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  #701  
Old Posted May 11, 2022, 2:39 PM
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The 80 South property already comes with a huge bundle of purchased air rights. It's highly unlikely the buyer wouldn't fully use the rights, as that would be throwing away Manhattan development rights.

So while we have no idea of the future design/height/architect, etc., it's a reasonable guess that the overall building size/envelope will be similar.
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  #702  
Old Posted May 11, 2022, 2:43 PM
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But there's a cost-benefit issue. I hope you're right. I lived and worked in this area for a very long time.
It would depend on how much the new developer will get the property for. If they get it for a high price, they'd have no choice but to build something high end. If they get it at a discount, I can see some more cheapo condos perhaps even with affordable housing component, same sq footage but shorter tower.
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  #703  
Old Posted May 11, 2022, 4:05 PM
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But there's a cost-benefit issue. I hope you're right. I lived and worked in this area for a very long time.

The area has already changed a lot, even since the Calatrava proposal. But one thing I wouldn’t worry about is a tower built on site.

The two most valuable things in New York real eastate are air rights (development rights), and building as-of-right. NOBODY is throwing that away.



https://therealdeal.com/2022/05/11/o...upertall-site/

Oceanwide loses control of Manhattan supertall site





BY ISABELLA
FARR MAY 11, 2022


Quote:
Oceanwide Holdings has lost control of a Manhattan development site where it planned to build a 1,500-foot skyscraper.

The Financial District property, 80 South Street, is in receivership after Oceanwide failed to pay back $165 million out of a $175 million loan from Midtown-based DW Partners, according to a filing with the Hong Kong Stock Exchange last week.
Quote:
A representative for Oceanwide could not be immediately reached for comment. Ownership of the property has been passed to Kalo, an insolvency and restructuring firm headquartered in the Cayman Islands and the British Virgin Islands, according to the filing.

Oceanwide bought the property for $390 million in 2016 and invested another $20 million into the site, though construction never started.

The firm planned to build a tower rising roughly 1,500 feet above the street. It would have been the tallest building in Lower Manhattan by roof height. But the same year Oceanwide bought it, it quietly marketed the property for sale for $300 million.
Quote:
Last year, Oceanwide started shopping the property again, this time enlisting Colliers International to sell the property for around $200 million.

Without its New York property, Oceanwide is down to one U.S. project — an unfinished 2 million-square-foot condo, hotel and apartment development in Los Angeles dubbed Oceanwide Plaza.

In October, creditors on Oceanwide’s San Francisco project seized it after the company missed a debt payment. The development is now for sale.
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  #704  
Old Posted May 11, 2022, 4:29 PM
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Something will definitely rise there. I hope that it's a 1,500'+ tower, but I would not be surprised if it's a 700' rental.
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  #705  
Old Posted May 11, 2022, 5:15 PM
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You'd think whoever gets control of the site would take advantage of the air rights and build as tall as possible.

A tower that size would complement the WTC nicely, too.
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  #706  
Old Posted May 16, 2022, 1:20 AM
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This tower must be 1436 feet and above all it must be 113 real floors!
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  #707  
Old Posted May 16, 2022, 2:13 AM
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Originally Posted by JMKeynes View Post
Something will definitely rise there. I hope that it's a 1,500'+ tower, but I would not be surprised if it's a 700' rental.
With those development rights shoehorned on that site the way they are, nobody is putting up a 700 ft rental.
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  #708  
Old Posted May 16, 2022, 2:44 AM
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With those development rights shoehorned on that site the way they are, nobody is putting up a 700 ft rental.
I hope not.
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  #709  
Old Posted May 16, 2022, 5:07 PM
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I hope Michael Stern can buy this site and build a 1,400 ft tower.
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  #710  
Old Posted Jun 20, 2022, 2:15 AM
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https://www.mingtiandi.com/real-esta...assets-frozen/

OCEANWIDE CREDITORS FILE WINDING-UP PETITION AS BEIJING COURT FREEZES ASSETS





2022/06/19
BY MINGTIANDI TEAM


Quote:
China Oceanwide Holdings is vowing to fight back on both sides of the Pacific after creditors travelled to Bermuda to slap its Hong Kong-listed entity with a winding-up petition earlier this month and a Beijing court froze onshore holdings after a creditor demanded RMB 1.98 billion ($296 million) in bond repayments, according to an announcement to the Shenzhen Stock Exchange on Tuesday.

The pair of setbacks for Oceanwide came after receivers appointed by creditors of its $410 million 80 South Street development had seized the Lower Manhattan project last month, with that same debt triggering a court move in Bermuda to liquidate Oceanwide’s Hong Kong-listed vehicle.
Quote:
In a filing last Friday, Oceanwide contended that, having already been stripped of its New York City prize over $175 million in unpaid debt, its US creditors were going too far by pursuing the developer in its Caribbean domicile.

“Given the outstanding sum of the demand has been covered by the Pledged Property, the Company will oppose the Petition vigorously,” Oceanwide told the Hong Kong stock exchange, noting that the New York property had a book value of $220 million as of the end of last year.
Quote:
DW 80 South LLC on Thursday of last week filed a winding-up petition with the Supreme Court of Bermuda on the grounds that the developer has failed to pay an outstanding sum of $175 million, the Hong Kong-listed unit of Oceanwide Group said in the Friday filing.

Once one of China’s most aggressive cross-border investors, Oceanwide has struggled since Beijing restricted international capital flows in 2018 and tipped into insolvency since the country tightened domestic credit with the Three Red Lines policies enacted in 2020.

Earlier filings by the Beijing-based builder show that it had taken a $175 million loan backed by its skyscraper project in New York City’s South Street Seaport area and had taken a six-month extension on that two-year debt in May 2021.

The Chinese developer defaulted when it missed a $1.3 million interest payment in January and the Lower Manhattan property, 80 South Street, went into receivership last month.
Quote:
Oceanwide bought the New York property for $390 million in 2016 and invested another $20 million into the site, though construction never started.

The firm planned to build a single tower combining commercial and residential space that could reach more than 304 metres (1,000 feet) tall. But after plans ground to a halt, Oceanwide began marketing the site for about $300 million in 2019 and lowered its asking price to $200 million last year.
Quote:
Without its New York property, Oceanwide is down to just one US project — an unfinished 2 million square foot (185,806 square metre) hotel, condo and retail development in Los Angeles dubbed Oceanwide Plaza.

Last October, creditors foreclosed on Oceanwide’s San Francisco mixed-use project after the company defaulted on a $320 million bond repayment. The development is now for sale.

In March, Oceanwide agreed to sell its Kapolei West residential site on the Hawaiian island of Oahu to a local firm at a loss of $24.8 million.

The company said in its annual report in March that it plans to sell its three Hawaii projects and its South Street Seaport supertall development in New York City this year so it can focus on the long-delayed Oceanwide Plaza project in Los Angeles.
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  #711  
Old Posted Jul 29, 2022, 10:08 PM
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https://therealdeal.com/2022/07/29/b...for-just-169m/

Buyer nabs Oceanwide’s distressed supertall site for just $169M
China-based firm, which paid $390M, lost control of FiDi project in May






New York
Jul. 29, 2022


Quote:
…..Oceanwide was planning a tower that would rise roughly 1,500 feet. By roof height, it would have been the tallest building in Lower Manhattan. Three years after Oceanwide bought the site, however, it quietly started marketing it for $300 million.

Last year, Oceanwide started trying to sell the site again, looking for around $200 million. But potential buyers might have surmised that they could get it for less by waiting.
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  #712  
Old Posted Jul 29, 2022, 10:20 PM
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It would be nice if the new buyer builds that design, though I doubt it. Who wants to spend $40m to live next to the FDR? That elevated highway should come down ASAP. This area should get a lot of greenspace. Streets should be closed and turned into parks. This is a Class-D office area, but it could become a VERY desirable place to live. I’d love to see all of those crappy Class-D office buildings razed and replaced with beautiful residentials.

Last edited by JMKeynes; Jul 29, 2022 at 10:58 PM.
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  #713  
Old Posted Jul 30, 2022, 5:56 PM
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I wonder how long until it’s revealed who the buyers are. A few guesses from me, Extell, JDS, Macklowe, Silverstein, maybe even Related or Brookfield. Could be RXR or even Vornado. Maybe even one of the lesser known firms.


https://www.pincusco.com/anonymous-l...fidi-dev-site/

Anonymous LLC buys $169M note secured by China Oceanwide Holdings’s FiDi dev site


July 29, 2022


Quote:
The anonymous entity New York – 80 South Street, LLC bought a note with an latest principal of $169 million from DW Partners secured by China Oceanwide Holdings’s development site composed of the industrial building (E9) at 163 Front Street and office building (O2) at 80 South Street in Financial District, Manhattan.


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  #714  
Old Posted Jul 30, 2022, 7:01 PM
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I hope that this tower will be 113 REAL floors!
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  #715  
Old Posted Jul 30, 2022, 9:47 PM
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Originally Posted by JMKeynes View Post
It would be nice if the new buyer builds that design, though I doubt it. Who wants to spend $40m to live next to the FDR? That elevated highway should come down ASAP. This area should get a lot of greenspace. Streets should be closed and turned into parks. This is a Class-D office area, but it could become a VERY desirable place to live. I’d love to see all of those crappy Class-D office buildings razed and replaced with beautiful residentials.
I am surprised to find that I mostly agree with this take. The city should work with the state and the feds to bury FDR and convert the space into biking/pedestrian and green space. It's a great location for more residential.
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  #716  
Old Posted Jul 30, 2022, 10:12 PM
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Originally Posted by BuildThemTaller View Post
I am surprised to find that I mostly agree with this take. The city should work with the state and the feds to bury FDR and convert the space into biking/pedestrian and green space. It's a great location for more residential.
It already is that. I usually bike it when I’m biking. It’s also restaurant, promenade, and park space.
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  #717  
Old Posted Jul 31, 2022, 2:28 AM
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Originally Posted by BuildThemTaller View Post
I am surprised to find that I mostly agree with this take. The city should work with the state and the feds to bury FDR and convert the space into biking/pedestrian and green space. It's a great location for more residential.
The FDR doesn’t need to be buried. It could just end at City Hall/BB. Lower Manhattan could turn into a stunning, green residential area.

They could start with Water St. It should be one-way with two lanes, and there should be no street parking. All of the other lanes should be converted into green pedestrian areas. The same should occur with South Street which could be one way in the other direction. Fulton St too…

Last edited by JMKeynes; Jul 31, 2022 at 4:09 AM.
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  #718  
Old Posted Jul 31, 2022, 2:18 PM
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It already is that. I usually bike it when I’m biking. It’s also restaurant, promenade, and park space.
Are you talking about the elevated highway that sits on top of another road? Yeah, that's not buried underground. There's a thin pedestrian and bikeway under a lavender overpass. I'm talking Boston Big Dig here. There's no reason for the FDR (or the West Side Highway, for that matter) to be surface level or elevated highways. Bury those underground and give the waterfront fully back to the pedestrians with green space and additional sea walls.
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  #719  
Old Posted Jul 31, 2022, 4:58 PM
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^ Listen, I’m not gonna go back and forth with either of you about the FDR, not in this thread. I’m here for 80 South Street. All ifger concerns should be addressed elsewhere.
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  #720  
Old Posted Jul 31, 2022, 5:53 PM
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This is close to South Seaport right? Since that one didn't happen I hope whoever the developer for this site is, picks up all of those air rights. And anymore they find and can aquire.
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