Rail relocation Winnipeg

[FactaNV]

Originally Posted by bodaggin

I've always found that argument absurd. Remediation, sure, 100%.

But everyone's been crying about "revitalizing downtown" and "more high density residential" and "rapid transit".

This gives you all 3. In 1 fell swoop.

It's practically downtown, it's perfect for high density residential, and would be located right on the rapid transit hub for the entire city.

This isn't SimCity. Who is going to build it? Which companies have that much capital that isn't tied up in more profitable cities and actually wants to build in what is essentially a wasteland with no surrounding amenities minus the sliver next to the North Exchange. No one is popping down Southwood Circle next to North Point Douglas, West Alexander and the North End. It wouldn't be profitable to begin with and would attract no one at the price point it would need to be at with interest rates.

Maybe public housing could go there but then we'd essentially be building Cabrini Green or O Block North - not a great idea.

[NewIreland]

Originally Posted by FactaNV

This isn't SimCity. Who is going to build it? Which companies have that much capital that isn't tied up in more profitable cities and actually wants to build in what is essentially a wasteland with no surrounding amenities minus the sliver next to the North Exchange. No one is popping down Southwood Circle next to North Point Douglas, West Alexander and the North End. It wouldn't be profitable to begin with and would attract no one at the price point it would need to be at with interest rates.

They said the same about the Forks.

[thebasketballgeek]

My pie in the sky idea is make a second, much larger U of W campus in the rail yards, or just develop a brand new post-secondary institution. Maybe try targeting it in particular to Indigenous groups around the country (and maybe internationally) to take advantage of the young population in the North End. Hell call it Université Louis Riel and make it completely bilingual to get francophone students too. Develop it with a shit ton of student housing and dedicate a large amount of space for the proposed urban national park. Of course keep some of the rail lines introduce RT.

It would theoretically succeed in improving both ridership and quality of public transit, makes the area a lot more vibrant with the increased density, create a lot of high paying jobs, and increase the amount of green space in the area.

On the other hand CN should sell the land to Six Flags and let them come up with an amusement park

[FactaNV]

Originally Posted by NewIreland

They said the same about the Forks.

That's like comparing apples to apple IPads. The only thing they have in common is the name, apple to Apple, railyard to railyard. It's facetious to compare the two.

[bodaggin]

Everyone seems to be obsessed over yard details and uses, so here you go. The use for the land is not our decision, it's the market's. He with the cash decides.

Yellow is roughly 260A of lands rezoned to the developers choosing (except heavy industry). It gets auctioned to the highest bidder by CP Rail the current owner.
City of Winnipeg does NOT purchase the yellow.

Blue is 500,000sqft of buildings, auctioned by CP to highest bidders for lighter commercial use. CoW does not purchase this.

Purple is the ONLY thing purchased by City of Winnipeg. Rail lines and a small chunk for LRT shops,
the main LRT Union Station transfer hub, and some switching lines.

[pegster]

^ You could have almost straight shot LRT line from the airport to downtown, maybe a jog to RRC. Ah, we can dream.

[bodaggin]

I just heat-mapped some common citywide "busy spots", scribbled in orange. I wanted to overlay them, to visualize how well the existing rail system covers these hotspots.
A precursor toward some LRT route suggestions.

The existing purple rail system doesn't leave a lot of these hotspots out. Polo, Regent, Wilkes, Kenaston, U of M, Forks, Both Stadiums, Airport.
All are basically covered or easily linked with a short connecting spur.

Notably stranded spots include: St Vital, Leila, Kildonan, some Unicity, and quite a bit of downtown.

Some could be connected by rapid jumper busses. But the more transfers, the slower overall ride time becomes. Ideas welcome.

I'm going to study this more and propose some fixes and final routes. This is complicated stuff.

[harls]

Breathe, man.

[bodaggin]

Originally Posted by harls

Breathe, man.

Underachiever alert. You work for a Union, Gov, or both?

[harls]

Originally Posted by bodaggin

Underachiever alert. You work for a Union, Gov, or both?

None of the above. You just seem like you need to pace yourself before you have a heart attack with all your whiteboard ideas, mister.

[FactaNV]

Originally Posted by harls

None of the above. You just seem like you need to pace yourself before you have a heart attack with all your whiteboard ideas, mister.

https://imgur.com/gallery/3qy695F

[bodaggin]

Originally Posted by harls

None of the above. You just seem like you need to pace yourself before you have a heart attack with all your whiteboard ideas, mister.

Both it is.

Harls, this is a great site. There's some smart people on here. Good ideas and passionate discussion. Neither of which the decision makers of this city/province possess.

It seems to be up to the people to fix these problems. So I'm doing my best to light that fire.

[FactaNV]

Originally Posted by bodaggin

Both it is.

Harls, this is a great site. There's some smart people on here. Good ideas and passionate discussion. Neither of which the decision makers of this city/province possess.

It seems to be up to the people to fix these problems. So I'm doing my best to light that fire.

What is this in regards to haha?

[harls]

Did you see the 'last job' part?

I haven't worked for the feds since 2021.

[bodaggin]

Horey crap. I might be onto something. Prelim LRT Conversion Route Proposal. Four lines. Two transfer stations. Look at all the possibilities with 1 single connection.

Remaining problems:
-Downtown, U of W, HSC, Arena coverage sucks.
-Leila/Seven Oaks coverage sucks.
-St Vital Mall coverage sucks.
-Assinaboine Park/Zoo coverage sucks.
-Kildonan is abandoned (dedicated bus line could solve).

There's promise here. Will keep thinking. Keep in mind these are ALL EXISTING rail lines.

[WildCake]

Originally Posted by bodaggin

Horey crap. I might be onto something. Prelim LRT Conversion Route Proposal. Four lines. Two transfer stations. Look at all the possibilities with 1 single connection.

Remaining problems:
-Downtown, U of W, HSC, Arena coverage sucks.
-Leila/Seven Oaks coverage sucks.
-St Vital Mall coverage sucks.
-Assinaboine Park/Zoo coverage sucks.
-Kildonan is abandoned (dedicated bus line could solve).

There's promise here. Will keep thinking. Keep in mind these are ALL EXISTING rail lines.

If by some sort of twisted miracle from the heavens above, the Feds, the Province, and the City find that 10+ billion dollars is acceptable to spend on this rail relocation project and they start to act on this plan next week, it'll take north of a decade to implement and move CN and CP out.

Then you have to find the funds to set up a whole LRT system (garages, buying the trains, hiring and training staff).

I appreciate your passion to making this city a better place, and you're right that Winnipeg does aim low a lot of times, but if you have this much energy, passion, and big dreams for the city please redirect it to steps that would make such a plan a reality. Creating designs on a discussion forum and getting angry with ad hominem responses when others point out the holes in your plans only goes so far. Talk to politicians, get some community movement.

Winnipeg has a transit master plan. Maybe be a community voice for the next edition of the plan, because unless the Feds and Province are in a money printing mood, that's more of a realistic option of what RT will look like in the next decades.

[bodaggin]

Originally Posted by WildCake

If by some sort of twisted miracle from the heavens above, the Feds, the Province, and the City find that 10+ billion dollars is acceptable to spend on this rail relocation project and they start to act on this plan next week, it'll take north of a decade to implement and move CN and CP out.

You guys aren't listening. Relocating the yards and converting to LRT does NOT cost $10b. It's $1.5-2B. And it's already built. Taking mere years to get running.

Building from SCRATCH is $10B. Or even $20B. It's the land acquisition and construction that is slow + costly. Building BRT from scratch, same thing. Takes half a century. Winnipeg is already half a century behind. Rail conversion is the golden goose.

Originally Posted by WildCake

Talk to politicians, get some community movement.

Ideas don't follow channels. They're organic. They start somewhere. This is a community, it's also public. Politicians can read it. Community can read it. And they can say "hey, this makes sense, let's dig deeper into it".

I'm not going to spend my life fighting bureaucracy on a mega-project. But I can spend a bit of time doing the high level stuff, publishing it in the open, and see what happens.

Good ideas have a way of catching on and finding their ways to the windsocks in charge.

[FactaNV]

Originally Posted by bodaggin

You guys aren't listening. Relocating the yards and converting to LRT does NOT cost $10b. It's $1.5-2B. And it's already built. Taking mere years to get running.

Building from SCRATCH is $10B. Or even $20B. It's the land acquisition and construction that is slow + costly. Building BRT from scratch, same thing. Takes half a century. Winnipeg is already half a century behind. Rail conversion is the golden goose.




Ideas don't follow channels. They're organic. They start somewhere. This is a community, it's also public. Politicians can read it. Community can read it. And they can say "hey, this makes sense, let's dig deeper into it".

I'm not going to spend my life fighting bureaucracy on a mega-project. But I can spend a bit of time doing the high level stuff, publishing it in the open, and see what happens.

Good ideas have a way of catching on and finding their ways to the windsocks in charge.

If you think the rail relocation will cost 1.5-2 billion, I've got an Arlington Bridge to sell you. The remediation alone will probably double that.

[harls]

Originally Posted by FactaNV

If you think the rail relocation will cost 2-3 billion, I've got an Arlington Bridge to sell you. The remediation alone will probably double that.

I don't think this guy has slept all night. Give him some slack

[rivercity]

Keep in mind, you would have to convert the existing tracks, install electrical infrastructure, construct and extend services for various stations, purchase of the rolling stock, construction of a maintenance facility..