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  #381  
Old Posted Sep 6, 2022, 3:31 PM
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Originally Posted by iheartthed View Post
I agree with this. I'd also add that it's hard to attribute Anne Arundel to D.C. since it directly borders Baltimore. If Anne Arundel becomes part of the D.C. MSA then so does Baltimore.
Anne Arundel is part of Baltimore metro area since 1950, when the US Census Bureau first came up with the concept. While most of urbanized area inside Anne Arundel is adjacent to Baltimore, there's a forest reserve between it and Washington built up area. And the southern half of the county, closer to Washington, is not urbanized.

Howard County growth pattern is more similar to Washington MSA than to Baltimore MSA, but the most populated communities are way closer to Baltimore than to DC.
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  #382  
Old Posted Sep 6, 2022, 3:39 PM
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Originally Posted by nito View Post
Where are these coaches every 10mins? Looking at your own links (plus further research), there are just six services (2 Greyhound, 1 Chinatown, 1 Flixbus, 1 Megabus + 1 Peter Pan) that arrive in New York from Philadelphia in the 3-hour period of 0600-0900. A 30-minute frequency isn’t exactly great especially considering the lower capacity provided by coaches.

Out of interest, over the same time period, there are five coaches that run from Birmingham (2 Flixbus, 2 National Express + 1 Megabus) arriving in London between 0600-0900.
I see 4 Greyhound, 2 Megabus, 1 Peter Pan, and 1 Flixbus. The "Chinatown bus" is not a single operator. It is a collection of operators based in NYC's Chinatown, and I don't think they publish schedules online. That said, these services appear to slow down during rush hour. After 10am, Greyhound alone runs between Philadelphia and NYC about every 20-30 minutes.
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  #383  
Old Posted Sep 6, 2022, 4:17 PM
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Originally Posted by tech12 View Post
I'd say SF is the dominant anchor city.

...

But yeah, it sure isn't as dominant as say, NYC.
This is more what I meant. You extract NYC from its metro, and you are left with hedge fund-rich Greenwich, Yale, Princeton, and some F500s in North Jersey.

Do the inverse of that exercise for SF. No Silicon Valley, Stanford, Berkeley, Napa/Sonoma wine country, East Bay diversity, wooded areas of San Mateo County, etc. SF in isolation is still fantastic, but it needs the rest of the metro area to really feel more complete. Moreover, the fact that the moniker "Bay Area" is not just readily associated with SF but also often a metonym is telling, especially when SF is a very culturally distinct, neatly defined geopolitical entity locally, nationally, and globally.

I also disagree that SF and Oakland are the same city. City center to city center, they are 7 miles apart as the crow flies. It's not anything like Lower Manhattan and Downtown Brooklyn. If you mean they, along with Berkeley, constitute an urban core like Boston-Cambridge-Somerville, I'd agree. But again, the Charles River at its widest is only half a mile, and you can actually walk from Back Bay to MIT and Harvard along a single thoroughfare that is pretty urban and pedestrian friendly.

Interestingly, the SF-Oakland dynamic sort of parallels DC-Baltimore, whereby locals insist on Oakland having its own distinct flavor. Warriors moved to SF, just like how the Bullets moved to DC. Baltimore and Oakland lost their respective NFL teams, while their respective MLB teams relocated from elsewhere.
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  #384  
Old Posted Sep 6, 2022, 4:36 PM
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Originally Posted by iheartthed View Post
According to the thread that showed average incomes per MSA, SF still has a bit more jobs than SJ.
It makes sense. SF is denser and more commercial; SJ is mostly SFHs and sprawling office parks.

Apple
Google
Intel
HP
Cisco
Netflix

Stanford

Apple and Google are #3 and #9 on the F500, respectively. The former in particular is located in hardcore Santa Clara County (Cupertino), away from the Bay and surrounded on all four sides by sprawl. Meta (then Facebook) was once headquartered in Palo Alto. Today, it's based in adjacent Menlo Park — technically SF MSA, but culturally still more in the sphere of SJ IMO — and has a large campus in Sunnyvale. I would say Redwood City feels most like the transition point between SF-SJ, and it also happens to be in the middle geographically.
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  #385  
Old Posted Sep 7, 2022, 9:37 AM
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Originally Posted by iheartthed View Post
I see 4 Greyhound, 2 Megabus, 1 Peter Pan, and 1 Flixbus. The "Chinatown bus" is not a single operator. It is a collection of operators based in NYC's Chinatown, and I don't think they publish schedules online. That said, these services appear to slow down during rush hour. Greyhound alone runs between NYC and Philadelphia about every 20-30 minutes.
A quick search of www.greyhound.com schedules shows that there are just 10 services on a typical day (in this case Weds 7th September), only two of them arrive in New York between 0600-0900 (0740 + 0810). I don’t know where you’re getting all these phantom Greyhound coaches from. There isn’t even a frequent service during the typical day; miss that Greyhound coach at 1000 and the next one is a 3hr 30min wait, so the idea that Greyhound alone operates every 20-30mins is farcical.



As for these ‘Chinatown’ operators, what are they exactly if they don’t publish schedules online (itself peculiar in the digital era), some sort of illegal/unofficial/unregulated operators like what you’d find in the interior of Africa? How can anyone plan a journey if no one knows where or when they’re running, how long the journey will take, or how much it’ll cost?

This fascination over coaches is just peculiar; they are low capacity, infrequent and slow, and even then there aren’t anywhere near the 100’s that you think (and unable to prove) there are. By my quick count, there are 50 coaches running from Philadelphia to New York each weekday across all operators; which is circa 2,000-3,000 seats per day. That is absolutely trivial against the capacity of heavy rail.

Far from New York-Philadelphia being the easiest major cities to travel between, or the two major cities with the most capacity, both are significantly behind other city pairs today, a disparity that will grow far starker in coming years as other countries invest in more capacity, higher frequencies, and longer and faster services.
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  #386  
Old Posted Sep 7, 2022, 2:31 PM
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Originally Posted by nito View Post
As for these ‘Chinatown’ operators, what are they exactly if they don’t publish schedules online (itself peculiar in the digital era), some sort of illegal/unofficial/unregulated operators like what you’d find in the interior of Africa? How can anyone plan a journey if no one knows where or when they’re running, how long the journey will take, or how much it’ll cost?

This fascination over coaches is just peculiar; they are low capacity, infrequent and slow, and even then there aren’t anywhere near the 100’s that you think (and unable to prove) there are. By my quick count, there are 50 coaches running from Philadelphia to New York each weekday across all operators; which is circa 2,000-3,000 seats per day. That is absolutely trivial against the capacity of heavy rail.

Far from New York-Philadelphia being the easiest major cities to travel between, or the two major cities with the most capacity, both are significantly behind other city pairs today, a disparity that will grow far starker in coming years as other countries invest in more capacity, higher frequencies, and longer and faster services.
You don't even know what a Chinatown bus is, so I guess I'd advise you not to be so absolute in demonstrating your understanding of NY transit options lol.
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  #387  
Old Posted Sep 7, 2022, 4:14 PM
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Originally Posted by Quixote View Post
It makes sense. SF is denser and more commercial; SJ is mostly SFHs and sprawling office parks.

Apple
Google
Intel
HP
Cisco
Netflix

Stanford

Apple and Google are #3 and #9 on the F500, respectively. The former in particular is located in hardcore Santa Clara County (Cupertino), away from the Bay and surrounded on all four sides by sprawl. Meta (then Facebook) was once headquartered in Palo Alto. Today, it's based in adjacent Menlo Park — technically SF MSA, but culturally still more in the sphere of SJ IMO — and has a large campus in Sunnyvale. I would say Redwood City feels most like the transition point between SF-SJ, and it also happens to be in the middle geographically.
Agree with Redwood City on the peninsula. Also, San Leandro for the east bay though everything south to Fremont is part of the SF side, Alameda county. Parts of lower east bay remind me of Southern California. We just don't have any Kardashian's up here.
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  #388  
Old Posted Sep 7, 2022, 5:49 PM
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Originally Posted by nito View Post
A quick search of www.greyhound.com schedules shows that there are just 10 services on a typical day (in this case Weds 7th September), only two of them arrive in New York between 0600-0900 (0740 + 0810). I don’t know where you’re getting all these phantom Greyhound coaches from. There isn’t even a frequent service during the typical day; miss that Greyhound coach at 1000 and the next one is a 3hr 30min wait, so the idea that Greyhound alone operates every 20-30mins is farcical.



As for these ‘Chinatown’ operators, what are they exactly if they don’t publish schedules online (itself peculiar in the digital era), some sort of illegal/unofficial/unregulated operators like what you’d find in the interior of Africa? How can anyone plan a journey if no one knows where or when they’re running, how long the journey will take, or how much it’ll cost?

This fascination over coaches is just peculiar; they are low capacity, infrequent and slow, and even then there aren’t anywhere near the 100’s that you think (and unable to prove) there are. By my quick count, there are 50 coaches running from Philadelphia to New York each weekday across all operators; which is circa 2,000-3,000 seats per day. That is absolutely trivial against the capacity of heavy rail.

Far from New York-Philadelphia being the easiest major cities to travel between, or the two major cities with the most capacity, both are significantly behind other city pairs today, a disparity that will grow far starker in coming years as other countries invest in more capacity, higher frequencies, and longer and faster services.
dear nigel, what is peculiar is your calling busses coaches. its not the robin hood era, although you are a vassal state. anyway there are multiple chinatowns and many, many multiple bus options plying from nyc to dc and elsewhere daily. no, not all of them have websites, or have them in english, but many do if your lazy self had even bothered to look. but we know why you didn’t look, dont we?

ie., this first one that popped up has six trips available for tomorrow and the next one has 18 trips. good luck with your life on some of these services, they generally don’t have very good or safe reputations, but they will get you around the usa cheap:

https://www.ilikebus.com/search-bus/...-washington-dc

https://www.gotobus.com/bus/search?c...dult=1&child=0
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  #389  
Old Posted Sep 7, 2022, 7:16 PM
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Originally Posted by JManc View Post
Agree with Redwood City on the peninsula. Also, San Leandro for the east bay though everything south to Fremont is part of the SF side, Alameda county. Parts of lower east bay remind me of Southern California. We just don't have any Kardashian's up here.
For Alameda County, I'd probably pick Hayward actually as the transition point. It has a decent commercial downtown for suburban East Bay standards. Everything Union City/Fremont down feels more like Santa Clara County/SoCal sprawl even though it's technically in Alameda County, dominated by East and South Asians, whereas Hayward is much more diverse and urban with lots of high density housing going up.
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  #390  
Old Posted Sep 7, 2022, 9:13 PM
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Originally Posted by Quixote View Post
I would say Redwood City feels most like the transition point between SF-SJ, and it also happens to be in the middle geographically.
Redwood City is also the San Mateo County seat; the county offices and courthouses downtown are basically why (pre-pandemic) it had the fifth busiest Caltrain station.
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  #391  
Old Posted Sep 7, 2022, 10:05 PM
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For Alameda County, I'd probably pick Hayward actually as the transition point. It has a decent commercial downtown for suburban East Bay standards. Everything Union City/Fremont down feels more like Santa Clara County/SoCal sprawl even though it's technically in Alameda County, dominated by East and South Asians, whereas Hayward is much more diverse and urban with lots of high density housing going up.
Yeah, that makes more sense.
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  #392  
Old Posted Sep 8, 2022, 10:35 PM
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Sharing this for those interested and related to my Philly/NYC connection that is showing no signs of slowing down:

Affordability, walkability, more space and easy access to city life is attracting people from more expensive markets to resettle in the Philadelphia area — particularly since the start of the Covid-19 pandemic and shift to remote work. New York transplants are leading the way.

Out-of-towners — whether they be from New York, California, Chicago or Florida — often bring with them higher salaries and higher budgets. As they do, home prices and rents are rising in Philadelphia and its suburbs.

The average adjusted gross income for people relocating from Manhattan to Montgomery County in the 2019 and 2020 tax filing years, for example, was over $198,000, according to census data. That was more than twice Montgomery County’s 2020 median household income of $94,000. In all, new transplants from Manhattan and Brooklyn alone brought $455 million in annual income to the five-county region over those two years.

More than 4,600 New Yorkers moved from New York County (Manhattan), Kings County (Brooklyn) or Queens County (Queens) to the five-county Philadelphia area in 2019 and 2020, according to census data. That makes New York City the largest source of new residents in Philadelphia and each of its collar counties — Bucks, Chester, Delaware and Montgomery — outside of the tri-state area.


https://www.bizjournals.com/philadel...ladelphia.html
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  #393  
Old Posted Sep 9, 2022, 2:54 AM
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Originally Posted by EastSideHBG View Post
Sharing this for those interested and related to my Philly/NYC connection that is showing no signs of slowing down:

Affordability, walkability, more space and easy access to city life is attracting people from more expensive markets to resettle in the Philadelphia area — particularly since the start of the Covid-19 pandemic and shift to remote work. New York transplants are leading the way.

Out-of-towners — whether they be from New York, California, Chicago or Florida — often bring with them higher salaries and higher budgets. As they do, home prices and rents are rising in Philadelphia and its suburbs.

The average adjusted gross income for people relocating from Manhattan to Montgomery County in the 2019 and 2020 tax filing years, for example, was over $198,000, according to census data. That was more than twice Montgomery County’s 2020 median household income of $94,000. In all, new transplants from Manhattan and Brooklyn alone brought $455 million in annual income to the five-county region over those two years.

More than 4,600 New Yorkers moved from New York County (Manhattan), Kings County (Brooklyn) or Queens County (Queens) to the five-county Philadelphia area in 2019 and 2020, according to census data. That makes New York City the largest source of new residents in Philadelphia and each of its collar counties — Bucks, Chester, Delaware and Montgomery — outside of the tri-state area.


https://www.bizjournals.com/philadel...ladelphia.html
I know a couple who moved to from San Francisco to Philadelphia a couple years ago--they had their first child there. He was a forumer a long time ago.
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  #394  
Old Posted Sep 12, 2022, 1:02 PM
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Originally Posted by mrnyc View Post
dear nigel, what is peculiar is your calling busses coaches. its not the robin hood era, although you are a vassal state.
Coaches are high floor buses you ignoramus… https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Coach_(bus)

Quote:
Originally Posted by mrnyc View Post
anyway there are multiple chinatowns and many, many multiple bus options plying from nyc to dc and elsewhere daily. no, not all of them have websites, or have them in english, but many do if your lazy self had even bothered to look. but we know why you didn’t look, dont we?

ie., this first one that popped up has six trips available for tomorrow and the next one has 18 trips. good luck with your life on some of these services, they generally don’t have very good or safe reputations, but they will get you around the usa cheap:
https://www.ilikebus.com/search-bus/...-washington-dc
https://www.gotobus.com/bus/search?c...dult=1&child=0
The burden isn’t on my shoulders to substantiate a claim produced by another person that there are 100’s of coaches/buses between New York and Philadelphia. I did however undertake a cursory look the other week (using iheartthed’s links), which is where I discovered that there were circa 50 coaches on a typical weekday.

Not even your own additional search websites (oddly you confused Washington DC for Philadelphia, but we’ll overlook your geographical lapse) show hundreds of these phantom services, they’re even duplicating some of the services already addressed earlier in the conversation (e.g. ourbus) or show the same service but under different brands (e.g. Heylong on ilikebus, and Focus Travel on gotobus).

I don’t even get this fascination of coaches when they have low capacities compared to typical intercity trainsets in the US, let alone international trainsets. Also New York is meant to be a developed world city; you’d be hard pushed to find operators with questionable safety records and unofficial opaque operations in equivalent developed world cities.

Philadelphia to New York probably has the highest capacity and level of interactions between two cities in the US, but it is dwarfed elsewhere in the world, and that is a divergence that will grow further as various countries continue to see investment in faster and higher capacity routes come online.
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