How Is Covid-19 Impacting Life in Your City?

[Pedestrian]

Originally Posted by homebucket

Most of the new variants are not more deadly, just more contagious.

Originally Posted by the urban politician

^ Yep, and more infective variants tend to spread more through younger people, not older people.

The 'vaccine factor' in all of this is being ignored. When you have enough of a demographic vaccinated, it begins to impact the epidemiology of disease:

That is not known for certain. It is largely speculation and there is considerable evidence otherwise. Those who assume it to be true are taking a risk. And I would urge anyone making such a statement here to provide an authoritative reference. Otherwise, it's just a personal opinion/belief and must be taken as such.

Work is ongoing. But I'm willing to bet that when all is said and done what we find is that while the vaccines are still highly effective against currently existing strains of virus, there is SOME effectiveness differential with the maximum effectiveness against the original strain of virus used to produce the vaccines and probably the lowest level of effectiveness (but still quite good) against the South African and Brazilian strains. Nevertheless, as mutations continue because in parts of the world high levels of viral reproduction continue, it seems quite serious risk that eventually strains will emerge against which the current vaccines offer inadequate (if not zero) protection. This isn't a bizarre belief. It's a common way that viruses work and it's why the major vaccine makers are prepared to make newer vaccines against newer strains when and if necessary.

[the urban politician]

Originally Posted by Pedestrian

That is not known for certain. It is largely speculation and there is considerable evidence otherwise. Those who assume it to be true are taking a risk. And I would urge anyone making such a statement here to provide an authoritative reference. Otherwise, it's just a personal opinion/belief and must be taken as such.

You are seriously going nuts. Buy yourself an airtight bubble already and live in it, man.....

Meanwhile, for the rest of the sane world, "We don't know for sure" doesn't equate to "We're all doomed!!!" It instead equates to "We don't know for sure. Don't panic, live your life with care and get your vaccine as recommended"

By the way, you obviously read NOBODY'S posts, Pedestrian, because that exact Israeli study that you posted was already critiqued in the article I posted above. Even Fauci, who is pretty much the most cautious of them all, was pretty harshly critical and dismissive of it.

“Even if a vaccine fails to protect against infection, it often protects against serious disease,” Fauci added. The 31-year-old woman in the New York Post article, for example, apparently had only minor symptoms.

Fauci also criticized the Israeli study on the South African variant, calling it “about as confusing as you could possibly be” and criticizing the way its findings were reported. “There were essentially no deaths or hospitalizations in the individuals who were vaccinated,” he said at another point during the briefing, seeming to reference the Israeli study but not mentioning it explicitly.

[homebucket]

Originally Posted by Pedestrian

That is not known for certain. It is largely speculation and there is considerable evidence otherwise. Those who assume it to be true are taking a risk. And I would urge anyone making such a statement here to provide an authoritative reference. Otherwise, it's just a personal opinion/belief and must be taken as such.

Work is ongoing. But I'm willing to bet that when all is said and done what we find is that while the vaccines are still highly effective against currently existing strains of virus, there is SOME effectiveness differential with the maximum effectiveness against the original strain of virus used to produce the vaccines and probably the lowest level of effectiveness (but still quite good) against the South African and Brazilian strains. Nevertheless, as mutations continue because in parts of the world high levels of viral reproduction continue, it seems quite serious risk that eventually strains will emerge against which the current vaccines offer inadequate (if not zero) protection.

We already know that the UK strain is not more deadly. The South African one does have a higher chance of breaking through the current set of vaccines but is not associated with severe infection requiring hospitalization. So while you can get infected despite being fully vaccinated, the risk of a poor outcome is very low.

[Pedestrian]

Originally Posted by the urban politician

You are seriously going nuts.

And you are on the edge of being nothing but insulting and offering no information.

I pretty much said exactly what Fauci is quoted as saying--"Even if a vaccine fails to protect against infection, it often protects against serious disease"--but this virus isn't finished mutating and vaccine effectiveness isn't "either/or". Vaccines can be a bit more or a bit less effective and there can be a progression as I think we are seeing--a progression toward less effectiveness that so far can be dismissed, as Fauci and all the others quoted in your post are want to do, but eventually may not.

[Pedestrian]

Originally Posted by homebucket

We already know that the UK strain is not more deadly.

I'm not sure we know that. One day the "experts" tell us that, the next day one or the other of them says something different. Right now it's reasonable to believe that its deadliness isn't enough different to matter.

The South African one does have a higher chance of breaking through the current set of vaccines but is not associated with severe infection requiring hospitalization. So while you can get infected despite being fully vaccinated, the risk of a poor outcome is very low.

The South African strain is not yet dominant enough most places to know for sure what you are saying and again, if you're going to make that kind of statement provide some references.

[homebucket]

Originally Posted by Pedestrian

I'm not sure we know that. One day the "experts" tell us that, the next day one or the other of them says something different. Right now it's reasonable to believe that its deadliness isn't enough different to matter.

https://www.npr.org/sections/coronav...ath-study-find

The South African strain is not yet dominant enough most places to know for sure what you are saying and again, if you're going to make that kind of statement provide some references.

You posted it yourself in post #5364.

[Pedestrian]

Originally Posted by homebucket

You posted it yourself in post #5364.

That didn't say the South African strain wasn't "associated with severe infection requiring hospitalization". It says it can be contained with "a combination of mass-vaccination with two doses coupled with non-pharmaceutical interventions." Trouble is, they are talking about preventing infection, not what happens if you get infected. They aren't addressing how severe the illness is.

[the urban politician]

Pedestrian, you are contradicting yourself and simply spouting your own fears.

I've heard your comments on this matter. You haven't left your home in over a year, won't go anywhere, won't ride in an Uber, refuse to ever use transit again... That's pretty much enough for me to see where you're coming from.

That level of fear may be enough for you, but don't expect the rest of the world to live with so much trepidation.

Yes, a mutant can eventually emerge that will finally overcome the vaccines that exist right now, but I and the rest of the world are not going to go about our lives constantly in fear of dying like you are. You sound like Howard Hughes did later in life.....

[10023]

Originally Posted by TWAK

Everybody is at risk for PASC though, as well as 1/3 of covid patients will have neuropsychiatric conditions. If people don't feel they are at risk, they should volunteer at hospitals and participate in forced injections (of covid) for scientific research. Then if possible, mass produce vaccines from these special humans.

This is also not really true.

[10023]

Originally Posted by Pedestrian

When you stop pretending you are invulnerable and governments should let people like you do as you wish no matter whom it puts at risk.

What I posted just above doesn't compare Brazil to other countries so it's relatively young population is irrelevant. It compares what's happening now with the new virus variant with what happened previously in Brazil. And Brazil hasn't vaccinated enough residents old or young to explain the difference either. It's Brazilian scientists who are saying they believe the new variant is more dangerous to younger people but you and the rest of the COVID fatigue brigade seem in denial as much as ever.

You are flirting with a form of psychosis about this. Let it go.

[Pedestrian]

Originally Posted by 10023

You are flirting with a form of psychosis about this. Let it go.

Are you finally going to present your credentials for making diagnoses? What you seem to be saying is "disagreeing with ME is psychotic". Your name should be Narcissus.

For the record, when I think you are wrong I will continue to say so like any participant here has a right to do. If you want the subject dropped, stop making incorrect, unsupported statements.

[the urban politician]

This is what Homebucket said:

Most of the new variants are not more deadly, just more contagious.

Then this is how Pedestrian responded:

That is not known for certain. It is largely speculation and there is considerable evidence otherwise. Those who assume it to be true are taking a risk.

Then Pedestrian takes us in a bizarre direction with this even more confusing statement:

I pretty much said exactly what Fauci is quoted as saying--"Even if a vaccine fails to protect against infection, it often protects against serious disease"--but this virus isn't finished mutating and vaccine effectiveness isn't "either/or". Vaccines can be a bit more or a bit less effective and there can be a progression as I think we are seeing--a progression toward less effectiveness that so far can be dismissed, as Fauci and all the others quoted in your post are want to do, but eventually may not.

I guess we should be afraid because um...well....you never know...something bad might happen....because even though I don't see any signs of it yet it might just well come down the road....just wait for it because...well...something in my gut just kinda sorta makes me worried and I just KNOW it's coming any day now.......

[the urban politician]

I have a question for the "COVID is mutating and the vaccine may eventually stop working" porn crowd:

What happens when a new vaccine for the mutant strain is created?

Then we get that shot.

Then the mutant strain mutates further so that the new shot is no longer effective?

Then we will get a new shot for the new strains...

Then that shot is no longer effective because COVID has mutated even further..

But then there's another new shot...

And another set of new mutations....

And another new shot....

All the while ALL of NYC's restaurants, gyms, and bars are long closed & the roofs collapsed..
All of the hotels everywhere are abandoned
We all are connected via wires from our scalps to our laptops and order everything on Amazon while watching CNN updates on COVID infection rates 24/7
And Pedestrian now has long hair, a long beard, looks like Gandalf, and slurps all of his meals through a sterile straw

But we will STILL BE SAFE!!!!!!

[10023]

Originally Posted by Pedestrian

Are you finally going to present your credentials for making diagnoses? What you seem to be saying is "disagreeing with ME is psychotic". Your name should be Narcissus.

For the record, when I think you are wrong I will continue to say so like any participant here has a right to do. If you want the subject dropped, stop making incorrect, unsupported statements.

Except it’s not me making incorrect, unsupported statements. It’s me and like a dozen other forumers making statements which are supported by a year’s worth of clinical and statistical data, and then you and one or two other hypochondriacs saying that the sky is falling and young, healthy people need to act like we are still in lockdown or we’ll all die.

[jtown,man]

Originally Posted by the urban politician

I have a question for the "COVID is mutating and the vaccine may eventually stop working" porn crowd:

What happens when a new vaccine for the mutant strain is created?

Then we get that shot.

Then the mutant strain mutates further so that the new shot is no longer effective?

Then we will get a new shot for the new strains...

Then that shot is no longer effective because COVID has mutated even further..

But then there's another new shot...

And another set of new mutations....

And another new shot....

All the while ALL of NYC's restaurants, gyms, and bars are long closed & the roofs collapsed..
All of the hotels everywhere are abandoned
We all are connected via wires from our scalps to our laptops and order everything on Amazon while watching CNN updates on COVID infection rates 24/7
And Pedestrian now has long hair, a long beard, looks like Gandalf, and slurps all of his meals through a sterile straw

But we will STILL BE SAFE!!!!!!

LOL Exactly.


I have already spent 13 months of my life living like this, I am done.

What if I die at 50? I would have spent 2% of my life inside.



At what point do you fearmongers just say "alright, this is a virus, we have to move on with our lives before we don't have the same life to move back to?" 2 more months? 6? 1 year? Never?

If you think normal people are gonna continue to put their lives on hold because of your fear, sorry, not going to happen.

[woodrow]

Does anyone personally know anyone with vaccine hesitancy? I might have a cousin or two I haven't talked to in years, but I don't have a single close family member, friend, dentist, hair dresser, barista, etc. who either hasn't gotten the shot or is anxiously waiting to get one. I am curious if anyone has friends, family, colleagues, etc. who are not planning on getting a shot and if so are you going to encourage them to change their? More vaccinations, less variants.

[pip]

^none for me. Everyone I know either has had one or really wants one like now or are lazy about it so far but plans on getting one.

[the urban politician]

Originally Posted by woodrow

Does anyone personally know anyone with vaccine hesitancy? I might have a cousin or two I haven't talked to in years, but I don't have a single close family member, friend, dentist, hair dresser, barista, etc. who either hasn't gotten the shot or is anxiously waiting to get one. I am curious if anyone has friends, family, colleagues, etc. who are not planning on getting a shot and if so are you going to encourage them to change their? More vaccinations, less variants.

Yes. I talk to them every day. But I’m in a unique position being a healthcare professional and interacting with people face to face of varying backgrounds every day (I don’t WFH and associate with the same 5 people daily, which if you ask me only amplifies the irrational fear and ignorance out there)

Meeting people. Different people. Strangers. Every day. Who’d a thought that doing such a thing would be such a rare privilege? It’s become one now, and I feel blessed.

Anyhow, I regularly meet people who are scared of the vaccine, even though I strongly urge them to get it. Fear is a very powerful thing, it overrides pretty much every other sensibility—rational or not—that we have. Look at Pedestrian

[SteveD]

I'm very pro-science, pro-vaccine, but I canceled my 2nd Moderna shot. I'm still within the 42 day window, which ends one week from today.

I had decades of mild, manageable tinnitus. About 5 days after my first Moderna shot, it got suddenly and dramatically worse, and it remains that way today. The prospect of it getting even worse with a second shot was untenable to me.

There are increasing numbers of people reporting this same condition. I'm on a FB COVID vaccine tinnitus group started just a couple weeks ago that now has over 1,000 members. So far, it's not getting much attention or generating much news.

[the urban politician]

^ I’m sorry to hear that. Nothing unreasonable about what you’re doing.

I have never had a patient experience what you are experiencing, though