California High Speed Rail Thread

[StethJeff]

Originally Posted by skyscraperfan23

California should be ashamed of themselves, this is not only gonna be bad for taxpayers, but it will also destroy califorina's farmland as we know it.

are you serious??

[ozone]

Seems like it's the Floridians that are pissed by our HSR project. Why?

[bunt_q]

Originally Posted by fflint

How will the loss of 1,300 out of 2,000,000 agricultural acres "destroy California's farmland as we know it"? You've been drinking the Kool Aid.

Speaking on behalf of the good people of Colorado, and in support of HSR, I think we'll allow California to take a little more of the Colorado River water we're not using... say, enough to water 1,300 acres of desert. That way we can get a template for HSR in a place where I think it actually has a good chance of succeeding. I was always afraid that if the first system we got up and running was in central Florida, it stood an above-average chance of failing miserably and forever tainting HSR for the rest of the U.S. On the other hand, if the first system is a success, everybody else will want more. The northeast, the midwest, maybe even Florida someday...and definitely Colorado's Front Range.

[Yankee]

Yes! I had no doubt it was gonna pass though. This is what California does best, being at the leading edge of innovation. Always has been, always will be, regardless of recessions and other temporary setbacks. No better place to build the nation's first high-speed rail. Congrats CA, congrats America!

[urbanactivist]

Congrats to California!! Once again proving that we can still do big things, and taking the lead in doing so!

Now the singular focus has to be on the November election... not only getting Obama reelected, but putting a Democratic majority in both houses so this investment will get some real help.

[skyscraperfan23]

Originally Posted by ozone

Seems like it's the Floridians that are pissed by our HSR project. Why?

Because we floridians told the truth here, it's a project that is involved with taxpayers expense and that we cannot afford, thank god a private partnership with FEC with their version of HSR is the one that will have no taxpayer's funding for it and that's the right decision, CA, you state is broke, you have a 16 billion dollar state debt, massive illegal immigration that is worse than ours and you talking about congratulations CA, please, your state is gonna add the debt to our children again.

Congratulations florida we did the right thing and allow the free market to introduce the High Speed rail and rick scott rejected that taxpayer spending HSR for good reason, as corrupt as scott was he did the right thing.

[skyscraperfan23]

Originally Posted by fflint

How will the loss of 1,300 out of 2,000,000 agricultural acres "destroy California's farmland as we know it"? You've been drinking the Kool Aid.

See the stories, it's all true, HSR is gonna destroy tradtional middle class jobs and much more.
it is just as bad as that Big Oil Pipeline.

[Busy Bee]

I've become particularly politically immersed the last few years with a focus on the intersection between political philosophies and transport. If the current left/right paradigm is "false," it's the realist "false" I've ever witnessed.

[zilfondel]

Originally Posted by fflint

How will the loss of 1,300 out of 2,000,000 agricultural acres "destroy California's farmland as we know it"? You've been drinking the Kool Aid.

Its worse!

California, the nation's top agricultural producer, also leads the states in the number of new residents added annually. California's population is projected to double to 63 million by 2040. If the resulting increase in urban acreage replaces farmland, California agriculture will lose nearly 5 million acres — 17% of today's total farmland base. With it will go open space, which is now a refuge for some wildlife.

Source: http://ucanr.org/repository/CAO/land...1&fulltext=yes

[skyscraperfan23]

Originally Posted by zilfondel

Its worse!



Source: http://ucanr.org/repository/CAO/land...1&fulltext=yes

and this so-called high speed rail in CA is gonna make things worse, because it threatens that farm land.

http://www.sfgate.com/news/article/C...il-3684819.php

[drifting sun]

I love how public transportation projects are always deemed "unrealistic boondoggles created by mushy-headed liberals". Yeah, it's totally realistic on the other hand, to go about our lives as if the material resources we depend upon for our modern society are limitless.

Skyscraperfan23 - do you think you could pause the nonsensical cirque du rant that is going on inside your head and think about issues within a larger context than your pocketbook, just for a brief moment? You keep complaining and parroting the now wearisome sound bytes of teabaggers and ilk, like - "taxes are evil", "who's going to pay for this?" "failed policies", "kills jobs", etc.

Well, too bad. Conservative noisemakers might be making progress in different parts of the country (Wisconsin), but at least in California, HSR is going to happen, and unless you make a lot of money I bet your Fed. taxes do not go up, so quit whining.

[skyscraperfan23]

Originally Posted by drifting sun

I love how public transportation projects are always deemed "unrealistic boondoggles created by mushy-headed liberals". Yeah, it's totally realistic on the other hand, to go about our lives as if the material resources we depend upon for our modern society are limitless.

Skyscraperfan23 - do you think you could pause the nonsensical cirque du rant that is going on inside your head and think about issues within a larger context than your pocketbook, just for a brief moment? You keep complaining and parroting the now wearisome sound bytes of teabaggers and ilk, like - "taxes are evil", "who's going to pay for this?" "failed policies", "kills jobs", etc.

Well, too bad. Conservative noisemakers might be making progress in different parts of the country (Wisconsin), but at least in California, HSR is going to happen, and unless you make a lot of money I bet your Fed. taxes do not go up, so quit whining.

Do I Care, glad florida has killed HSR for good reason, another reason why taxpayers should not be paying for it.
and I'm glad I Got off of the left/right paradigm.

[Grego43]

Originally Posted by ozone

Seems like it's the Floridians that are pissed by our HSR project. Why?

Not all Floridians...I for one am green with envy...and embarrassed at what a backward, anti-progressive, tea bagger state Florida is fast becoming.

[KevinFromTexas]

I would suggest since this is something that benefits all taxpayers (the general public) that it should be paid for with taxes. Besides, having it paid for with private dollars creates the possibility that they can jack up the prices as high as they want.

[edluva]

california's population is not going to hit 63million by 2040 (you can't project growth rates indefinitely into the future, everybody knows that) and skyscraperfan23's gloomy and idiotic depiction of california's future is not going to pan out.

unlike florida, california actually enriches the world (and in turn itself) through leading technological innovation, trade, education, and culture, and it continues to be a desireable place to live. plus, it stands to lose far less of its land to rising sea levels (florida stands to disappear completely in some scenarios)

california is going through a rough spot, much like the rest of this country. but hsr is prudent planning well beyond this recessionary period.

the future will come whether we like it or not. some states can react to it (florida) while others continue to create it (california)

thanks for your transportation money, florida!

[northbay]

edluva, well said.

[LosAngelesSportsFan]

Originally Posted by edluva

california's population is not going to hit 63million by 2040 (you can't project growth rates indefinitely into the future, everybody knows that) and skyscraperfan23's gloomy and idiotic depiction of california's future is not going to pan out.

unlike florida, california actually enriches the world (and in turn itself) through leading technological innovation, trade, education, and culture, and it continues to be a desireable place to live. plus, it stands to lose far less of its land to rising sea levels (florida stands to disappear completely in some scenarios)

california is going through a rough spot, much like the rest of this country. but hsr is prudent planning well beyond this recessionary period.

the future will come whether we like it or not. some states can react to it (florida) while others continue to create it (california)

thanks for your transportation money, florida!

exactly right.

[pesto]

Originally Posted by edluva

california's population is not going to hit 63million by 2040 (you can't project growth rates indefinitely into the future, everybody knows that) and skyscraperfan23's gloomy and idiotic depiction of california's future is not going to pan out.

unlike florida, california actually enriches the world (and in turn itself) through leading technological innovation, trade, education, and culture, and it continues to be a desireable place to live. plus, it stands to lose far less of its land to rising sea levels (florida stands to disappear completely in some scenarios)

california is going through a rough spot, much like the rest of this country. but hsr is prudent planning well beyond this recessionary period.

the future will come whether we like it or not. some states can react to it (florida) while others continue to create it (california)

thanks for your transportation money, florida!

Correct on the immateriality of HSR to ag land. In any event, let the land find it's highest use; if tech land is worth more, then so be it. Grow the food somewhere else.

The technology, weather, etc., in California are great but off the subject; the ocean rising comment is gratuitous.

The good news is that most of the money is going to improving transit within the LA and Bay areas. I am still hopeful that over time the CV portion will be allowed to die off completely, but politics may require that to take a few years.

[Derek]

Originally Posted by skyscraperfan23

See the stories, it's all true, HSR is gonna destroy tradtional middle class jobs and much more.
it is just as bad as that Big Oil Pipeline.

Get your tinfoil hat folks!

[bunt_q]

So I apologize if this has been posted already in this thread someplace, but does somebody have good info (or a link to it) that summarizes how much of the project (geographically, timewise, and budgetwise) this first batch of big money covers? An "already funded" map maybe? I recognize this is only step one... I guess I'm wondering how far into the project this will get California. I assume somewhere along the way there'll be a point of no return. A point where all but the most crazy opponents will recognize that so much time/money has been spent that's it'd be foolish not to finish the system - nobody wants a half-built train stretching across half the west coast. Does this pot of money get us that far?