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  #41  
Old Posted Jul 6, 2009, 10:40 PM
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Originally Posted by Wright Concept View Post
... the stop spacing is farther apart then other Metro's (at apporx every 0.8 to 1.0 mile apart compared to every 0.4 to 0.5 mile apart)
Could you clarify?
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  #42  
Old Posted Jul 6, 2009, 11:33 PM
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New Rail Corridor between L.A. and Las Vegas Could Doom Maglev Project

Corridor along I-15 draws support from Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid, who says he will try to move funds from the maglev project to a new, European-style train system.

By Ashley Powers and Dan Weikel
July 3, 2009

Reporting from Los Angeles and Las Vegas -- A potential corridor for passenger trains between Las Vegas and the Los Angeles area has become part of a federal initiative to modernize the nation's rail networks and develop high-speed service between cities.

Thursday's announcement, however, might doom a 30-year-old proposal to build a high-tech magnetic levitation, or "maglev," train from Anaheim to Las Vegas if Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid (D-Nev.) gets his way.

Reid, who no longer supports the maglev project, said during an event to publicize the rail corridor that he would try to scuttle $45 million in federal funds earmarked for the proposal. The maglev project and a conventional rail line proposed by a private venture are trying to develop separate high speed passenger trains that would parallel oft-congested Interstate 15. Secretary of Transportation Ray LaHood announced Thursday that a swath of land along much of I-15 has been declared a federal high-speed rail corridor -- one of 11 such zones in the U.S. Projects proposed in those corridors are eligible for federal assistance, grants and loans.

Federal officials say the development of a successful high speed rail system between Southern California and Nevada would dramatically reduce delays and traffic accidents on I-15.

"For transportation, it's the most important thing that's happened to Nevada since Interstate 15," said Reid, who likened the federal high speed rail program to President Eisenhower's effort in the 1950s to develop the interstate highway system.

Last month, the Nevada senator withdrew his support for the maglev project in favor of a plan by DesertXPress Enterprises to build a European-style high speed train that relies on conventional technology. The 150 mph system would run about 200 miles from Victorville to Las Vegas and cost about $3.5-$4 billion to build.

The maglev project would extend 270 miles and cost an estimated $12 billion. Maglev technology relies on electricity and magnetic force to propel trains on a cushion of air at speeds up to 300 mph.

"I've studied maglev enough," said Reid, who added that the DesertXPress is closer to breaking ground. "We're past the planning stage. We've got to move on and start construction."

Proponents of the maglev proposal said it was unlikely that Reid would be able to persuade Congress to reverse its decision to provide funding.

"We are relying on the law and how it reads. We believe that nothing will change," said Neil Cummings, president of the American Magline Group, a consortium of private companies involved in the project.
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  #43  
Old Posted Jul 7, 2009, 1:39 AM
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  #44  
Old Posted Jul 7, 2009, 3:44 PM
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Originally Posted by Westsidelife View Post
Could you clarify?
Most other World metro systems have stop spacing on average of every 0.4-0.5 miles apart built mostly for moving large numbers of people in a dense local environment. Some of these Metro's operate an "express" train component that averages every 1.0 mile apart to speed up the service and cater to those travelling regionally (serving longer distance) riders.

Our Metro is built to meet the standard that is more Regional in nature and is utilizing the "express" track metro system standard both for speed, cost-effectiveness and capacity.

To create an express component to that stop spacing that is already close to 1.0 mile apart -though trip time improvements will occur however it doesn't offset the poor cost effectiveness at the start- will require stop spacing about every 3-5 miles to make any dent, by then if you need something like this it has got to connect to very dense activity centers at the "Regional Express" and or our system is at full network build out with two or three of the lines in close proximity (1/2 mile apart) are over capacity to warrant service of this magnitude.
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  #45  
Old Posted Jul 7, 2009, 4:00 PM
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Maybe having the head of Transportation will attract more funds here...
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  #46  
Old Posted Jul 7, 2009, 8:15 PM
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Originally Posted by JDRCRASH View Post
Maybe having the head of Transportation will attract more funds here...
Considering LaHood has been and is going everywhere, I highly doubt that.
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  #47  
Old Posted Jul 8, 2009, 9:39 PM
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Angry This is discouraging...

From Curbed LA,

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How Much LA Traffic Costs You





Wednesday, July 8, 2009, by Dakota


A report on nationwide traffic from the Texas Transportation Institute notes that Los Angeles has the worst traffic in the nation and that Angelenos wasted 70 hours sitting in traffic last year, a figure that's down from the 72 hours from 2006. The study, which looked in traffic patterns in 439 U.S. urban areas from 1982 through 2007, notes that nationwide, congestion dropped for the first time in 2007, a move which can partially be attributed to rising fuel reports, according to the Wall Street Journal . You can see all the data for Western cities via this link; Los Angeles was lumped in with Los Angeles-Long Beach-Santa Ana. In terms of more specific information, people in the LA-area wasted 336 million gallons of fuel in 2007 because of traffic delays. Looking at individual costs, each driver wasted a total of $1,480 because of traffic delays, according to Bernie Fette, research specialist at the Texas Transportation Institute. (Compare that cost to the tax hike of Measure R, which is estimated to cost Los Angeles County residents $25 a year). Sadly, the study didn't look at whether all that muscle-atrophying traffic was killing our sex drive, which some unhappy readers have claimed.
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  #48  
Old Posted Jul 8, 2009, 9:56 PM
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Interesting; and I say that only because in the last 5 years, I've never had to commute more than 6 miles from my home to my job; I never even had to take the freeway. Although that may change later this year...
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  #49  
Old Posted Jul 9, 2009, 6:23 AM
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LA Council Orders LAX to Study Green Line Extension

By Art Marroquin, Staff Writer
July 8, 2009

The Metro Green Line might finally wind its way down to the terminals at Los Angeles International Airport, thanks to the recent purchase of an adjacent 20-acre parking lot that's ripe for use.

The Los Angeles City Council's Trade, Commerce and Tourism Committee on Wednesday directed airport officials to spend the next six months studying whether it's possible to bring the light rail line directly to LAX by building a stop on the site of the Park 'N Ride at Park One lot, located just east of Terminal One.

The Board of Airport Commissioners agreed last month to buy the parking lot for $126.5 million. The full City Council is expected to sign off on the expenditure by Friday.

"It's a no-brainer that every major airport has a rail line going into it," said Los Angeles City Councilman Bill Rosendahl, whose district includes LAX.

The Green Line's estimated $200 million, two-mile extension would likely be funded by Measure R. Los Angeles County voters approved the half-cent county sales tax measure, which went into effect last week and is expected to generate $40 billion for local transportation projects over the next 30 years.

As part of their research, airport officials will dust off and update a report completed more than a decade ago, examining whether to bring the Green Line to LAX.

"We really want this to be the premier study to say yes, this is feasible and here's how it's going to happen," said Councilwoman Janice Hahn, who chairs the council committee that oversees LAX.

"If we don't make it accessible, people won't use it," Hahn said. "It's time to right that wrong for the public."

The Green Line, running 20 miles from Norwalk to Redondo Beach, opened in 1995 at a cost of $700 million.

For now, the Green Line's stop at Aviation Boulevard drops passengers two miles away from LAX, forcing travelers to board a bus to complete a trip to the airport.

The rail line's missing link should connect "deep into the heart of the airport," Councilman Tom LaBonge said.

The Los Angeles County Metropolitan Transportation Authority's current plan calls for extending the Green Line to nearby Manchester Square, allowing travelers to board a proposed people mover to gain access to airport terminals.

The MTA had initially called for extending the Green Line to LAX by 2015, but officials announced last year that the project won't likely be completed until 2018 at the earliest.

But MTA officials on Wednesday said they would welcome input from airport and city officials who want to use the airport-adjacent parking lot as a new Green Line stop.

"We're working with the airport in creating a better link to the terminals, but this is a new proposal to us," said Roderick Diaz of the MTA's South Bay planning department.

"We'd have to examine various possibilities to bring the line to the terminals," Diaz said. "But this is an interesting alternative to pursue."

Airport Commission President Alan Rothenberg said the Park One property will continue to operate as a parking lot as officials study all potential uses, including a new consolidated car rental office.

"You have a privately owned piece of property within the footprint of LAX and it's a shame we didn't acquire it the last time it was on the market," Rothenberg said. "It's clear that it should be part of LAX."
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  #50  
Old Posted Jul 9, 2009, 7:19 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Wright Concept View Post
Most other World metro systems have stop spacing on average of every 0.4-0.5 miles apart built mostly for moving large numbers of people in a dense local environment. Some of these Metro's operate an "express" train component that averages every 1.0 mile apart to speed up the service and cater to those travelling regionally (serving longer distance) riders.
Oh, I understand that. Your wording just had me confused.

So, would you say that 1-mile stop spacing is just right for LA's oddly configured medium-density, suburban-like land use? Or do you think it's more of an inconvenience?

One more question: How does Chicago implement express service when it only has two tracks (or am I not seeing additional ones?)?

Quote:
Our Metro is built to meet the standard that is more Regional in nature and is utilizing the "express" track metro system standard both for speed, cost-effectiveness and capacity.
I don't know about you, but I tend to think of it as a hybrid between local and express service, if that makes any sense.

Quote:
To create an express component to that stop spacing that is already close to 1.0 mile apart -though trip time improvements will occur however it doesn't offset the poor cost effectiveness at the start- will require stop spacing about every 3-5 miles to make any dent, by then if you need something like this it has got to connect to very dense activity centers at the "Regional Express" and or our system is at full network build out with two or three of the lines in close proximity (1/2 mile apart) are over capacity to warrant service of this magnitude.
I was hinting more at creating express service so that we could have more infill stations, giving us that conventional 1/2-mile stop spacing. I realize, though, that this is not feasible. I don't think, however, that that should necessarily stop us from adding an infill station here and there. I don't agree with strictly following the 1-mile stop spacing. I believe we need to make special exceptions for, say, stations at Wilshire/Robertson and La Cienega/Melrose to serve two popular high-end shopping destinations.
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  #51  
Old Posted Jul 9, 2009, 7:01 PM
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Originally Posted by Westsidelife View Post
Oh, I understand that. Your wording just had me confused.

So, would you say that 1-mile stop spacing is just right for LA's oddly configured medium-density, suburban-like land use? Or do you think it's more of an inconvenience?
I think it works nicely because it can be interchangable with the transit mode. That stop spacing can work with both Light Rail and Heavy Rail.

Quote:
One more question: How does Chicago implement express service when it only has two tracks (or am I not seeing additional ones?)?
There's four tracks on the Chicago Northside line to enable express service.

Quote:
I was hinting more at creating express service so that we could have more infill stations, giving us that conventional 1/2-mile stop spacing. I realize, though, that this is not feasible. I don't think, however, that that should necessarily stop us from adding an infill station here and there.
The biggest exception to that rule is in Downtown LA.

Quote:
I don't agree with strictly following the 1-mile stop spacing. I believe we need to make special exceptions for, say, stations at Wilshire/Robertson and La Cienega/Melrose to serve two popular high-end shopping destinations.
The introduction of another mode or style of service that can fill the gap until the demand really calls for it would work as well. Such as a streetcar or Bus Only lanes with Rapid bus service that feed the subway stations at strategic points and have frequent connecting service.

It's all about building a cohesive interconnected network.

Another thing to keep in mind is how we are building the tunnels. Our's are bored tubes so it makes it difficult to add infill stations because we'd have to shut the track down to build the stations. Cut-Cover gives you more future flexibilty because the station platforms can be built around the tracks but businesses would have to suffer through the initial and additional construction process.
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  #52  
Old Posted Jul 9, 2009, 11:49 PM
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Originally Posted by Wright Concept View Post
I think it works nicely because it can be interchangable with the transit mode. That stop spacing can work with both Light Rail and Heavy Rail.
I'm not quite sure what you're hinting at here. Care to explain?

Quote:
There's four tracks on the Chicago Northside line to enable express service.
Is that only for the Northside?

Quote:
The biggest exception to that rule is in Downtown LA.
I think the whole core of Central LA (Downtown/Westlake/Pico-Union/Koreatown/Hollywood) has density to warrant 1/2-mile stop spacing. It has density to go toe-to-toe with any neighborhood in NYC, Chicago, SF, etc.

Quote:
The introduction of another mode or style of service that can fill the gap until the demand really calls for it would work as well. Such as a streetcar or Bus Only lanes with Rapid bus service that feed the subway stations at strategic points and have frequent connecting service.
The distance between Wilshire/La Cienega and Wilshire/Beverly is a bit much, no? There's clearly a need for another station somewhere in there, especially given the commercial density that exists along that 1.3-mile stretch of road.

With La Cienega/Melrose, I suggested that to the MTA in an email and never got a response back (not surprisingly). The demand should be there because that's at the juncture of two major commercial nodes on the Westside, one of them known as "Restaurant Row" and the other as the new Rodeo Drive. Also, the Pacific Design Center is less than half a mile away. We talk about major activity centers; PDC isn't one?

Quote:
Another thing to keep in mind is how we are building the tunnels. Our's are bored tubes so it makes it difficult to add infill stations because we'd have to shut the track down to build the stations. Cut-Cover gives you more future flexibilty because the station platforms can be built around the tracks but businesses would have to suffer through the initial and additional construction process.
Would cut-and-cover require cutting open the street? How would it work without disrupting service?
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  #53  
Old Posted Jul 10, 2009, 12:53 AM
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Originally Posted by Westsidelife View Post
I'm not quite sure what you're hinting at here. Care to explain?
No just that stop spacing with the same acceleration rate for vehicles whether they are light rail or heavy rail allows for a consistent rate of speed. Taking 2 minutes to reach a mile whether it's fully grade separated or at-grade with quad gated crossings.


Quote:
Is that only for the Northside?
Yes, http://www.chicago-l.org/maps/track/index.html#current Click on "Red Line Howard Branch"

Quote:
I think the whole core of Central LA (Downtown/Westlake/Pico-Union/Koreatown/Hollywood) has density to warrant 1/2-mile stop spacing. It has density to go toe-to-toe with any neighborhood in NYC, Chicago, SF, etc.
I would agree with that sentiment, I forgot about Koreatown. I had to respond in a hurry. I used to live in City West right by Good Samaritan Hospital and traffic was a nightmare between there and Downtown during rush hour because of the workers around City West and the people who live in the Pico-Union and Westlake areas coming home. I wished they had built the Red/Purple Line station there around Wilshire/Witmer. But this could still include bus only lanes or a streetcar between those two points to serve this role.

Quote:
The distance between Wilshire/La Cienega and Wilshire/Beverly is a bit much, no? There's clearly a need for another station somewhere in there, especially given the commercial density that exists along that 1.3-mile stretch of road.
Yes it's a little farther however some sacrifices are made to gain speed with the longer stop spacing AND save some $$$ by not building an additional station that would be evaluated to death by the beancounters at FTA.

Quote:
With La Cienega/Melrose, I suggested that to the MTA in an email and never got a response back (not surprisingly). The demand should be there because that's at the juncture of two major commercial nodes on the Westside, one of them known as "Restaurant Row" and the other as the new Rodeo Drive. Also, the Pacific Design Center is less than half a mile away. We talk about major activity centers; PDC isn't one?
That is more Cedars Sinai/Beverly Center area which would serve the whole of these points and is a current bus transfer point to reach those destinations.

Quote:
Would cut-and-cover require cutting open the street? How would it work without disrupting service?
Yes, it would. How could it work without disrupting service is that you essentially building a new tunnel inside of an existing tunnel. I'm typing this from memory of how they did it for a subway station I believe in Toronto and Madrid.

* They would carve out the new platform areas around the existing box tunnel.
* Add create the columns for the new station walls.
* Lay new lateral beams across the span between the two new station walls.
* Connect the new lateral beams to the roof of the existing tunnel (to help create support to the existing tunnel thereby reducing service disruption).
* Cut open the sides of the existing tunnel in safe intervals.
* Use the existing tunnel roof and new lateral beams as the basis for a new slab for the new mezzanine that will tie the old tunnel and new tunnel together and then build a new station roof slab along the new platform walls and new mezzannine.
* Pour earth on top and walla, we'll have a new infill subway station.

If this were a bored tunnel this would be a lot more complicated because the tube creates the bulk of the structural strength in the tunnel and cutting it open will require disrupting service for a lengthy period of time because they would essentially have to build the tunnel over again at this new infill station.
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Last edited by Wright Concept; Jul 11, 2009 at 1:12 AM.
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  #54  
Old Posted Jul 10, 2009, 4:39 AM
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Folks,

Any chance someone's got an updated map of the Expo Line route I could sneak a peek at? After just being down in the West L.A./Beverly Hills area today (At the LACMA/La Brea Tar Pits), it's entirely clear that the density and traffic along Wilshire (and the rest of the major boulevards around the are) certainly warrants the subway line. Just wondering the locations of the stations, etc...

Thanks!

Aaron (Glowrock)
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Old Posted Jul 10, 2009, 3:21 PM
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A Mooning Festival Is Something The Mayor Just Can't Get Behind (Wall Street Journal)

A Mooning Festival Is Something The Mayor Just Can't Get Behind
As Town Turns Its Back on 30-Year-Old Event, Will Train Flashing Go Into Eclipse?

By SARAH MCBRIDE
Wall Street Journal
7/10/09

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB1247...googlenews_wsj


The biggest event of the year in Laguna Niguel, Calif., is coming up on Saturday, but Mayor Robert Ming has a message for those planning to attend: Keep your pants on.

For 30 years, the town has played host to an affair dubbed "Moon Over Amtrak." Crowds line Camino Capistrano, a road that runs along the railroad tracks, and pass the day dropping their trousers every time a train rolls by. Some regulars compare it to Mardi Gras, others to Woodstock. Moon Amtrak once was so small the bar whose patrons thought it up gave free beer to everyone who took part. Last year, between 8,000 and 10,000 people showed up.

Thousands come each year to Laguna Niguel, Calif., to moon Amtrak trains.
This year, the city, on the busy Orange County corridor between Los Angeles and San Diego, is planning a crackdown.

"Avoid the area this year," the city advises on its home page. In a cheeky Twitter feed, it added, the city is "saying 'NO' to crack."

Some Laguna Niguel habitués, particularly the loyal clientele of the Mugs Away Saloon -- directly across Camino Capistrano from the railroad tracks -- aren't exactly over the moon about the authorities' new attitude. In 1979, according to city lore, a saloon patron offered to buy a drink for anyone who would moon the next train. He did -- for one guy -- and the annual rite was born.

Last year's event, bolstered by word of mouth and mentions by radio disc jockeys, was much bigger than the one the year before. So much traffic poured onto Camino Capistrano, which dead-ends in that area, that cars were trapped. A handful of 911 calls came in, the city says, mostly from people who were panicky about the heavy crowds and drunkenness. Local businesses complained their customers couldn't come and go. Backup cops and a helicopter were called in from surrounding communities.

Given that there were few incidents last year, city officials "totally overreacted," says Mugs Away regular Rick Sanchez, who says he has been coming to Moon Amtrak for 15 years. Patron Glenn Manthe blames a "stuffy, yuppie mayor" who has "never even been to a mooning." The 39-year-old mayor, who took office in December, confirms that he's never attended and says he has no desire to do so.

Server Rebecca Shahan, who was behind the bar last year, says, "It's not fun when you see a bunch of cops show up in riot gear when it's just a bunch of people having a good time."

But the city says the event set the stage for grave harm, exacerbated by the difficulty emergency vehicles would have had getting through the crowds. This year, "we had to take action," says Mayor Ming. While the city has an ordinance banning public nudity, it decided to go a different route. In March, the City Council adopted a resolution banning on-street parking in the area Thursday through Sunday this week. It also passed ordinances that prohibit alcohol consumption and urinating in public. In a news release, it announced its deputies "will be out in force, enforcing all laws and ordinances." Last year, the city estimates it spent $20,000, mostly on law enforcement. Volunteers handle cleanup.

Now, what used to be the biggest day of the year for the Mugs Away pub, might be more of a hassle than a cause for celebrating. While in the past as many as 200 people crowded into Mugs Away, according to estimates by people who were there, city officials have informed the bar's staff they plan to enforce its occupancy limit -- 49 people. The owner of Mugs Away, Rob "Hutch" Hutchinson, didn't return a call for comment on Moon Amtrak.

At Haines & Cross carpet cleaning, a few doors down from the bar, office manager Michelle, who declined to give her last name, says it is high time the city takes action. Every year, the business must close its doors during Moon Amtrak, she says. The company also must drive its vans off the premises, or lose access to them all weekend. Last year, the density of parked motorcycles jamming the area made it impossible to move carpets in and out of the building, she says, although nobody actually tried to do that.

But others don't mind the visitors. Some report seeing other business owners setting up stands to hawk T-shirts or drinks to revelers. "It's one day a year," says Greg Adams, owner of Adams Woodworking. "I don't care one way or the other," says Kevin Brady, of Brady's Auto Repair, who nevertheless cordons off his premises with tape.

It's unclear how effective the city's tactics will be. Moonamtrak.org, the closest thing to an organizing body the event can claim, is still providing directions and tips for attending, although it notes the rule changes, highlights the lack of liability insurance surrounding the high jinks and alerts readers that "the city and the railroad would rather you didn't bother coming to this event."

With all the new restrictions, Moon Amtrak "is done," as in finished, says Mr. Manthe, as other patrons nod in agreement. "Nobody will be talking about it anymore." But others aren't so sure. Mr. Adams predicts crowds will be only slightly smaller than last year's. If they must, determined mooners will "hoof their way in," he says.

By Wednesday, the city had begun putting up traffic markers and notices on Camino Capistrano. In years past, attendees say, recreational vehicles started rolling onto the thoroughfare as many as three days before the event, to get prime viewing spots.

Tony Terzo, who came for the first time last year, feels the spots people jockey for aren't all they might be, given that naked rear ends are aimed at the railway tracks rather than at the street. "From this angle, you don't get a good view," he says, except of the occasional train passenger returning the bare-bottomed favor to the crowds on Camino Capistrano.

"This year, my first moon is going to be that way," says Mr. Sanchez, pointing his finger in the direction of City Hall.
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  #56  
Old Posted Jul 11, 2009, 1:11 AM
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Originally Posted by glowrock View Post
Any chance someone's got an updated map of the Expo Line route I could sneak a peek at?

After just being down in the West L.A./Beverly Hills area today (At the LACMA/La Brea Tar Pits), it's entirely clear that the density and traffic along Wilshire (and the rest of the major boulevards around the are) certainly warrants the subway line. Just wondering the locations of the stations, etc...

Thanks!

Aaron (Glowrock)
This should whet your transit pallette. The only segment that is missing from this map for Phase 1 of Expo is the Downtown portion which is shared by the current Blue Line to Long Beach. You can go here to see it here.

The Aqua colored portion is the route that is under study for the Expo Phase 2 Final EIR.

The Purple Line is currently beginning preparation of the DEIR for the route and stations. There are still an number of lingering details that need to be finalized but that will come in its Final EIR phase.


Image by Darrell from Friends4Expo
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Last edited by Wright Concept; Jul 12, 2009 at 10:22 PM.
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Old Posted Jul 11, 2009, 1:37 AM
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Awesome! Thanks for that map, Wright Concept! Almost a shame that the Expo Line is being built ahead of the Wilshire Line, though. Densities are so freaking high along Wilshire and the surrounding regions, plus there are so many major attractions (LACMA/La Brea Tar Pits/Farmer's Market/The Grove/Beverly Hills/Century City/Westwood) so close to the line...

Then again, anything that can help alleviate some traffic (hopefully!) along the Santa Monica Freeway will be awesome as well!

Aaron (Glowrock)
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  #58  
Old Posted Jul 11, 2009, 1:43 AM
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Awesome! Thanks for that map, Wright Concept! Almost a shame that the Expo Line is being built ahead of the Wilshire Line, though. Densities are so freaking high along Wilshire and the surrounding regions, plus there are so many major attractions (LACMA/La Brea Tar Pits/Farmer's Market/The Grove/Beverly Hills/Century City/Westwood) so close to the line...
I personally don't see it being a shame, it will take a network of lines to serve the Westside. And Expo is one of those pieces in the network and it is one that can be built quicker than the subway.

Quote:
Then again, anything that can help alleviate some traffic (hopefully!) along the Santa Monica Freeway will be awesome as well!

Aaron (Glowrock)
Exactly! LA needs every transit option and tool to give people an alternative to their cars.
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  #59  
Old Posted Jul 11, 2009, 1:56 AM
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I personally don't see it being a shame, it will take a network of lines to serve the Westside. And Expo is one of those pieces in the network and it is one that can be built quicker than the subway.
That's a fair enough point, Wright Concept. It will certainly take more than one line to serve the Westside, no doubt about it.

Either way, it will be very nice to see some real mass transit from downtown to Santa Monica in the relatively near future!

Aaron (Glowrock)
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  #60  
Old Posted Jul 11, 2009, 2:28 AM
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