extreme versions of this were usually regarded as such on here, but the general dynamic of SSP favours at least a subtler form of it. When I moved to Montreal, for instance, I was blown away at how much the city resembled the metropolitan archetype I had in my mind. Given the lag time involved in the formation of such aesthetics, that probably meant it was a very powerful kind of mid-20th century vision.

But there were problems. There were views that seemed incomplete and elements that were jarring and did not fit with the archetype. And so, rendering by rendering, plan by plan, there was a sense in which I came to see Montreal as incomplete but drawing nearer. My enthusiasm for the new projects, which were pretty thin on the ground back then, was part of a desire to join the living city to the internal vision.

Someone123 had a great post years ago on this. It was a throwaway, and I am not even sure he'd remember it, but out of frustration with some City Discussions thread in which some city was being dismissed for its lack of tenement rows and deco Goliaths, he asked "are we sure we are not just cargo-culting New York here?"

I am not sure I wasn't just cargo-culting New York. There is probably a narrative in which I should have been in New York, and that constructs like "my metropolitan archetype" were just reheated images of Manhattan.

Kilgore Trout and I, for instance, are two of this forum's longtime Montreal adopters, or converts. But he is there and I am not, and I think looking back that he always had a more thoughtful and more realistic affection for the city as it was. I am not saying it's binary, or that I had no appreciation for Montreal beyond a hazy, post-industrial city blur. I lived there for 16 years and I loved the place. But cities are what they are, and I had part of one foot, at least, in "what might be, what could have been and Manhattan."

You lose this over time. Stockholm is only Stockholm. I can smile to myself on Valhallavägen at how close it looks (on those few blocks) to the European version of the metropolitan vision, that slice of imperial Vienna, but Stockholm is Stockholm.

If I wanted New York I would have to try and get there. And if I wanted some hazy collage of images associated with either New York or Vienna in some past colourful period, there are coffee table books.

[hipster duck]

I only joined in 2014, so my life is quite different but not profoundly different from you guys who joined as teenagers more than twenty years ago and are now entering middle age.

I used to be a prolific poster on urbantoronto, but switched to here after I had lived away from Toronto for some years and when I realized that that forum was becoming more like a one-way information feed from development and planning insiders to an audience of outsiders where armchair commentary and debates weren't encouraged. So now it's the other way around: I post here and lurk there.

I've always loved cities. One of the greatest things about living in Canada is watching our cities grow. I think that's why urban development has been something I've followed closely for years. If I lived in a country like Spain, where urban living has always been the default, all cities are awesome, and there isn't much change, I probably wouldn't give a shit. At a time when there's a lot to be pessimistic about, the trajectory of our cities is a welcome respite from that.

[WhipperSnapper]

I think it started out being bored at work and after some searches I found the Hot 500 List. That led my to Skyscrapers.com. The bulletin board there led me to SSP and SSP led to the rest. World Skyscrapers ran faster so I posted there until 2002

I went to an early urbantoronto meet. That was the first and last time. I did not go to the WorldSkyscrapers/ SSC global meet in Toronto. I did attend Doors Open that year and saw myself in several photos posted on that site.

I was engaged, broke and, hated the 9 to 5 grind in a neck noose. I'm divorced, not broke and every morning look at the tie rack and say not today.

[ScreamingViking]

Food tastes better. The air seems fresher. I have more energy and self confidence than I ever dreamed of.
https://www.seinfeldscripts.com/TheShowerhead.htm


Things are very different. In 2013 I was single, early 40s, 7 years removed from a marriage and living in an apartment near the waterfront in Burlington. Work dominated my life and I used smaller distractions to maintain some balance, including this site.

Today I'm still working but a married homeowner again, back in my hometown, helping take care of two university-age kids and three cats. I have travelled abroad. Retirement is still far away but closer than I want to think. Life balance has changed completely, but this site is still an interesting distraction.

[biguc]

Originally Posted by Architype

When I saw 16, I thought, god that's young, but at least now you are mid 30s. I think I've read a lot of your posts and you seem very intelligent, well informed etc., probably smarter than me, regardless of age. The more smart, informed & pleasantly reasonable people we have here is what makes it worth being a part of.

That's very kind of you to say. And I couldn't agree more. Forums like this are relics of early internet utopia--we're looking back at where that wave crested. No media since have been able to foster community and conversation like we enjoy here. I'm glad to be a part of it, grateful for its existence, and appreciate all of you who make this board what it is.

Originally Posted by niwell

Both very astute! While I didn't join SSP till I was a bit older, this style of online forum was generally much more accepting and able to guide younger posters than others. Had the same experience on different ones while I was in high school. Always wondered if there will be a bit of a return to forums (though they never really left) than other forms of online discourse.

I've tried to maintain the same attitude about posting these days. Also with the nostalgia posts going around makes me realize I should have sent a PM as I was just in Berlin for a week including 4 days to myself - though I certainly found enough things to do to pass the time. And enough beer.

I have dreams about social media crashing and burning (at the moment, they kind of are!) and message boards rising up from the wreckage to usher in a new golden age of online discourse. That's part of why I get prickly about the board's culture warriors creating a weird, hostile environment on what used to be a radically open and accepting board. Anyway...

You should have PMed! I hope you enjoyed yourself in Berlin anyway. Anyone here is more than welcome to shoot me a PM for city tips or to grab a bierchen when in Berlin.

[Airboy]

I'm older, way older. And I have a better job but not much more.

[someone123]

When I first posted pictures on here I took them with a point and shoot camera and then scanned them. Now they look old, like how vintage 60's or 70's photos would have seemed back then. No Instagram filters here:





Exciting 2x12 storey precast-clad condo tower development (maybe the only crane up at the time?):










From Toronto Doors Open:

[kool maudit]

I see the old CBC building on South Park and that old apartment building on South and Hollis that I always thought was kind of picturesque and rambling.

[Luisito]

Originally Posted by kool maudit

I see the old CBC building on South Park and that old apartment building on South and Hollis that I always thought was kind of picturesque and rambling.

That's not south street that's Morris and Hollis.

[esquire]

Looking back on it, the period that I joined the SSP forum was an intensely city-focused period of my life. I was in grad school, and urban issues/municipal governance were a major focus of my studies, so I was reading a lot about those fields... at the time I was also doing a co-op placement in the City of Winnipeg's Finance Department. So every week I would get copies of Council and Committee agendas dropped off at my office, and even though little of it had anything to do with my work, I enjoyed poring over the agendas and the small development projects that were typical of that era in which very little was happening.

I was also travelling a lot within Canada at that time, I was making regular annual trips to a bunch of Canadian cities including Toronto, Montreal, Calgary and Vancouver as well as occasional visits to many other cities. I was starting to broaden my horizons a bit by venturing outside of Canada as well... I visited New York a couple of times which was very fascinating and eye-opening, and I spent a good chunk of 2002 working at a software company in China. That gave me the opportunity to travel within the region and visit some other amazing places for the first time, like Hong Kong, Shanghai and Beijing. Hong Kong in particular elevated my expectations of what a city could be.

I came back to Canada to attend the University of Alberta in the fall of 2002, and that was my first experience living downtown. I loved it, it was a very enjoyable place to be. I still love going for walks around my old neighbourhood anytime that I'm in Edmonton.

The funny thing is that I always sort of figured I'd end up pursuing this passion as a career path. Although I did have some minor brushes with it over the years, it never really took. I remember at one point interviewing for a couple of professional jobs with the City of Winnipeg that I was highly qualified for based on my experience (and that I'm sure I would have absolutely loved doing), but I never got an offer. That was probably over a decade ago. So I'm here strictly as a hobbyist/interested citizen these days.

PS - just like someone123, I too remember taking pictures on a point-and-shoot 35mm camera, getting the pictures developed, scanning them and uploading them for display here. Seeing those old photos brought back some memories!

[kool maudit]

Originally Posted by Luisito

That's not south street that's Morris and Hollis.

You're right! South was the yellow one on Cornwallis Sq.

[O-tacular]

Originally Posted by kool maudit

One of the things that hanging out here for so long has demonstrated is that the lives of cities are much longer than those of men, and so they change much more slowly. The obverse being that in many ways they are what they are, even the very dynamic ones.

Something you used to see a lot of here was the guy who would sign up from someplace, usually a high-growth area, and he would be full of news about the proposed towers, the redevelopment plans and the architectural renderings. The promise was always that in just a few years time, his hometown would be something altogether different, just an entirely different tier of beast.

And this can happen, in some cases, but it takes decades, and while your city moves, all the others do too.

The extreme versions of this were usually regarded as such on here, but the general dynamic of SSP favours at least a subtler form of it. When I moved to Montreal, for instance, I was blown away at how much the city resembled the metropolitan archetype I had in my mind. Given the lag time involved in the formation of such aesthetics, that probably meant it was a very powerful kind of mid-20th century vision.

But there were problems. There were views that seemed incomplete and elements that were jarring and did not fit with the archetype. And so, rendering by rendering, plan by plan, there was a sense in which I came to see Montreal as incomplete but drawing nearer. My enthusiasm for the new projects, which were pretty thin on the ground back then, was part of a desire to join the living city to the internal vision.

Someone123 had a great post years ago on this. It was a throwaway, and I am not even sure he'd remember it, but out of frustration with some City Discussions thread in which some city was being dismissed for its lack of tenement rows and deco Goliaths, he asked "are we sure we are not just cargo-culting New York here?"

I am not sure I wasn't just cargo-culting New York. There is probably a narrative in which I should have been in New York, and that constructs like "my metropolitan archetype" were just reheated images of Manhattan.

Kilgore Trout and I, for instance, are two of this forum's longtime Montreal adopters, or converts. But he is there and I am not, and I think looking back that he always had a more thoughtful and more realistic affection for the city as it was. I am not saying it's binary, or that I had no appreciation for Montreal beyond a hazy, post-industrial city blur. I lived there for 16 years and I loved the place. But cities are what they are, and I had part of one foot, at least, in "what might be, what could have been and Manhattan."

You lose this over time. Stockholm is only Stockholm. I can smile to myself on Valhallavägen at how close it looks (on those few blocks) to the European version of the metropolitan vision, that slice of imperial Vienna, but Stockholm is Stockholm.

If I wanted New York I would have to try and get there. And if I wanted some hazy collage of images associated with either New York or Vienna in some past colourful period, there are coffee table books.

This post and a few others got me thinking about how Calgary was when I joined and the new optimism I felt about it. Back in the oughts Calgary was booming and transforming into a 'big city' with condo towers and massive office buildings cropping up everywhere. The Bow was the crescendo of that period. You couldn't keep up with the pace of development. The last time I visited Montreal in 2018 it felt like that period of time in Calgary with cranes everywhere and new towers cropping up on every other street. Things have been lethargic here since 2014 and in many ways Calgary is experiencing a drought like Montreal did throughout the 90's and 00's.

Since then I've come to appreciate smaller human scaled projects much more than mega towers. If anything, that area of growth has exploded here since. Calgary is definitely becoming more dense and more urban. Hence my opposition to that horrible Stephen Avenue mega project which thankfully seems dead now. Calgary is no longer an 80's oil boom town building nothing but windswept plazas next to corporate obelisks.

Not having your experience living in different cities (but having visited many) I follow the evolution and growth of my home town with a sense of cautious optimism. The other day I looked at some of the new condos going up in East Village and realized that we are not cutting and pasting Toronto or Vancouver style developments anymore. Our buildings do have a local flavour and aren't mere imitations any longer. In spite of some ugly tacky projects we have colour and variety and are improving the baseline quality of design every year. What was acceptable 10 years ago isn't anymore.

[O-tacular]

Originally Posted by someone123

When I first posted pictures on here I took them with a point and shoot camera and then scanned them. Now they look old, like how vintage 60's or 70's photos would have seemed back then. No Instagram filters here:





Exciting 2x12 storey precast-clad condo tower development (maybe the only crane up at the time?):










From Toronto Doors Open:

Whoa. This post is like a time capsule. It visually illustrates how much time has gone by since the start of this forum. On the technology front I remember logging in on a laptop that weighed as much as a pile of bricks as I had no internet browsing ability on my flip phone (with qwerty keyboard).

[MolsonExport]

As a child, it was all about skyscrapers, and the taller, the better. I remember going to downtown Montreal 3-4 times a year during the 1970s, and just begging my parents to stop the car so that I could get out and walk around. They would ask: "why? where do you want to go; what do you want to see?" And I would say, "Nothing...I just wanna look at the buildings". Around the time I was 11 or 12, I stumbled upon a huge box in a storage room in our house. It was filled with National Geographic magazines going back to the 1940s. I started leafing through some, and then, really getting into some of the articles. Then I came across a 1964 issue that had an article on New York City....

I was enthralled. I found what I was always looking for. It was a transformational moment for me. I started drawing buildings and skylines. I still have this crazy imagined skyline that I drew over a 4 year period (with many known buildings drawn, and a lot of my own ideas) which at one point stretched across two sides of my room (3'x2' bristol boards, 9 of them, in a row, with thousands of buildings, highways, parks, skytrain systems, ports, stadiums, islands...
I was destined to become an architect; that is, until it didn't happen. Too many hoops to jump through, the bar was high, the chances of doing something cool in the field being vanishingly low (0.01% of architects design 99.99% of all the skyscrapers of note).
But my fascination with buildings, and urban fabric never ebbed. On the contrary.
Of course like most of you, my tastes changed. It used to be all about the tall buildings (and how Toronto was getting them and Montreal....well, there wasn't any construction in Montreal). But even then I realized that the best parts of town to walk around were not the places with 56-72 storey buildings (or in Montreal's case, 30-45 storey buildings).
I've travelled the world since. If there is an observation gallery in the tallest building/tower, I always visit, not simply to take in the view, but rather to get the lay of the land for further exploration. The thing that I like best is to visit a teaming city, say Tokyo or Seoul, and...get lost. literally. just wandering the streets for hours and hours on end, taking in the serendipitous sights. I've been to Paris 5 times, and I still haven't made it to La Defense (there was time, in my late teens, when that might have been my second destination, after, of course, the Eiffel Tower).