SAN ANTONIO | Urban Core Development Thread

[JACKinBeantown]

Originally Posted by SproutingTowers

I did a measurement test from Google Maps and if you remove Camden St and include the parcel across from it to I-35, then have room for a basketball arena. Having an arena here would be perfect where have direct access to the Riverwalk and walking distance to the Pearl.

Basketball... sure. The Spurs have been in town for 50 years but have played in a terrible location outside of downtown for the past 20. Bring them back downtown along with some rail transit to get people there without their cars (never gonna happen in San Antonio in my lifetime), include some underground parking and neighborhood improvements, and I'm all for it. But not a baseball stadium downtown for a team that doesn't exist.

Oh, and make the Spurs pay for at least 50% of it. They are a private corporation, after all.

[theOGalexd]

Originally Posted by JACKinBeantown

Basketball... sure. The Spurs have been in town for 50 years but have played in a terrible location outside of downtown for the past 20. Bring them back downtown along with some rail transit to get people there without their cars (never gonna happen in San Antonio in my lifetime), include some underground parking and neighborhood improvements, and I'm all for it. But not a baseball stadium downtown for a team that doesn't exist.

Oh, and make the Spurs pay for at least 50% of it. They are a private corporation, after all.

I think the baseball talks are for relocating the Missions stadium since a local group just bought them (Weston, Holt, Manu Ginobili/David Robinson/Nolan Ryan, etc), although I don't think this plot is best for that either.

I do like what Charlotte did with their minor league stadium, but I'm not sold on the Fox Tech site either. I think that area should be reserved for new high rises or skyscrapers. Somewhere with a backdrop of the skyline would be cool though.



This spot would be good for a new Spurs arena, but the problem is I'm pretty sure that piece of land across Camden is going to be apartments. I think the AT&T Center lease ends in 2030-ish so it wouldn't surprise me if they started pushing for a new arena around Downtown or out by La Cantera somewhere. The AT&T Center was a huge missed opportunity IMO.

[The Model]

So originally the Spurs arena was supposed to be downtown. The people of San Antonio voted no on it because of a 1/2 cent tax and they were all mad about just doing that for the Alamodome. I really blame the people of San Antonio for the bad location of the AT&T. I know the rodeo got involved and believe me everyone had the same goal and that was to keep the Spurs in San Antonio! Sadly the tax on rental cars and hotels wasn't the plan to build a downtown arena at Victoria Courts or the Alamodome parking lot. I really wish we could have educated the community back then on how amazing we had the opportunity to have a brand new convention center, a fairly new Dome at the time and a Arena all next to each other. On another note I see someone commenting to make the Spurs pay for 50% of the new arena in the future? That is not going to happen and we can't demand that or they Spurs will be in Las Vegas in no time. Las Vegas is currently working on its second Arena on the strip which is weird since there is nothing wrong with the T-Mobile arena that is also fairly new.

[JACKinBeantown]

Originally Posted by The Model

So originally the Spurs arena was supposed to be downtown. The people of San Antonio voted no on it because of a 1/2 cent tax and they were all mad about just doing that for the Alamodome. I really blame the people of San Antonio for the bad location of the AT&T. I know the rodeo got involved and believe me everyone had the same goal and that was to keep the Spurs in San Antonio! Sadly the tax on rental cars and hotels wasn't the plan to build a downtown arena at Victoria Courts or the Alamodome parking lot. I really wish we could have educated the community back then on how amazing we had the opportunity to have a brand new convention center, a fairly new Dome at the time and a Arena all next to each other. On another note I see someone commenting to make the Spurs pay for 50% of the new arena in the future? That is not going to happen and we can't demand that or they Spurs will be in Las Vegas in no time. Las Vegas is currently working on its second Arena on the strip which is weird since there is nothing wrong with the T-Mobile arena that is also fairly new.

Las Vegas Spurs. At least it makes more sense than Utah Jazz.

[Rynetwo]

Originally Posted by The Model

So originally the Spurs arena was supposed to be downtown. The people of San Antonio voted no on it because of a 1/2 cent tax and they were all mad about just doing that for the Alamodome. I really blame the people of San Antonio for the bad location of the AT&T. I know the rodeo got involved and believe me everyone had the same goal and that was to keep the Spurs in San Antonio! Sadly the tax on rental cars and hotels wasn't the plan to build a downtown arena at Victoria Courts or the Alamodome parking lot. I really wish we could have educated the community back then on how amazing we had the opportunity to have a brand new convention center, a fairly new Dome at the time and a Arena all next to each other. On another note I see someone commenting to make the Spurs pay for 50% of the new arena in the future? That is not going to happen and we can't demand that or they Spurs will be in Las Vegas in no time. Las Vegas is currently working on its second Arena on the strip which is weird since there is nothing wrong with the T-Mobile arena that is also fairly new.

So you blame them for their vote on an arena tax? I blame them on voting in stupid council members. One is significantly more important than the other...

[SproutingTowers]

The two ballparks in Austin, Texas and Dell Diamond, and UTSA’s are pointed NE. But Nelson is pointed SE which I would think blind the outfielders. The new stadium should point NE so if downtown and want a skyline view then needs to be SW of downtown. The site I found for the arena would be horrible for baseball where would have a view of I-35.

[Keep-SA-Lame]

Originally Posted by SproutingTowers

a view of I-35.

It's the baseball field view we deserve, though.

[Fireoutofclay]

Originally Posted by The Model

So originally the Spurs arena was supposed to be downtown. The people of San Antonio voted no on it because of a 1/2 cent tax and they were all mad about just doing that for the Alamodome. I really blame the people of San Antonio for the bad location of the AT&T. I know the rodeo got involved and believe me everyone had the same goal and that was to keep the Spurs in San Antonio! Sadly the tax on rental cars and hotels wasn't the plan to build a downtown arena at Victoria Courts or the Alamodome parking lot. I really wish we could have educated the community back then on how amazing we had the opportunity to have a brand new convention center, a fairly new Dome at the time and a Arena all next to each other. On another note I see someone commenting to make the Spurs pay for 50% of the new arena in the future? That is not going to happen and we can't demand that or they Spurs will be in Las Vegas in no time. Las Vegas is currently working on its second Arena on the strip which is weird since there is nothing wrong with the T-Mobile arena that is also fairly new.

The Spurs chose that location. After leaving Hemisfair Arena for the Alamodome, it was understood that they would only be there for a few years while new home would be made for them later. Then the city (Mayor Howard Peak) and the county (Judge Cyndi Krier) offered competing plans. Both plans would use the hotel/motel tax to build the arena. The Spurs chose the county's plan to build on the grounds of the Freeman Coliseum over the city's plan of building next to the Alamodome. But I believe the county offered more incentives to the Spurs, like management, revenue, etc. So the Spurs threw their support over the plan that benefited them more. The entire surrounding area was supposed to be developed, but it never was 😒

I was a teenager at the time, so the details escape me, but I didn't understand why the city and county couldn't come together on a plan that was mutually beneficial

[Restless One]

Originally Posted by Fireoutofclay

The Spurs chose that location. After leaving Hemisfair Arena for the Alamodome, it was understood that they would only be there for a few years while new home would be made for them later. Then the city (Mayor Howard Peak) and the county (Judge Cyndi Krier) offered competing plans. Both plans would use the hotel/motel tax to build the arena. The Spurs chose the county's plan to build on the grounds of the Freeman Coliseum over the city's plan of building next to the Alamodome. But I believe the county offered more incentives to the Spurs, like management, revenue, etc. So the Spurs threw their support over the plan that benefited them more. The entire surrounding area was supposed to be developed, but it never was ������

I was a teenager at the time, so the details escape me, but I didn't understand why the city and county couldn't come together on a plan that was mutually beneficial

Y'all are both right, but the main reason the County location won is that it was actually voted on. I don't remember the DT plan being voted on, but rather the City and the Spurs being scared off by a small but vocal group of an anti-tax citizens. The County option became the only option, and moving the rodeo to a bigger arena was added to appease the people. I believe the DT version would have passed had the City not caved to fear, and actually put it up for a vote.

At one point, both proposals were going to be put up, but again, fears were both would pass, and then what? So the Spurs and the City through in with the County plan.

[SproutingTowers]

Originally Posted by Fireoutofclay

The Spurs chose that location. After leaving Hemisfair Arena for the Alamodome, it was understood that they would only be there for a few years while new home would be made for them later. Then the city (Mayor Howard Peak) and the county (Judge Cyndi Krier) offered competing plans. Both plans would use the hotel/motel tax to build the arena. The Spurs chose the county's plan to build on the grounds of the Freeman Coliseum over the city's plan of building next to the Alamodome. But I believe the county offered more incentives to the Spurs, like management, revenue, etc. So the Spurs threw their support over the plan that benefited them more. The entire surrounding area was supposed to be developed, but it never was ������

I was a teenager at the time, so the details escape me, but I didn't understand why the city and county couldn't come together on a plan that was mutually beneficial

There was also a plan to build at the site near where SA FC plays at. There was also a rendering created showing the old smoke stacks next to it along with retail.

https://www.sportsbusinessjournal.co...best+team&sc=0

[Restless One]

Originally Posted by JACKinBeantown

Basketball... sure. The Spurs have been in town for 50 years but have played in a terrible location outside of downtown for the past 20. Bring them back downtown along with some rail transit to get people there without their cars (never gonna happen in San Antonio in my lifetime), include some underground parking and neighborhood improvements, and I'm all for it. But not a baseball stadium downtown for a team that doesn't exist.

Oh, and make the Spurs pay for at least 50% of it. They are a private corporation, after all.

Went to see comedian Jo Koy this past weekend, and even he mentioned the lousy placement of the arena. }

As for the Spurs, they got out of paying more by convincing anyone that would listen that the proposal would not pass without having the rodeo their too, and so they should have to throw in too.

There are a lot of moving parts as to how the arena was built, and why it is where it is. Even more for the reasons surrounding development never occurred.

[Fireoutofclay]

Originally Posted by SproutingTowers

There was also a plan to build at the site near where SA FC plays at. There was also a rendering created showing the old smoke stacks next to it along with retail.

https://www.sportsbusinessjournal.co...best+team&sc=0

Wow, I remember that, I think lol. Was that location being explored for a good while before it finally fell through? The conversation of Northeast School District having partial ownership rings a bell. Do you remember the Holly Hills plan to redevelop the east side into a sports district? That would have been wild.

[JACKinBeantown]

Originally Posted by Fireoutofclay

Wow, I remember that, I think lol. Was that location being explored for a good while before it finally fell through? The conversation of Northeast School District having partial ownership rings a bell. Do you remember the Holly Hills plan to redevelop the east side into a sports district? That would have been wild.

I grew up near that (went to Madison High School). That was when they were also planning to build the Wurzbach Parkway. While the parkway is a great crosstown highway to have, it inexplicably doesn't connect to I-35, although it gets tantalizingly close. Residents in the are fought against the arena going there because it would have caused ridiculously bad traffic on surface roads that already have heavy traffic.

What ended up going in is Morgan's Wonderland, an NEISD football/track stadium, Toyota Field and lots of practice soccer fields.
https://www.google.com/maps/place/Sa...!4d-98.4945922

[theOGalexd]

January 2023 Streetview updates from some of the projects by the Pearl

Pretty sure this is The Josephine



Encore Lower Broadway



Jefferson Bank

[theOGalexd]

SABJ - "In April, Blueprint Hospitality will begin construction on a hotel at the site of the former CPS Energy headquarters at 145 Navarro St. The 229,000 square foot hotel — part of Marriott's Autograph collection of standalone luxury hotels — will be dubbed the El Portal."

"According to state filings, the firm is planning to build 243 rooms, a full service restaurant on the first floor and a bar/lounge area. Blueprint specializes in refurbishing historic buildings and converting them into hotels, having done similar projects in Fort Worth, St. Louis and Little Rock, Arkansas.

In March 2022, the company outlined plans to turn the adjoining property at 146 Navarro St. into Class A office space

The firm has hired Ohio-based Sandvick Architects as the design team, which also has a track record of adaptive reuse. Construction is scheduled to be completed by the end of September 2024."

[Restless One]

Originally Posted by theOGalexd

SABJ - "In April, Blueprint Hospitality will begin construction on a hotel at the site of the former CPS Energy headquarters at 145 Navarro St. The 229,000 square foot hotel — part of Marriott's Autograph collection of standalone luxury hotels — will be dubbed the El Portal."

"According to state filings, the firm is planning to build 243 rooms, a full service restaurant on the first floor and a bar/lounge area. Blueprint specializes in refurbishing historic buildings and converting them into hotels, having done similar projects in Fort Worth, St. Louis and Little Rock, Arkansas.

In March 2022, the company outlined plans to turn the adjoining property at 146 Navarro St. into Class A office space

The firm has hired Ohio-based Sandvick Architects as the design team, which also has a track record of adaptive reuse. Construction is scheduled to be completed by the end of September 2024."

Guessing that 145 Navarro is the older building, and 146 is the eyesore across the street. Would very much like to see 146 come down, and replaced with something iconic. It's a prime Riverwalk location, across from La Villita.

[Keep-SA-Lame]

Originally Posted by Restless One

Guessing that 145 Navarro is the older building, and 146 is the eyesore across the street. Would very much like to see 146 come down, and replaced with something iconic. It's a prime Riverwalk location, across from La Villita.

https://saheron.com/bh-properties-cp...ransformation/

[Runner]

Sorry if wrong thread. Can someone tell me what’s going to be built on the site of 281 & jones maltsberger? currently a large mass of land.

[Keep-SA-Lame]

Originally Posted by Runner

Sorry if wrong thread. Can someone tell me what’s going to be built on the site of 281 & jones maltsberger? currently a large mass of land.

All the empty land at that intersection is either the Quarry Golf Club, the Olmos Golf Course or part of the Olmos Basin flood plain.

[Restless One]

Originally Posted by Keep-SA-Lame

https://saheron.com/bh-properties-cp...ransformation/

I'm aware of the project, and I still stand against it. It's an ugly building, and it was when built in the eighties. Lipstick on a pig ain't helping it.